Author Topic: Shameless use of the board's creativity  (Read 9704 times)

mythcantor

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Shameless use of the board's creativity
« on: October 12, 2008, 05:34:27 PM »
I'd like to use you all shamelessly.

Basically I've been running an RPG for the last 11 months or so dealing with people who learn to travel between several interconnected worlds, including modern day Earth.  During the last two gaming sessions, the people of Earth became aware of magic when a really powerful ancient bad guy resurrected the ghosts of Earth's dragons from before magic was bound up about two thousand years ago and essentially used it as his powerbase and weapon to take control.

He's gone now, and the dragons are all put away, but magic is back on Earth, many governments crumbled, economic shock has collapsed most businesses, and lots and lots of people are dead from the resurgence of magic (and some magic creatures).  Paranoia and superstition are running rampant, and now those governments that remain know that there are other worlds out there who can essentially pop open doors behind their borders at any time, leading to security ramp-ups on epic scales.  The characters couldn't stay and help put the mess back straight because the bad guy had a lot of other bad things happening in other worlds, but they did get a group of people to start helping magic users not take the left hand path.  Unfortunately, that's about maybe 150 people in this group, operating in secret, with tens of thousands of awakening powerful practicioners worldwide who are mostly trying to hide from fearful cultures and governments.

What I'd like is if people who feel so inclined can come up with some characters and situation to throw into this mess.  The characters won't have to be human, they could have been aware of magic before, or they could be just waking up to it now.  Or, they could still not have magic, but rather just the moxie to do something.  Frankly, I'd just like to shamelessly use your guys' ideas to add a little diversity of thought to my story when the characters get back to paying attention to how things are falling apart and taking new shape on Earth.  I figure, between us, we can come up with a really good back story about what happens worldwide over the next several months.  I do want to clarify, I'm not trying to clandestinely start up a RPG on the side, but rather get some ideas how the world would be affected by such things from more than just my own narrow point of view.

If anyone is interested, I'll post a little more descriptive of a history up here to get started.

(Note: If this belongs in another place, please just let me know)

Offline El Diablo

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2008, 02:00:19 AM »
For a real powerful bad guy to take down - I ran a campaign using third edition rules where I sent wave after wave of magically summoned Ice demons against the heroes. I was continuously reminded by two "rules lawyers" about how summoning cost the mage levels and such.

I was getting around that with the sub story of slaves being delivered to the icy retreat, they were placed in a magical construct and of course, horribly killed to power the device to give the energy to the Caster.

Unfortunately, the magazine "dungeon" ran a story one week before they made it to the lair to fight the bad guy - which coincidentally, had an artifact that did much the same thing.

They went after the slave ships at that point. Bastards.
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mythcantor

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2008, 02:10:30 AM »
For a real powerful bad guy to take down - I ran a campaign using third edition rules where I sent wave after wave of magically summoned Ice demons against the heroes. I was continuously reminded by two "rules lawyers" about how summoning cost the mage levels and such.

I was getting around that with the sub story of slaves being delivered to the icy retreat, they were placed in a magical construct and of course, horribly killed to power the device to give the energy to the Caster.

Unfortunately, the magazine "dungeon" ran a story one week before they made it to the lair to fight the bad guy - which coincidentally, had an artifact that did much the same thing.

They went after the slave ships at that point. Bastards.

Damn.  I hate when unseen, outside forces render assistance to the forces of good.

Offline El Diablo

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #3 on: October 13, 2008, 02:21:50 AM »
S'ok, I tossed a deck of wondrous things on board one of the ships they liberated.

Campaign was voted over by the players shortly after :)
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Offline Kristine

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2008, 06:22:32 PM »
What I'd like is if people who feel so inclined can come up with some characters and situation to throw into this mess.  The characters won't have to be human, they could have been aware of magic before, or they could be just waking up to it now.  Or, they could still not have magic, but rather just the moxie to do something.  Frankly, I'd just like to shamelessly use your guys' ideas to add a little diversity of thought to my story when the characters get back to paying attention to how things are falling apart and taking new shape on Earth.  I figure, between us, we can come up with a really good back story about what happens worldwide over the next several months.  I do want to clarify, I'm not trying to clandestinely start up a RPG on the side, but rather get some ideas how the world would be affected by such things from more than just my own narrow point of view.

