Author Topic: The Law and novella  (Read 25223 times)

Offline Mira

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #90 on: May 14, 2022, 08:20:26 PM »
That is true, I never thought of that because the actor of the show is not so tall.
Anyways, I am sure an eventual reboot won't have Harry carrying a hockey stick. I think they are going with a magical solution where Harry's staff can magically shrink to appear as a normal walking cane or even more, to something that can be hidden in normal clothes.

I think that could work.  I think Elaine uses that kind of staff doesn't she?  I seem to remember hers is folded up when not in use in her purse.  Harry could keep his staff as well as his blasting rod in his coat pocket.

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #91 on: May 14, 2022, 08:25:03 PM »
Nah Harry has always been out and proud as a wizard. They will go with that.

Although Jim might have to fight them about the hat.

Offline g33k

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #92 on: May 14, 2022, 08:45:02 PM »
I think that could work.  I think Elaine uses that kind of staff doesn't she?  I seem to remember hers is folded up when not in use in her purse.  Harry could keep his staff as well as his blasting rod in his coat pocket.
The staff is Harry's (the most-coomon, I think, for Euro-wizards) "multi-toool."

Elaine, I think, uses a chain; though her precise magical habits are less-clearthan Harry's, and the chain might be more like Harry's blasting-rod, a combat-specific tool.

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #93 on: May 14, 2022, 10:57:25 PM »
Elaine whilst advertising as a wizard is still trying to fly under the White Council radar, a staff would be a dead giveaway, even Carlos might suspect she had bamboobzled him. Harry on the other hand was a white Council wizard, it would be expected, neatly as much as the beard.

Elaine’s advert may come back to haunt her, the White Council specifically forbade Harry to advertise himself as a Wizard when they booted him out, I can’t see them not cracking down on Elaine, a bunch of old men would prefer to pick a fight with Elaine rather than Harry. I am afraid she will end up being declared a warlock.

In spite she might just adopt a staff but re-invent it to de-masculinise it, to show she is just as much as a wizard as they are.

Besides the spear of destiny would just look weird on a hockey stick.


Offline g33k

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #94 on: May 15, 2022, 05:47:30 PM »
... Elaine’s advert may come back to haunt her, the White Council specifically forbade Harry to advertise himself as a Wizard when they booted him out, I can’t see them not cracking down on Elaine, a bunch of old men would prefer to pick a fightwith Elaine rather than Harry.

I had gotten the impression Elaine had gone over to more or less full-time Paranet operations.  She may not have the advert any more!

 
... I am afraid she will end up being declared a warlock ...
I think they really prefer to have evidence of black magic.  That we have heard of, from Harry's POV, we don't see any.

OTOH, if they realize she was DuMorne's student, who has been hiding for over a decade -- secretly operating as a wizard, and deceiving the Warden who came to test her -- that probably looks like "evidence" to them.

HOWEVER... I am one of those fans who think Elaine isn't as good as Harry thinks she is.  I suspect she was the Nemfection-vector who got to Aurora.
 

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #95 on: May 15, 2022, 07:06:22 PM »
Elaine can’t do much on the Paranet as she suffers the same technology restrictions of all Wizards. I would imagine a large part of what she does is troubleshooting for paranetters too afraid of Harry to ask for his help, the rest IS the paying the pro wizard gig. She lives in LA so plenty of clients from a phone book ad. This is 2014 after all.

Basically after Harry the White Council are going to be seeing Warlocks everywhere and seeking to make an example out of everyone they can i.e. everyone NOT Harry, because they are afraid of him and will wait for the Blackstaff to recover. Even Binder may be at risk, as is everyone Morgan would routinely harass.

Elaine may indeed have been a Nemfection Vector, but that does nor make her nemesis. There is something unexplained in her backstory, what did she trade to Summer for their protection? They can no more ‘give’ protection than Winter, they can trade it though. Her service to Summer does not seem enough based upon the lesser protection Lea gave to Harry.

Elaine could only be nemfected if she was not a Starborn. Justin may have been interested in her to use her as a disease vector for Summer, she may not have been aware, after Harry killed Justin nemfected Elaine carried out that part of the plan. Same way the knife was used on Lea to infect Winter.

Now Nemesis has used its host to deliberately become pregnant before with Justine. What if that was the plan?, a pregnant Elaine would throw herself on Summer using her baby, a child of two powerful wizards as bait to get close to the Summer Lady, the ultimate target of that scheme.

