Demonreach, Ley lines, and Harry's connection

[EBRIEN]

A thought...Harry is able to bind Ethniu in Battleground on the shores of Lake Michigan and he says that's the extent/limit of his reach. Alfred's power interacts with Harry's now giving his shield, energy, whatever a green tint. If the island and it's prisoners are the source of the ley line energy in the world, and Alfred is the island (hmmm...), shouldn't Harry be able to do a binding from anywhere the ley lines are regardless of his proximity to the island?

[Mira]

A thought...Harry is able to bind Ethniu in Battleground on the shores of Lake Michigan and he says that's the extent/limit of his reach. Alfred's power interacts with Harry's now giving his shield, energy, whatever a green tint. If the island and it's prisoners are the source of the ley line energy in the world, and Alfred is the island (hmmm...), shouldn't Harry be able to do a binding from anywhere the ley lines are regardless of his proximity to the island?

He might, but he may not be ready to handle that kind power without doing great harm.  Remember  what Rashid told him about the ley lines and his warning to Harry about them in Turn Coat.  First he tells Harry that the island is the source of the power for the ley line, though at that moment neither he nor Harry knew about the underground prison or it's contents.  If the source of the power for the ley line is indeed the monsters, evil gods, etc with in the prison, it's source while powerful, is also very dark.   

Then Rashid warns Harry about them; page 299

The Gatekeeper shook his head.  May I offer you two bits of advice?"
I nodded.
"First," he said, "do not tap into the power of this place's well.  You are years away from being able to handle such a thing without being altered by it."

The other bit had nothing to do with the ley line, but the reason why Harry was there so I'm omitting it.  Here is a thought, if Kemmler was the last Warden of Demonreach before Harry, did he try to tap into the dark power of the ley line and was altered and transformed into the evil Kemmler?

[EBRIEN]

Ooooooh! I like that reference. (And I'm in a reread cycle one away from TurnCoat). So, years away...it's technically been years (7 in book years, I think...more if you include actual time between release dates). I wonder how he'd handle it now. And I wonder how the Winter Knight mantle would react to the power? Dresden the Unstoppable!

[Ed0517]

A thought...Harry is able to bind Ethniu in Battleground on the shores of Lake Michigan and he says that's the extent/limit of his reach. Alfred's power interacts with Harry's now giving his shield, energy, whatever a green tint. If the island and it's prisoners are the source of the ley line energy in the world, and Alfred is the island (hmmm...), shouldn't Harry be able to do a binding from anywhere the ley lines are regardless of his proximity to the island?

Could have voltage drop. Maybe Alfred can still have enough power for Ethnieu at the waterfront. Maybe he can cage Mab in Joliet.  Lesser targets further out. Sort of like why your 100' extension cord is thicker than the 25'. Heavier gauge wire. Also why you do things at nexus points - because you want to be close to the point of power. Chichen Itza and Edinburgh are at noted nexuses.

And I think Demonreach is the source of THAT line. I think there are numerous lines.

[Mira]

Ooooooh! I like that reference. (And I'm in a reread cycle one away from TurnCoat). So, years away...it's technically been years (7 in book years, I think...more if you include actual time between release dates). I wonder how he'd handle it now. And I wonder how the Winter Knight mantle would react to the power? Dresden the Unstoppable!

Yeah, well, I can understand that I am in the reread process myself, however I have a stack of other books I am reading through so a Dresden File reread book comes up about once a year, though I've read several of them several times.  That passage happens to be one of my favorites because Rashid is one of my favorite characters.  Another interesting bit in that book is the bit when Harry reads one of Eb's journal entries it's on page 379, it talks about how Harry has no clue as to what he has gotten himself into as far as the island goes.  What's odd is, Eb says that Rashid says to warn Harry about the island would be pointless, yet didn't Rashid just do that very thing by telling Harry not to pull power from that ley line? 

Eb also speaks of a higher power "arranging things" in spite of what they try to do.  Eb talks about the "mantle" I assume of Warden of Demonreach, yet until the end of Ghost Story beginning of Cold Days Harry has no clue that he had just acquired a mantle, the Merlin wants him under surveillance and at that point anyway no one is willing to tell Harry what it is he had just done, or gotten himself into job wise.

However the more I think about it now, given the above passage, and the knowledge that Kemmler was the Warden of Demonreach before Harry, it explains what happens at the end of Battle Ground.
The Council isn't afraid of Harry because he is the Winter Knight, they are afraid because he is the Warden of Demonreach.  That little demo of binding Ethniu and having her dragged away from a distance scared the hell out of them, they think he used the power of the island ley line to do that and could do even more if he took a mind to do it.  Which no doubt he could, if he had to, now it all makes sense, at least to me.  Which begs another question about the ley line, I'm thinking now that Alfred is the ley line.

