Author Topic: Is Mac ignorant or knows something?  (Read 1602 times)

Offline groinkick

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 7556
  • Strike first. Strike Hard. No Mercy! - Cobra Kai
    • View Profile
Is Mac ignorant or knows something?
« on: June 06, 2021, 07:46:58 PM »
When He Who Walks Before entered his bar, Mac told Harry "Kill it".  This got me thinking.  Mac obviously knew what a Walker was, and the Walker knew something about Mac, referring to him as a "Watcher". 

Was Mac telling Harry to kill it without knowing that first a Walker cannot be killed, but also they are really really powerful, and it is unlikely a wizard could take one on?  Or does he know that Harry CAN kill a Walker, or at least hit it hard enough to send it back to the Outside?

Eb told Harry that a Starborn can hit an Outsider and actually make it hurt.  I wonder if Mac knows about Dresden being a Starborn, and also knows that a Starborn can mess up something from the Outside?  I'm thinking "yes".
Stole this from Reginald because it was so well put, and is true for me as well.

"I love this place. It was a beacon in the dark and I couldn't have made it through some of the most maddening years of my life without some great people here."  Thank you Griff and others who took up the torch.

Offline b4utoo

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 384
    • View Profile
Re: Is Mac ignorant or knows something?
« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2021, 08:17:25 PM »
It was dumbed down for action. Since it came in Mac could act to the point of self defense. And he referred to it because he's out.

Offline Arjan

  • Seriously?
  • ***
  • Posts: 13235
    • View Profile
Re: Is Mac ignorant or knows something?
« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2021, 08:20:15 PM »
Mab seems to like him. He definitely is important.
WG+++: The White God is Mister.
SH[Elaine+++]

Offline seanham

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 145
    • View Profile
Re: Is Mac ignorant or knows something?
« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2021, 08:58:29 PM »
I've thought for a while that he was the Gatekeeper before Rashid took his place or Mac stepped down. So he knows something or maybe everything.

Offline seanham

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 145
    • View Profile
Re: Is Mac ignorant or knows something?
« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2021, 09:09:59 PM »
Another idea, the Walker called Mac "The Watcher," Mac may be "Out," but I wonder if he is still "watching." If I remember correctly, Mac only came to Chicago a few years before Harry, and Mac has appeared in almost every book. What if Mac is Watching Harry. Harry would not tolerate someone he saw or suspected was an enemy (white council or winter court) to watch him, and he would react badly (because it's Harry's nature). Knowing this, interested parties (white council, winter court, others?) planted someone in Chicago who Harry would not suspect as "watching" him. While Mac might not see Harry every day, he sees him enough to check his mental state and general wellbeing. Also, Mac knows a lot of people in town, and he can use them to learn more info. Also, people talk to and in front of bartenders like they aren't even there. This is another source of info for Mac.

Offline Yuillegan

  • White Council
  • Posty McPostington
  • *****
  • Posts: 1382
  • Forum Moderator
    • View Profile
Re: Is Mac ignorant or knows something?
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2021, 10:26:58 PM »
When He Who Walks Before entered his bar, Mac told Harry "Kill it".  This got me thinking.  Mac obviously knew what a Walker was, and the Walker knew something about Mac, referring to him as a "Watcher". 

Was Mac telling Harry to kill it without knowing that first a Walker cannot be killed, but also they are really really powerful, and it is unlikely a wizard could take one on?  Or does he know that Harry CAN kill a Walker, or at least hit it hard enough to send it back to the Outside?

Eb told Harry that a Starborn can hit an Outsider and actually make it hurt.  I wonder if Mac knows about Dresden being a Starborn, and also knows that a Starborn can mess up something from the Outside?  I'm thinking "yes".
I think the dialogue simply is what Jim and/or his editor thought worked best for that scene.

From an in-universe perspective though, I think because Mac is so limited by his leftover angelic nature he really has to be efficient and effective with his words. He could have said "destroy it" or "burn it" or "smash it" etc, but he didn't have time or even perhaps the leeway to explain his full intent to Dresden. So he simply used the word "kill" to get the result he wanted in the shortest available time. And it worked.

Also, Harry has banished a Walker when he was only 16. Years prior to meeting and then banishing He Who Walks Before. Neither of these things were done on Halloween, and I doubt even the Walkers would survive being killed on Earth on that day. If Archangels etc are vulnerable on that day, then I can't see why Walkers aren't. I know Bob said they were un-killable in one of the earlier books, but he hadn't yet revealed his big secret that he knew how to kill immortals yet. He omitted certain information back then.

I don't know if this made it out here but Mac is all but confirmed as a former angel, a Watcher. I am pretty sure there were threads on here about it after Battle Ground. Jim doesn't have to stamp it on his head, the evidence is there and Harry even guesses it.
Hi, I'm a moderator. We're here to help. Please remain calm. Don't go outdoors.

Offline Mira

  • Needs A Life
  • ***
  • Posts: 24100
    • View Profile
Re: Is Mac ignorant or knows something?
« Reply #6 on: June 07, 2021, 02:26:50 AM »
Quote

I don't know if this made it out here but Mac is all but confirmed as a former angel, a Watcher. I am pretty sure there were threads on here about it after Battle Ground. Jim doesn't have to stamp it on his head, the evidence is there and Harry even guesses it.

Agreed, and is supposed to pretty much stay out of things, though in Harry's case he has helped him on  several occasions.  However never in a way for Harry to suspect what he is or was until Battle Ground when he recognized what the Placard was and to activate it with a smear of his blood. The fact that he wouldn't allow a soul gaze because the knowledge of such a being in it's real state would destroy even Harry, was the clincher.