The events of Justin’s death took place around 1991. Any child would likely have been born in 1992. That child (effectively owned by Summer ) would have just turned 21 in 2014 the furthest forward in the narrative we are. The old Summer Knight would have known, but he was killed by the old Winter Knight Lloyd Slate, who was working with Aurora. They wanted to capture the Mantle and pour its energy into Winter, but what if a secondary reason was to kill a potential source of information ? Ruel lived in Chicago, he might bump into Harry and have accidentally disclosed the Elaine/Nemesis connection without realising what it was.

That’s my conspiracy theory of the day.

Offline g33k

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #96 on: May 16, 2022, 05:26:14 AM »
Elaine can’t do much on the Paranet as she suffers the same technology restrictions of all Wizards. 

Well... kind of.

First:  I don't think "all wizards" suffer the same.

Harry's magical Gift is unusually strong, and he's not much into subtlety & delicacy.  Elaine isn't as powerful, but is *MUCH* better with subtlety & delicacy.  I'm sure she can manage more with tech than Harry can.

That said... I doubt she could be very active "on" the Paranet (i.e. the internet), you're spot-on there!

Still, she might be able (for example) to sit back and watch a big-screen monitor from 30 feet away, and have a mundane or a weak-talent person operate the computer on her behalf...

###

HOWEVER, she can do a tremendous amount for them on the magical side of things.  She can disseminate a solid, shared, theoretical foundation, instead of hardscrabble hedge-witchery lineal-descent oral traditions.

She can teach what methods the Paranetters are capable of using, and better ways to spot young talents, train them, etc.

She can give them safety-courses -- less-known (but not less-common) things to watch out for, etc.

But more than anything else, she can act as a nexus for everyone else to rally 'round -- Elaine isn't part of ANY of their groups, so they don't have to fear favoritism.


... Elaine could only be nemfected if she was not a Starborn ...

I don't think that's clear at all.

Justin had Elaine enthralled; but (even with Elaine-thrall to help) failed to capture Harry's mind.

We saw Harry immobilized by Outsider magic in the Raith Deeps; only the secret knowledge of a Fallen Angel helped him break free; no Lasciel in that scene = dead Harry.

I think Young-Elaine was vulnerable, and could have fallen to Nemfection... possibly Justin even infected her!

But also -- in the post-Justin time, but before she found Summer -- her psychic shields would have been in shambles(*) and a powerful assault could have broken her.
(*) - I think Justin deliberately didn't teach much psychic-defense, so he could take them easier; remember how much Harry & Molly had to figure out by trial & error!

I wonder if Elaine isn't Nemfected, still!

... What if that was the plan?, a pregnant Elaine would throw herself on Summer using her baby, a child of two powerful wizards as bait to get close to the Summer Lady, the ultimate target of that scheme.
...
The old Summer Knight would have known, but he was killed by the old Winter Knight Lloyd Slate, who was working with Aurora. They wanted to capture the Mantle and pour its energy into Winter, but what if a secondary reason was to kill a potential source of information ? Ruel lived in Chicago, he might bump into Harry and have accidentally disclosed the Elaine/Nemesis connection without realising what it was.

That’s my conspiracy theory of the day.

Oooo.
That's a doozy!  I don't much LIKE that plan.  But it has a certain screw-Harry-over morbidity to it, that I fear might appeal to Jim in one of his more-twisted moods.  And it gives Harry a "Mordred" figure, an "illicit" fairy-nurtured child who has been raised to oppose him.  That sort of folkloric link is like catnip for Puss-in-Butcher...

... The events of Justin’s death took place around 1991. Any child would likely have been born in 1992. That child (effectively owned by Summer ) would have just turned 21 in 2014 the furthest forward in the narrative we are.
Except that the Faeries are utterly capable of using time-flow in the Nevernever to tweak things however they want.  If Jim is going with this, Harry's "21-year-old" son could be anything from a newborn, to an old man...

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #97 on: May 16, 2022, 11:58:41 AM »
Wizards only start to slow their aging in their forties, Elaine hadn’t slowed, so she was in a one to one time flow, as would presumably be any child.

Of course Harry killing the Queen of Summers child without any apparent retaliation is suspicious, does she know something Harry doesn’t?