[Ed0517]

That little demo of binding Ethniu and having her dragged away from a distance scared the hell out of them, they think he used the power of the island ley line to do that and could do even more if he took a mind to do it. 

Or even scarier - what if he did it WITHOUT using the line. He jailed a Titan without even using his last power-up.  And now SHE is a weapon. His weapon.

Assume if Mai or LTW know Harry is Eb's grandson.  They at least know he was under eb's observation. That day at Demonreach,  Harry looked massively outgunned, and the best battle mage on the planet, the Blackstaff,  advised not seeking a fight with him, saying he was a fair hand in a fight. Against 5 wardens and two other senior councils?  Can they wonder what they may not know? What Eb may? Maybe LtW assumes Eb would tell him. Doubt Mai would assume he tells her everything. 

For that matter, if Eb falls.. wonder what the Blackstaff could do if IT could tap the Demonreach ley line ?

[Mira]

For that matter, if Eb falls.. wonder what the Blackstaff could do if IT could tap the Demonreach ley line ?

I think it could, but question then becomes would a binding have to be accepted by the island first or not?  Like I believe Harry could use the Blackstaff to tap the ley line, but could someone else not a Warden of the island?

[The_Sibelis]

I think it could, but question then becomes would a binding have to be accepted by the island first or not?  Like I believe Harry could use the Blackstaff to tap the ley line, but could someone else not a Warden of the island?

of course. Remember the ley lines begin at the island, the extend at least through Chicago. Iirc the necromancers were using them. Harry, on the island would be able to subsidize his power draw is the main difference.

[Second Aristh]

of course. Remember the ley lines begin at the island, the extend at least through Chicago. Iirc the necromancers were using them. Harry, on the island would be able to subsidize his power draw is the main difference.

Didn't Nicodemus's crew use it to contain the Archive as well (post-kidnapping)?  Luccio's map of leylines helped Harry figure out where to go looking, or something like that.

[seanham]

I like the ley line connection. I said in a thread a while ago that there must be some way for Wardens to jail monsters because bringing them all to the Island is not reasonable. But bringing them to a nexis point is reasonable.

[Mira]

I like the ley line connection. I said in a thread a while ago that there must be some way for Wardens to jail monsters because bringing them all to the Island is not reasonable. But bringing them to a nexis point is reasonable.

Perhaps, but not advisable because of the danger of the power itself.  Remember in Peace Talks when Harry asked Alfred about his range for collecting Ethniu, he said it was the edge of the lake.  Now possibly if he drew on the ley line power, it would have been much easier, fewer would have died etc., but that didn't happen.  It wasn't even explored by Harry or suggested by Alfred, even though it was vital that Ethniu be locked up and as quickly as possible.  So  that says it either the power cannot be drawn upon by the Warden from anywhere or the consequences of doing that are too heavy.

[Second Aristh]

I like the ley line connection. I said in a thread a while ago that there must be some way for Wardens to jail monsters because bringing them all to the Island is not reasonable. But bringing them to a nexis point is reasonable.

On the Island, they get summoned there, right?  Seems like a better idea that way.  Ethniu was probably too big to properly summon (order of magnitude bigger than Titania, and she shattered Harry's circle in CD).  Once they're there, Alfred can take them downstairs.

I don't think the Warden went out to collect monsters typically.

[Mira]

On the Island, they get summoned there, right?  Seems like a better idea that way.  Ethniu was probably too big to properly summon (order of magnitude bigger than Titania, and she shattered Harry's circle in CD).  Once they're there, Alfred can take them downstairs.

I don't think the Warden went out to collect monsters typically.

Maybe not, but they were gathered up and somehow bond and put in cells.  Now it could be that the vast majority of them were taken and jailed in Merlin's time.  He may have done it first, then built the prison around them.

[morriswalters]

You haven't crossed the biggest hurdle for Merlin to put them in there.  What was someone from medieval England doing building demon prisons in Chicago to put Gods and Monsters in?  Even the Norse didn't get that far inland.  And it was a Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court not Harry. 

[Mira]

You haven't crossed the biggest hurdle for Merlin to put them in there.  What was someone from medieval England doing building demon prisons in Chicago to put Gods and Monsters in?  Even the Norse didn't get that far inland.  And it was a Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court not Harry.

The impression I got from Cold Days was that Merlin built the island long before Chicago was even thought of..  Would have to go back and reread that bit, but I seem to remember that when Merlin built it, it was done in multidimensional times including before the ice ages..