Wild WAG Sunday

[morriswalters]

Here we have a secret that a lot of people know about Harry.  The question is why won't they tell him, isn't it? In fiction that can only mean one thing. Whatever is going to happen will be interfered with if Harry finds out early. It reeks of time travel.  

Another interesting idea(to me) is the castle.  Why introduce it?  And why place it at Harry former home? Was Jim laying foundations? The Marcone's vault was the key to opening a portal into Hades domain. Is the Castle the key to opening a portal somewhere else?

What kept Mab from marrying Lara? Think about this one. Is Lara Mab's  mortal child?

“Not possible,” Mab said. “If it was work I could do myself, I would.” Which . . . I believed, actually. “Why not?” “Certain aspects of my power have to do with choices I made when I was mortal,” she said. “There would be . . . compatibility issues. This is part of the task the Knight was designed for.”

Butcher, Jim. Battle Ground (Dresden Files) (p. 395). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

Did Mab have a child with Papa Raith?  Jim reuses ideas and Margaret did leave Thomas to his own devices. That would be one hell of a compatibility issue.

I got a ton.

[Arjan]

Here we have a secret that a lot of people know about Harry.  The question is why won't they tell him, isn't it? In fiction that can only mean one thing. Whatever is going to happen will be interfered with if Harry finds out early. It reeks of time travel.  

Another interesting idea(to me) is the castle.  Why introduce it?  And why place it at Harry former home? Was Jim laying foundations? The Marcone's vault was the key to opening a portal into Hades domain. Is the Castle the key to opening a portal somewhere else?

Harry needs a home in Chicago. It needs to be cool and defensible and it needs space for allies.

What kept Mab from marrying Lara? Think about this one. Is Lara Mab's  mortal child?Did Mab have a child with Papa Raith?  Jim reuses ideas and Margaret did leave Thomas to his own devices. That would be one hell of a compatibility issue.

I got a ton.

The same reason Molly can't have sex. It has all to do with the maiden-mother-crone complex. She has a role in winter and she can not abandon it. It would harm the story and so endanger the whole of fairy. Also her mantle would probably stop her.

[Mira]

The same reason Molly can't have sex.

Or is limited as to whom she can have sex with.  Either Mab had her daughters before she became Winter Lady, then Queen, or she was able to have sex with a select few.  Ritual or not, Mab had sex with Harry when he became her Knight, or rather he mated with Winter.  It could be if it was during her fertile time, Maeve and Sarissa were the product of Mab and some other Winter Knight's mating.

[Arjan]

Or is limited as to whom she can have sex with.  Either Mab had her daughters before she became Winter Lady, then Queen, or she was able to have sex with a select few.  Ritual or not, Mab had sex with Harry when he became her Knight, or rather he mated with Winter.  It could be if it was during her fertile time, Maeve and Sarissa were the product of Mab and some other Winter Knight's mating.

Mab obviously can have sex as a winter queen because she is not the maiden and not the crone but there are restrictions caused by her role.

Lara is not really father material.

[Snark Knight]

Maeve and Sarissa were the product of Mab and some other Winter Knight's mating.

There was a WOJ that their father was a "famous Austrian composer" ... and I don't think any of them went down in history as notably brutal figures.

[Mira]

There was a WOJ that their father was a "famous Austrian composer" ... and I don't think any of them went down in history as notably brutal figures.

Which begs the question, was Mab, Queen then?  Or not?

[morriswalters]

Harry needs a home in Chicago. It needs to be cool and defensible and it needs space for allies.

Castles are a pain to heat.  And they're expensive to maintain. The Brownies are going to want a raise. Which is why a castle would be up for sale. But it was obvious in Ghost Story that the castle was going to end up in Harry's hands.  answer too ordinary.

Per the quote I gave you whatever it is happened while she was still mortal and as such has nothing to do with her being Mab.

[Arjan]

Castles are a pain to heat.

Gargoyles, winter knigts and spirits of intellect don't mind.

But Marcone and his associates did so I think some of the rooms are well heated and isolated.

And they're expensive to maintain. The Brownies are going to want a raise.

De brownies were summer and Lilly's. They are gone now.

Which is why a castle would be up for sale. But it was obvious in Ghost Story that the castle was going to end up in Harry's hands. Answer too ordinary.

Even more when he discovered his lab was still there.

Per the quote I gave you whatever it is happened while she was still mortal and as such has nothing to do with her being Mab.

It had to do with the choices she made as a mortal which resulted in becoming Mab. But her children she got when she was Mab. They were only a few hundred years old and Mab is much older. She could and maybe even had to get them when she became queen.

[Mira]

Castles are a pain to heat.

A guy who used to take cold showers in the dead of Chicago's winter wouldn't be bothered by lack of heat, but his little girl might be...

[Yuillegan]

Agree about the time travel stuff.

One the one hand, Jim is always looking for new ways to torture Harry and create more problems. So undoubtedly the castle will factor in that somehow. On the other hand, Jim clearly felt it was time for Harry and his daughter to have a home again. It's part of the same idea that says Harry should also be a good, full-time Dad whilst also saving the world. Superman but also a farmer, type thing. Whether you agree with it or not (and I know the Maggie stuff is controversial in the fandom, particularly Harry now being her full-time Dad) this is almost certainly going to be a part of it. The Castle will be there at least until the BAT I am sure. Whether Harry lives there the whole time is another matter.

The Mab is Lara's mother stuff would be just crazy. But interesting. I think I need to hear more to be convinced. Any other evidence for it?

[morriswalters]

Not a lick other than what I cited. Mostly just me juggling pieces of the books and tossing random interesting thoughts into the fray. Using the phrase "compatibility issue" is kind of strange, as is the fact that it was from a choice she made as a mortal.