If anyone is interested, I'll post a little more descriptive of a history up here to get started.

(Note: If this belongs in another place, please just let me know)

Some cultures never gave up totally in the beliefs of magic and true scientist would just treat this as another form of science subject to different unknown laws. 

Do you have new 'laws' for this magic and is it subject to human belief and history or just are you making it up as you go along?  can anyone pull anything from a mythology or is there guiding principals that work all over the world?

To make sure I (we?) don't take you in a direction you don't want to go, can you give a little more on the principles/protocols you want to follow?
"When I was 5 years old my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when i grew up. I wrote down “Happy”. They told me i didn’t understand the assignment, and I told them they didn’t understand life. "
-John Lennon-

mythcantor

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2008, 07:21:25 PM »
Some cultures never gave up totally in the beliefs of magic and true scientist would just treat this as another form of science subject to different unknown laws. 

Do you have new 'laws' for this magic and is it subject to human belief and history or just are you making it up as you go along?  can anyone pull anything from a mythology or is there guiding principals that work all over the world?

To make sure I (we?) don't take you in a direction you don't want to go, can you give a little more on the principles/protocols you want to follow?

Actually, I typed up something, but I wasn't sure anyone would be interested so I let it rest.  Here is the overview.  Again, this is really really generic and about a tenth of the notes that went into it.  In addition, this is more than the role-players really know.  They, like most of the characters that may come from this in that they had to muddle along.  Hell, one of them had been dabbling in magic for years of story-time but just recently learned to harness it with circles.  This below is what I wrote up.  If there are more questions, let me know please.

Okay... I put together a more in depth overview, but I don't want you guys to have to study for an exam or anything since you are helping me.  I'll post this overview here.  If you want the other, more in depth one, I'll post it elsewhere on the web and give you all a link, since I think its too long for this forums posts.

The basics are broken down into Magic, the Walker, The Journeymen.

Magic

Magic is much like the dverse, but without the training.  People need training, but it doesn't really exist yet.  That said, there is a lot of free flowing power right now.  When people do magic, they use their own power to get it done, but leverage external forces that correspond to the threads of power flowing through all things.  These threads are broken into greater threads (the five elements) and lesser threads which are combinations or pieces of these elements.  All magic users (maybe .1 percent of the people alive have this capability, so in America, that's 300,000 or lots and lots) have affinity to one type of thread or another, or to multiple threads.

Some of the lesser threads are the life thread, specific storm threads (like the nor'easter, el nino, etc). and the color blue, though no one knows why blue gets its own.  The greater threads can do everything a lesser thread can do, but lesser threads often give finer control.  By drawing power from these threads, accessible in anything that has pieces of them, the magic user can work much greater magics, otherwise they draw on their own life force, making themselves tired, and with repeated self-use of magic, aging themselves faster.  Conversely, using magic via the threads causes more magical energy to flow through users and slows their aging, though can still make them tired.

The use of focuses and circles help, but without knowing how to make those, they will have to stumble along.  Those sent to train them are, at best, a little better than they are and for them, magic has always been a personal thing. 

Magical creatures are extemely uncommon and restricted to things like vampires, werewolves, some fey, and the like.  Mostly those things that fed off of life survived, and not those things MADE of magic.  Fey are immortal, but the most powerful (ie the ones that need the most magic to survive) would have faded or left to the Far Reaches.  Give the group some ideas, and if it sounds plausible, cool.  I don't want to fetter creativity.

The Near and Far Reaches are the underlying world.  They are shaped by emotion and belief, but are extremely difficult to get to.  I don't expect that more than a handful would be able to get into them or out.  The Near Reaches were also bound when Magic was bound, and many of their populations moved to the Far Reaches.  The Fey lands essentially died as belief in them faded, and most the Fey created homes in the Far Reaches.  Over time, they may come back, but that will be slow and probably not significant in the scope of this.

