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The Dresden Files => DFRPG => Topic started by: Belial666 on June 10, 2010, 06:19:07 AM

Title: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Belial666 on June 10, 2010, 06:19:07 AM
Maybe it's my decade-long brush with DnD and the 3.5 edition's attempt to stat everything. Or maybe it's the human nature to categorize and analyze everything, enhanced by my studies in physics. Whatever it is, I dislike statless things. Unless something is truly omnipotent, it can be statted. After all, if you can assign stats to an explosion that obliterates a solar system IRL, a semi-divine being powerful enough to match an entire country seems miniscule by comparison.

So here's my attempt to stat Ferrovax. We don't know too much about him, true. But we do know the following;
a) He's a dragon, so he breathes fire, has claws and flies. We also can guess the general shape of his true form.
b) His physical form is so vast and overwhelmingly powerful that it would shatter mortal buildings and minds alike.
c) He's a shape-shifter that can at least take human form, most probably other forms too.
d) He has powerful thematically appropriate magical powers. And by powerful, I mean that a casual word can take out the average wizard.
e) He is several thousand years old, comparable at least to some of the old pagan gods.
f) He's powerful enough that Mab would not want to take him on, at least not in a fair fight. So he matches the entire White Council, perhaps more.

From that, here are the stats I came up with. I think they work to acheive the above points, more or less. He can get 16 to 18 shift spells easily, can use spells without mental stress if he taps on the power of his nature, could make up to 90 shift effects he gave everything-if his debt limit is assumed to be equal to his refresh expenditure (a good baseline). Physically, he can flatten a house with a single blow in a bad roll or burn down a skyscraper with his dragonfire. And unless you use at least cruise missiles or senior-council level attacks, you won't even scratch him. And as with most writeups of powerful beings, this is the minimum refresh for what he can do:

Quote
FERROVAX, ELDER DRAGON

High Concept: Fire-breathing lizard demigod
Trouble: The World Passes Me By
Aspects: Older Than Dirt, Pride Goes Before Everything, Polite But Deadly, Divine Mandate

SKILLS:

+8: Might, Conviction, Lore
+7: Discipline, Endurance, Presence
+6: Awareness, Intimidation, Weapons
+5: Resources, Scholarship, Performance
+4: Athletics, Deceit, Contacts
+3: Fists, Empathy, Craftsmanship
+2: Rapport, Survival, Stealth
+1: Driving, Guns, Burglary
(108 pts)

POWERS:


Human Guise [+0]
True Shapeshifting [-4]
Modular Points [-2] When Ferrovax shapeshifts, he may wish to change his wings, might, recovery, speed, size and claws into something else. He effectively has 32 form points. His most usual set of abilities is detailed below.
Wings [-1]
Mythic Might [-6]
Mythic Recovery [-6]
Supernatural Speed [-4]
Titanic Size [-12] Ferrovax takes six whole zones in his true form. He gets the bonuses (and penalties) of hulking size x6.
Car-sized Claws [-3] Ferrovax's claws are weapon 6, in addition to any Might bonuses. Use Weapons instead of fists.
Supernatural Senses [-2] Ferrovax can see the flow of magic, see in the infrared and ultraviolet spectrum, can see spirits and other immaterial beings, can scent as well as the most sensitive animal and both his normal vision and hearing are four times as strong; divide distances from the sources of sounds or sights by 4 to adjudicate whether Ferrovax can hear them.
Godly Toughness [-8]  Ferrovax isn't invulnerable; he merely has armor 1 and divides physical stress by 10 before that armor is applied.
Ancient Intellect [-6] as Mythic Toughness but for Mental stress.
Sponsored Magic: Draconic [-6] Ferrovax can use Draconic magic of his own. Treat as equivalent to Soulfire with the addition that Ferrovax is his own sponsor; debt accrued is beholden to his own nature.
Refinement [-30] +9 to all dragon magic rolls (offence, defense, power, control, complexity, lore). While this works as focus bonuses, Ferrovax doesn't actually need focus items. If he wants to craft enchanted items for whatever reason, he can willingly reduce this bonus to get the equivalent slots.
Presence Overwhelming [-30] The presence of Ferrovax in his true form is so spiritually overwhelming it might crush mortal minds. Up to a distance of two zones from him and to any creature that observes him or links with him via magic, this ability applies; every round on a creature's turn roll discipline vs Ferrovax's Presence. If it fails, it takes the margin as mental stress. If the stress dealt penetrates the creature's armor vs mental attacks (if any) the creature can take no actions for that turn.
Dragonfire [22] At the cost of 1 physical stress (Godly Toughness does not apply), Ferrovax can do a Weapon 20 attack against a zone using his Endurance bonus of +7. By reducing the Weapon rating by 2X he can attack X additional zones. By reducing the Weapon rating by 10, he can waive the stress cost.