Offline Snark Knight

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #98 on: May 16, 2022, 01:47:09 PM »
There was a WOJ about he's done with surprise family relations as of Thomas, Eb and Maggie.

Anything could have been one of the necessary lies to protect a narrative surprise, but that seems like an odd one to actively mislead on rather than just evade.

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #99 on: May 16, 2022, 02:31:25 PM »
There was a WOJ about he's done with surprise family relations as of Thomas, Eb and Maggie.

Anything could have been one of the necessary lies to protect a narrative surprise, but that seems like an odd one to actively mislead on rather than just evade.

You forgot Bonea (don’t worry so does Jim)

Yes and Jim lies, sometimes in black and white (cough two versions of Christmas Eve).

A firstborn son would be a dreadful thing to dangle over Harry, and these Fae they do love a firstborn.

Offline g33k

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #100 on: May 16, 2022, 06:15:45 PM »
Wizards only start to slow their aging in their forties, Elaine hadn’t slowed, so she was in a one to one time flow, as would presumably be any child.
But if Elaine surrendered the babe, it could have been whisked off to a very time-dilated bit of the Nevernever.  Elaine's experience of aging need not be related to the child's.

... Of course Harry killing the Queen of Summers child without any apparent retaliation is suspicious, does she know something Harry doesn’t?
Titania has admitted that it had to be done (but that she hates Harry anyway).  The possibility of future vengence still seems like a "clear and present danger!"  Enacting a child-snatching to use tit-for-tat & eye-for-eye against Harry (for killing her own daughter), however, suggests that she foresaw Harry killing Aurora, which only happened because Aurora got Nemfected...

... A firstborn son would be a dreadful thing to dangle over Harry, and these Fae they do love a firstborn.
Yes they do!!!  (and yes, it would be)

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #101 on: May 16, 2022, 07:24:54 PM »
But if Elaine surrendered the babe, it could have been whisked off to a very time-dilated bit of the Nevernever.  Elaine's experience of aging need not be related to the child's.
Titania has admitted that it had to be done (but that she hates Harry anyway).  The possibility of future vengence still seems like a "clear and present danger!"  Enacting a child-snatching to use tit-for-tat & eye-for-eye against Harry (for killing her own daughter), however, suggests that she foresaw Harry killing Aurora, which only happened because Aurora got Nemfected...
Yes they do!!!  (and yes, it would be)

I would presume Elaine would raise the child up until she was released back into the world. That would give Aurora an angry teenager to work with. Perfect. Which Titania  would inherit. Lily then become Summer Lady so never the brightest spark, neither she nor Fix were told. With Sarissa as Summer Lady she is far more likely to ferret out any nasty secret, but if so is likely to be put under a geas.

To be fair if this is correct then Summer took Harry’s child before he took Summers. Elaine bargained without Harry’s rights being taken into account. The Summer Court is a matriarchy. I wonder if we see an Aurora v Harry battle and whether Sarissa becomes Summer Queen.

Offline g33k

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #102 on: May 16, 2022, 07:57:11 PM »
...
Yes and Jim lies, sometimes in black and white (cough two versions of Christmas Eve) ...

Hmmm ... ?
D'you mean the Molly-POV one, beginning from when she departs from Harry?

And where's the "Jim lies" bit?  Not that I disbelieve you... I just didn't see it.

Offline g33k

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #103 on: May 16, 2022, 08:14:13 PM »
I would presume Elaine would raise the child up until she was released back into the world ...
I wouldn't presume that; not at all!

A bunch of the folklore has faeries taking very small children, toddlers, etc; sometimes even babies from cradles.

Elaine may have given the child up at birth ("a life for a life" protection).  Which is a nifty reversal -- Margaret LeFay bargained to get protection for Harry; this hypothetical child was bargained-away to get protection for the mother...

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: The Law and novella
« Reply #104 on: May 16, 2022, 08:46:49 PM »
Hmmm ... ?
D'you mean the Molly-POV one, beginning from when she departs from Harry?

And where's the "Jim lies" bit?  Not that I disbelieve you... I just didn't see it.

There were two versions of Christmas Eve. The first version published on his website before Battle Ground has Harry describing himself as a Wizard of the White Council, the second version published in Battle Ground has Harry describing himself as the Wizard of Chicago.

A lie pure and simple in black and white.