The Walker

The Walker, also well known as the Negotiator, less well known as the Betrayer, was a Journeyman of extreme, knocking down buildings and killing with a look, power.  He was very calm in demeanor, could be cruel very easily, but could also be kind to those around him.  He ruled with an iron fist, gloved in down.

He took control of the earth using his Dragons and made statements clear when he destroyed the only nation to refuse servitude to him by having those dragons hunt down all not running to the nearest neighboring countries.  That was Switzerland.

He built an organization of followers, both those coerced and those who were loyal, and used them to run things he could not be there for.  He read the evil overlord list.  He encouraged kindness when violence was unnecessary, but acted succinctly with little concern for life when it was.

Most didn't understand his motivations, and that's still the case.

When magic came back, the Walker was still in command and it mostly worked against him.  Previously, all use of magic was tracked down by Dragons and dealt with, but with so much, that became impossible.  Many died in the initial return of magic and riots that followed a few days later.  Less than a week after magic came back, the Walker disappeared and was presumed to have been killed.

Many governments fell in revolution against the Walkers remaining organization, and many more fell because newly empowered could fight.  The major powers are still there, but many smaller nations have crumbled and economic shock has all but destroyed the international foundations of business.  The world is essentially in a Great Depression and suffering from thousands of homebread insurgencies at the same time, with magic making everything more lively.

The details are where you come in.

The Journeymen

For the most part, the Journeymen won't come into this.  Suffice it to say there are four races of Journeymen, including the Earth Humans, The Cybermen, The Angels (Elys) and the Demons (Abad).  The Angels and the Demons have been fighting a war by proxy on Earth for millenia, but they are not attached to either God or the Devil.  The nature of God and the Devil are still a matter for theology and religion and not a matter of public record.

During Walker's reign, these forces were prevented access to Earth by virtue of an active, continuous pogrom.  They have generally lost their hold, and even with Walker gone, are slow to come back.

Really, this is focusing on the effects of humans on Earth now that magic is back and civilization is holding on by bare threads.

There are twelve other worlds out there, but only Journeymen of the four races mentioned can travel between them.  I'd rather not have a slew of journeymen, because, by their nature, their focus becomes diluted away from just Earth's problems.

Um... that's it.  If we need more details to work out the magic or the history, that's welcome too.  Remember that some things may already be established.  This was the work on an hour (both this and the longer version) to record details that had been preplanned and had sort of cropped up during role-playing.

One more note, this is for consumption by my role-players only.  I don't think I'll write this story down ever and try to publish, but if I do, I'll try to keep from stealing any of your ideas for it.

Offline Kristine

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2008, 08:46:08 PM »
One more note, this is for consumption by my role-players only.  I don't think I'll write this story down ever and try to publish, but if I do, I'll try to keep from stealing any of your ideas for it.
for me personally, I should say that I know half the battle in getting something published is not your idea's but how you execute them.  I've known MANY people with great ideas who couldn't coherently write there way out of a proverbial paper bag. - so, for me anyway, if you see something you like - Use it!  I'd like to receive a copy of the finished published work and a tip of the hat in the acknowlegement page but it's certainly not required.  ;)

Magic is much like the dverse, but without the training.  People need training, but it doesn't really exist yet.  That said, there is a lot of free flowing power right now.  When people do magic, they use their own power to get it done, but leverage external forces that correspond to the threads of power flowing through all things.  These threads are broken into greater threads (the five elements) and lesser threads which are combinations or pieces of these elements.  All magic users (maybe .1 percent of the people alive have this capability, so in America, that's 300,000 or lots and lots) have affinity to one type of thread or another, or to multiple threads....The use of focuses and circles help, but without knowing how to make those, they will have to stumble along.  Those sent to train them are, at best, a little better than they are and for them, magic has always been a personal thing. 
Do magic and Tech conflict like they do in the Dverse or can they be combined?  If emotion and belief can shape magic can a user accidentally shape magic to create something new? (ie. many people anthropomorphize their car - if someone had an earth based power and believed their car had a personality - could it develop one?) 