Total Refresh -142

P: OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO M: OOOO(OOOOOO) S: OOOO

Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: luminos on June 10, 2010, 06:25:42 AM
yes, but how many investigators does he eat per round?
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Esoteric on June 10, 2010, 06:31:21 AM
When Ferrovax jumps in a lake he doesn't get wet, the lake gets Ferrovax'ed
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Belial666 on June 10, 2010, 06:36:48 AM
Quote
yes, but how many investigators does he eat per round?
Considering he can attack an entire zone at Weapon 10 from afar and 24 zones at once with Presence Overwhelming if he gets close without even expending any effort, probably around the neighborhood of 100d4, if not more. That's without even trying.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: luminos on June 10, 2010, 06:38:44 AM
Quote from: Esoteric on June 10, 2010, 06:31:21 AM
When Ferrovax jumps in a lake he doesn't get wet, the lake gets Ferrovax'ed

Ferrovax's breath can cure cancer, but only in the sense that a pile of ashes doesn't have cancer.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Esoteric on June 10, 2010, 07:57:11 AM
Quote
Ferrovax's breath can cure cancer, but only in the sense that a pile of ashes doesn't have cancer.

There is no such thing as evolution, only a list of beings Ferrovax allows to live.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Jeckel on June 10, 2010, 08:16:07 AM
The powers could use some work, but I agree with the philosophy that plot device level beings can be stated like anything else. Nice to see someone trying something outside the box. :)
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: DominicJ on June 10, 2010, 10:37:26 AM
Quote from: Belial666 on June 10, 2010, 06:19:07 AM
a) He's a dragon, so he breathes fire, has claws and flies. We also can guess the general shape of his true form.
b) His physical form is so vast and overwhelmingly powerful that it would shatter mortal buildings and minds alike.
c) He's a shape-shifter that can at least take human form, most probably other forms too.
d) He has powerful thematically appropriate magical powers. And by powerful, I mean that a casual word can take out the average wizard.
e) He is several thousand years old, comparable at least to some of the old pagan gods.
f) He's powerful enough that Mab would not want to take him on, at least not in a fair fight. So he matches the entire White Council, perhaps more.

Never a fan of Pen and Paper RPG's, so this is a fluffological response.

A-C.  Does he have a "True Form" at all?

D.  He laid Dresden out with his will, but so did
(click to show/hide)
.  He's powerful, but within reason.

F.  That might be a bit of a push.  Mab would *accidentaly* turn the earth into a ball of ice if Titania wasnt matching her strength.  Titanias enforcer can blow a denarian to pieces with little more effort than flicking a finger, and has beaten three senior council members.
Ferrovax might be strong, but he aint a planet killer.

Hell, a Knight of the Cross has offed a Dragon.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: luminos on June 10, 2010, 10:56:11 AM
Quote from: DominicJ on June 10, 2010, 10:37:26 AM
F.  That might be a bit of a push.  Mab would *accidentaly* turn the earth into a ball of ice if Titania wasnt matching her strength.  Titanias enforcer can blow a denarian to pieces with little more effort than flicking a finger, and has beaten three senior council members.
Ferrovax might be strong, but he aint a planet killer.

Hell, a Knight of the Cross has offed a Dragon.

Jim has said on this site that Ferro is one of the few beings able of going toe to toe with Mab, and supposedly said at a book-signing that Ferro is superior to Mab in strength.  

Quote from: Belial666 on June 10, 2010, 06:19:07 AM

a) He's a dragon, so he breathes fire, has claws and flies. We also can guess the general shape of his true form.