Then there is this.

tension-tightened faces. “Old woman,” Corb taunted. “I remember you as a bawling brat. I remember your pimply face when you rode with the Conqueror. I remember how you wept when Merlin cast you out.” Mab’s face . . . . . . twisted into naked, ugly, absolute rage. Her body became so rigid, so immobile, that it could not possibly have belonged to a living thing. “Tell me,” Corb purred. “If he was yet among the living, do you think he would still love you? Would he be so proud of what you’ve become?”

Butcher, Jim. Peace Talks (Dresden Files) (pp. 278-279). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

So Mab and Merlin were a thing. Yet he cast her out, for what?  Having a child with a succubus?

Cold Days pretty much lays out the blueprint for time travel as Jim apparently sees it. Branching time and the multiverse.  He has Odin imply that this has all happened before.  It may be a Groundhog Day type of loop or something like it and in a WOJ Jim says he's going to use the time travel book to fix the continuity issues.

The castle is a perfect takeoff point for time travel through portals. If it is Merlin's castle then the portal affinity would be there is you assume that Harry will go back and become Merlin.  The set pieces would be Eb's death and Harry coming into possession of Merlin's diaries.  The reveal of the true nature of Bonea. 

A short ride through my nightmare. 

(click to show/hide)

At a moment in the last book when all hope appears to be lost Harry escapes through a portal to the past sent by Mab or Bonea. The reveals in Merlin's diaries and the aid of Bonea will be the keys to what he has to do. Bonea will be the guide to creating Demonreach in prehistory along with Odin and in doing so she will hatch the plan to eliminate the Old Gods and become the Archive. She will gift to Harry her gift of languages.  He will sleep in Demonreach as he goes back to the future appearing at the key points in the Story to do whatever Jim needs him to do. Harry builds the castle on Demonreach Island and later moves it to await Marcone.

He fixes LC in Proven Guilty, warns himself that the Hobs will attack in Small Favor and are agents of Winter and is probably the genesis of Mab's snow scene showing Marcone's kidnapping. Jim must have been on a Calvin and Hobbes kick at the writing.

Once Harry Prime is gone Merlin will appear.  Mab will be revealed as Harry's true love and will meet the fate of his other loves when she is back stabbed by Molly who will complete her trip to evil. And so on.

[Yuillegan]

Yes, was definitely an odd turn of phrase and a big hint.

The quote you use always made me think that Mab originally was Morgan Le Fey. Morgan and Merlin always had a bit of a tumultuous relationship after all...according to some version he was her master and teacher of magic. Which would fit some of her feelings she seems to have for him. Perhaps she went too far trying to do the right thing...and even though Merlin ended up accepting it he was horrified by her and banished her as punishment. Who knows?

I think you're right about Cold Days. We won't get anymore information on all that until Mirror Mirror of course, but the foundations are in place. I expect Jim will attempt to fix the issues but I am not going to get overly optimistic about his chances. It would be difficult for ANY author and he has to do it in such a way as to not create even more errors. Not that I am upset about this. It's just part of dealing with big works of fiction.

I think you're on the money about the castle.

I...am not sure what to think about your nightmare. I think part of my brain immediately attempted to reject it. On the other hand you could well be right. It makes a sort of sick sense. I don't yet know if I like it or not...I'll probably have to see it done (if that's what happens) to see how I really feel. The only quibble is Harry in Demonreach. I have zero idea why he would talk to a past version of himself in a British accent. And then be so unlike himself to his future self. Vadderung is more like a future Harry in his mannerisms than the Prisoner. At least that's my reading.

[morriswalters]

Harry in Demonreach would know what's coming and what price he will pay and what his choices will cost him. Jim foreshadowed Molly's possible fall from grace and in the end I think she will backstab Mab for giving Lara what she can't have.  This possibility was foreshadowed when Harry soul gazed her.

The last reflection of Molly wasn’t the girl. Oh, it looked like Molly, externally. But the eyes gave it away. They were flat as a reptile’s, empty. She wore all black, including a black collar, and her hair had been dyed to match. Though she looked like Molly, like a human being, she was neither. She had become something else entirely, something very, very bad.

This sounds a lot like Mab's judgement form.  Another of the other things he sees in the soul gaze is the Molly like this.

One was an emaciated version of Molly, as though she’d been starved or strung out on hard drugs, her eyes aglow with an unpleasant, fey light.

Which of course foreshadowed Ghost Story.

I think he's coming back to try and do at least three things, save the mortal who became Mab, save Molly and fill Demonreach in the final showdown in the Bat.

[Arjan]

Harry in Demonreach would know what's coming and what price he will pay and what his choices will cost him. Jim foreshadowed Molly's possible fall from grace and in the end I think she will backstab Mab for giving Lara what she can't have.  This possibility was foreshadowed when Harry soul gazed her.This sounds a lot like Mab's judgement form.  Another of the other things he sees in the soul gaze is the Molly like this.Which of course foreshadowed Ghost Story.

I think he's coming back to try and do at least three things, save the mortal who became Mab, save Molly and fill Demonreach in the final showdown in the Bat.

Mab’s judgement form is more terrible and majestic. I thought it was just Molly as a full blown warlock.

[Avernite]

Once Harry Prime is gone Merlin will appear.  Mab will be revealed as Harry's true love and will meet the fate of his other loves when she is back stabbed by Molly who will complete her trip to evil. And so on.

And of course Molly then becomes MAB later. So she killed herself, somehow, and later travels back in time. At which point early-Harry/Merlin will cast her out to become the cold Mab from the current still-human Molly.