Does modern tech, like complicated weapons, TV and radio still work?

Are there non-life based powers?  For example the death/spirit based magic.

Because of all the chaos it caused and most human's dislike of change are there major resentment and discrimination against those with magic abilities?  Or are most businesses still trying to do 'business as usual' and the average person's life remains pretty much unchanged?

Magical creatures are extemely uncommon and restricted to things like vampires, werewolves, some fey, and the like.  Mostly those things that fed off of life survived, and not those things MADE of magic.  Fey are immortal, but the most powerful (ie the ones that need the most magic to survive) would have faded or left to the Far Reaches.  Give the group some ideas, and if it sounds plausible, cool.  I don't want to fetter creativity.

The Near and Far Reaches are the underlying world.  They are shaped by emotion and belief, but are extremely difficult to get to. 
Are magical creatures altered humans for the time being or are they races of their own?  Can I become a fey or if bit by a werewolf do I have signs of it in my blood that a hospital can see?

Because modern society is very tech based it is important to know how tech and magic will interact and how far into various sub societies magic can effect.
"When I was 5 years old my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when i grew up. I wrote down “Happy”. They told me i didn’t understand the assignment, and I told them they didn’t understand life. "
-John Lennon-

mythcantor

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #7 on: October 19, 2008, 08:10:06 AM »
Do magic and Tech conflict like they do in the Dverse or can they be combined?  If emotion and belief can shape magic can a user accidentally shape magic to create something new? (ie. many people anthropomorphize their car - if someone had an earth based power and believed their car had a personality - could it develop one?) 

:)
Magic and tech don't conflict in my version, no.  They could be combined, but I'd need specifics on whether things could work. 
Anthropomorphication of a vehicle... transformer style or knight rider style?  It's possible if there is an intense powersource that consistently feeds it.  That's the thing, unless magic is enchanted into an object, which is advanced enough that few will be anywhere near that point yet, it had to be actively done.  It is more akin to evocation at this point.  Magic isn't lasting unless a charm or an enchantment goes in, so adding a personality to an object would be difficult.  The problem is that magic needs to be fed by a powersource and to make it lasting it needs a constant powersource.  A charm is like an enchantment, but lasting only until the initial power is gone.  And enchantment has a piece of the magic worked in to gather more power, but it is difficult to do because an overpowered enchantment can suck a lot more power than you'd want.. 

Quote

Does modern tech, like complicated weapons, TV and radio still work?

Yes, they work.  Nothing has removed tech, just added magic.

Quote
Are there non-life based powers?  For example the death/spirit based magic.

Maybe... give me some suggestions.  Until this point, the answer has been no, but I haven't had any necromancers and spirits or ghosts have been able to be affected by life-based magic.

Quote
Because of all the chaos it caused and most human's dislike of change are there major resentment and discrimination against those with magic abilities?  Or are most businesses still trying to do 'business as usual' and the average person's life remains pretty much unchanged?
Are magical creatures altered humans for the time being or are they races of their own?  Can I become a fey or if bit by a werewolf do I have signs of it in my blood that a hospital can see?

Most businesses are not, but some fo the biggest are.  It's akin to the great depression.  People try to continue on, people try to live, but things just pile up and some people can't survive.  That said, new businesses are developing and the econ will reboot.  this isn't the start of a collapse, just a really bad fall.  Bigotry and bias has always focused on the minorities, so I don't see why not, but there will be differences because of the fear involved.

It is unlikely that a living human could become something else, unless it is the kind of thing that changes that person.  And werewolfism is a disease, so yes.


Quote

Because modern society is very tech based it is important to know how tech and magic will interact and how far into various sub societies magic can effect.


Not sure on the last part of what you mean here, but tech and magic can eventually be blended, but I'm talking about an immediate aftermath period.  Widespread tech/magic hybrids aren't expected in the near run, though small scale work is possible and ideas of what could be are definite pluses.

I hope this helps... since... well... you're helping me.  :)

Offline Guardian 452

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2008, 02:18:11 PM »
Here's an idea...