I wouldn't be surprised if he had these powers, but the capital D Dragons are not the same thing as the scaly lizards of European legend, but beings of cosmic order (word of Jim).
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Wordmaker on June 10, 2010, 11:36:40 AM
It's also worth noting that Ferrovax is the oldest dragon in the world. Given the nature of the fae, it's arguable that he's actually older than Mab.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: blues.soldier on June 10, 2010, 12:07:57 PM
And Knights of the Cross are, effectively, one giant Catch, thus making them especially built to be dragon-killers. It's like they're made of solid kryptonite and happen to be fighting a guy with a big red S on his outfit.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Wordmaker on June 10, 2010, 12:25:15 PM
I was also going to point out that we don't know how old the dragon was that Michael killed. It's not unreasonable to assume it was weaker than Ferrovax.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: ahunting on June 10, 2010, 12:44:11 PM
I can't really argue its clear the Ferro, is indeed one of the great contenders for All time BA of the Dresden Files world. Now get to work on Odin please.
k thanks!
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: DominicJ on June 10, 2010, 02:31:40 PM
True, not all Dragons are slain equal.

(click to show/hide)

I think he may have talked himself into a corner with that one then.

We've been told that the two Fae Courts fighting themselves into a stalemate keeps the world going round, if Winter or Summer overthrew the other, the effect on the world would be apocalyptic.

The only way Dragons fit into that as equals is if they're something like the great old ones, not of Earth.

Or of course, if the Fae number rather more than we have been led to believe to far, the queens might not be that far above Elder Gruff and co.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Belial666 on June 10, 2010, 02:43:09 PM
Ferrovax himself says those things about his True Form and I assume he has no reason to lie thus his Titanic Size and Presence Overwhelming abilities. Also, it should be noted that while Presence Overwhelming can apply to a big honking area and crush the will of thousands if they are gathered close enough, it's only an attack at +7, +8 if Ferrovax shifts his skills (which he can). Harry Dresden, if he has raised his Conviction to Fantastic by "Changes" and gets a further bonus through being Winter's Knight, could resist it at an average roll. It's not so much a terrifyingly powerful attack -as is his magic or dragonfire- as an attack that works on humongous amounts of people at once. No army of mooks could deal with Ferrovax. You'd need to be at least Dresden level and stronger to even join the fight.

Siriothrax was an idiot and dragons have "Pride goes before Everything". If he was smarter, he'd simply fly over Michael and use his Breath Weapon. It would not matter how awesome Michael's sword was or how skilled the wielder because Michael would never get a chance to use it. That's how you take out Knights-with ranged attacks.

Quote
Now get to work on Odin please.
For Ferrovax, we have quite a few points we can base his abilities on. We don't know that much about Desdenverse Odin yet.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Wordmaker on June 10, 2010, 02:45:01 PM
Remember though that Harry's still a PC, and at the highest campaign level, Submerged, the skill cap is Superb.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Belial666 on June 10, 2010, 04:14:54 PM
Harry at Storm Front was submerged. He could barely take on one lousy demon.
Harry at Death Masks is considerably stronger. One of the weaker Denarians is in his league or just a bit over.
Harry at Dead Beat has grown in power. He almost matches wills with Corpsetaker and captures the Erlking.
Harry in Small Favor kicks serious ass. Magog, Thorned Namshiel, Tessa can attest to that.
(changes spoiler)
(click to show/hide)



So yeah, I doubt he's still anywhere near submerged level.
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Wordmaker on June 10, 2010, 04:26:58 PM
How about some spoiler tags for those of us who haven't finished Changes?

Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Archmage_Cowl on June 10, 2010, 07:47:30 PM
i did my own personal stats for mister ferro, but they use so many house rules you guys would laugh at them so i'll simply say... he's tough. I also statted mab and i made him stronger than mab so yeah... dont mess with mister ferro lol.

P.S. Not sure how this is relevant to the discussion. ;D
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: vultur on June 11, 2010, 08:56:18 PM
Hmm. Personally I'd figure Mab, Titania, Ferrovax and the like at about -50 refresh cost, Lea/Eldest Gruff in the -30 to -40 range (my stats for Leanansidhe came out to -38 Refresh; EG is likely somewhat weaker), and the Faerie Ladies and Senior Council -26 to -30 (the given stats for the latter two seem way low to me).
Title: Re: My take on Ferrovax.
Post by: Belial666 on June 11, 2010, 09:30:09 PM
Except that it would take the entire White Council (Senior+Wardens+all qualified wizards) to overcome Mab or Ferrovax, if they could even do it. That's not only 20 pts of Refresh above them.