Granted, some of this comes from things I read online (mostly news items), but how does the church react to this?

It doesn't have to be one specific church, but perhaps a branch of a particular religion.

You could have options from witch hunts (thou shalt not suffer a witch to live) to any number of groups that believe the magic comes from God and it's their mission to convert people.

You could even have new religions forming around particularly powerful magic users.  Imagine if one of these magic users was also a con artist, throw in a little bit of the televangelist mentality and see where it leads...

I could probably flesh some of these out, but you get the idea.

Offline Ambassador of Odd

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #9 on: October 19, 2008, 03:58:22 PM »
This is something I recommend to anyone who ever has to make a villain.  The Villain Workshop.  The author of this masterpiece of evilness is Rich Burlew, and holy crap, it's good.  Er, bad.  Um.  What do you call an excellent bad guy?
Signiture?  But wouldn't I leave ink all over the screen?

Offline The Corvidian

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2008, 05:47:12 PM »
If the power grid is still up, you could have it where some people have figured out how to use electricity to power long term spells.

Here is a resource that might come in handy for you, its called Technomancer. Its a sourcebook published by Steve Jackson Games, as part of the GURPS line.
Clarke's Third Law: Sufficently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Niven's Converse to Clarke's 3rd Law: Sufficently analyzed magic is indistinguishable from science.

Offline The Corvidian

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2008, 05:47:33 PM »
double post
Clarke's Third Law: Sufficently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Niven's Converse to Clarke's 3rd Law: Sufficently analyzed magic is indistinguishable from science.

Offline Kristine

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2008, 06:34:19 PM »
You could have options from witch hunts (thou shalt not suffer a witch to live) to any number of groups that believe the magic comes from God and it's their mission to convert people.

You could even have new religions forming around particularly powerful magic users.  Imagine if one of these magic users was also a con artist, throw in a little bit of the televangelist mentality and see where it leads...
It would also make sense and make for an interesting adversary who has magic and thinks they are the 2nd coming of the messiah - Or a demon who is damned to kill those around them.

Misunderstanding will abound.
"When I was 5 years old my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when i grew up. I wrote down “Happy”. They told me i didn’t understand the assignment, and I told them they didn’t understand life. "
-John Lennon-

mythcantor

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2008, 06:36:46 AM »
It would also make sense and make for an interesting adversary who has magic and thinks they are the 2nd coming of the messiah - Or a demon who is damned to kill those around them.

Misunderstanding will abound.

That's good.  I was working on a character who calls himself Preacher.  He's powerful, and old.  His basic schtick is that he finds those who are sinners and forces them to face their sins and repent.  Those who have repented, whether before or after him, he kills.  This guy is a main badguy for the characters later, and he really believes that he's on a mission from God.  He hasn't involved himself on Earth yet.

Still, a mesiah complex itself would be interesting to see.

If the power grid is still up, you could have it where some people have figured out how to use electricity to power long term spells.

Here is a resource that might come in handy for you, its called Technomancer. Its a sourcebook published by Steve Jackson Games, as part of the GURPS line.

The power grid would be up, so that's possible.  Again, it would be difficult to do, so only a few could get by with it.  That would also lead to people hooking batteries up into their spells later.  However, transforming electricity to life-energy is difficult so who ever learned to do it quickly would have to be pretty skilled... What are you thinking about?  What would this guy do with it?

Here's an idea...

Granted, some of this comes from things I read online (mostly news items), but how does the church react to this?

It doesn't have to be one specific church, but perhaps a branch of a particular religion.

You could have options from witch hunts (thou shalt not suffer a witch to live) to any number of groups that believe the magic comes from God and it's their mission to convert people.

You could even have new religions forming around particularly powerful magic users.  Imagine if one of these magic users was also a con artist, throw in a little bit of the televangelist mentality and see where it leads...

I could probably flesh some of these out, but you get the idea.


heheh Good point... Churches will always react in some way.  I would assume that the Catholic church would react with tripidation, but the other national and international churches would react differently.  Each of the major religions has a 'magic' sect among their number.  Local churches would be more fluid some supporting magic, some suggesting repression, some starting witch hunts, I'd think.  What are your thoughts on it?

It is unlikely that a living human could become something else, unless it is the kind of thing that changes that person.  And werewolfism is a disease, so yes.


Wanted to clarify this.  Werewolfism (the European style) is a disease, so yes, but like any disease it may be years before the diseases causes are isolated.  Like with AIDS, scientists may not be able to even see the virus easily and have to rely on antibody tests.  Spiritualistic werewolves (like some native American tribes) are different since they are just bringing a wolf spirit into the body.

Offline Kristine

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Re: Shameless use of the board's creativity
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2008, 06:34:28 PM »
Still, a mesiah complex itself would be interesting to see.
Modual - Facets - 2 different views of magic from the wrong angles -somewhere in the rural parts of ??? Canada, the US, South America - any of these would be good  - there are 2 rural communities one is fairly poor and is home to a lot of the shadier parts of life while 30-100 miles away is the fairly affluent community where life has always been pretty good.  Each of these communities spawn a fairly powerful magic user who rises to the top and helps save the community from the chaos of the world around them (think Jerico and Newburn if you watched the series Jerico) but their world views give them different ways of expressing their magic, and not being the types to look a gift hourse in the mouth they run with the theme and like attracts like so they gather larger and larger followings.

Neither one are completely 'bad' they are just people acting out what they think is appropriate. 

What started out as the poorer community is now a haven for controled chaos and vice; drugs, prostitution, alcohol, and gambling are easily found (think whole town of biker bars) - they purchase food from the surrounding communities who sell it to them at good prices out of fear of reprisal.  The mage in this rough area is a gun toting, cigar smoking unshaven type who bielives he was the devils chosen to bring rebellion to a society that had become hypocritical and stagnant.  His phylosophy is that humanity forgot how to live life to it's fullest - that getting hurt, and trying every form of pleasure, and learning to make your own mystakes and what works for you is the duty of every human being clawing and fighting his/her way through this life.  Anything less is a cop out and a delusion of safety.

The more affluent area is neat and orderly with large walls around it (started as a gated community) this place is the very picture of clean and lawful.  The main mage in this area is a calm peaceful woman who has a long list of rules (many of them religious) who believes only contemplation and self control will bring the world out of the chaos that has turn everything on it's ear- that she was touched by an angel of God to start the world on it's path to redemption. and though she only allows the more enlightened into the community, she will allow anyone who is willing to follow the rules to live within her protection.

The problem being that the suburbs of these two communities are starting to intersect and war is brewing.  Can the characters stop it - or just watch in horror as these two well meaning poeple kill thousands with their delusions....

[quote author=mythcantor link=topic=9284.msg331247#msg331247 date=1224484606
The power grid would be up, so that's possible.  Again, it would be difficult to do, so only a few could get by with it.  That would also lead to people hooking batteries up into their spells later.  However, transforming electricity to life-energy is difficult so who ever learned to do it quickly would have to be pretty skilled... What are you thinking about?  What would this guy do with it?

heheh Good point... Churches will always react in some way.  I would assume that the Catholic church would react with tripidation, but the other national and international churches would react differently.  Each of the major religions has a 'magic' sect among their number.  Local churches would be more fluid some supporting magic, some suggesting repression, some starting witch hunts, I'd think.  What are your thoughts on it?

Wanted to clarify this.  Werewolfism (the European style) is a disease, so yes, but like any disease it may be years before the diseases causes are isolated.  Like with AIDS, scientists may not be able to even see the virus easily and have to rely on antibody tests.  Spiritualistic werewolves (like some native American tribes) are different since they are just bringing a wolf spirit into the body.
[/quote] There will be preconcieved notions about these people too.  - How about a family of Wares where some think they are inheirently evil and try to fight it and lothe it others who revel in the freedom of being an animal and the whole family has to hide from a town they are sure will not understand.
"When I was 5 years old my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when i grew up. I wrote down “Happy”. They told me i didn’t understand the assignment, and I told them they didn’t understand life. "
-John Lennon-