New Dresden Files podcast interview.

[Mira]

I don't think so. She cannot ask Harry to give her anything in Demonreach, or at least that is what I understood. Mab can task her knight but cannot rob him.

I agree, that was clear I think in Cold Days, during their "little talk" after Maeve died.  Even though he didn't understand everything, he understood that Alfred could put Mab in a cell if he asked it, and so did Mab.

"Demonreach," I  said.  "If our guest pulls the trigger, take her below and keep her there."
The guardian spirit's vast shadow fell over us even though there was nothing casting it, and Mab's eyes widened.
"Servant," I said.  "I don't like that word.  I suggest that you consider where you stand and chose a different term.

[Dina]

@vincentric I did not understand the capital D 

Yes, Harry can do anything as the Warden but my point was that Mab cannot order him to do anything related with the Warden status, no matter if he is her Knight. And he was the Warden before being the WK, previous obligations top his new ones. So, if Harry on his own volition takes the blackstaff from his grandpa and put it in Demonreach, Mab cannot touch it. She cannot order him to retrieve the blackstaff but she could offer a deal...or make it a request.

[Mira]

@vincentric I did not understand the capital D 

Yes, Harry can do anything as the Warden but my point was that Mab cannot order him to do anything related with the Warden status, no matter if he is her Knight. And he was the Warden before being the WK, previous obligations top his new ones. So, if Harry on his own volition takes the blackstaff from his grandpa and put it in Demonreach, Mab cannot touch it. She cannot order him to retrieve the blackstaff but she could offer a deal...or make it a request.

She could, but I don't think Harry has to honor it, I think he has first and last authority over what goes in and out of the island.  However he did seem to think the island was vulnerable to Outsiders if one sneaked in in the body of a mortal like Justine.  But only because he let her in, but notice once Alfred got Harry away and on the island, HWWBs couldn't follow.

[vincentric]

“I will,” I said. “With a condition.” “Speak it.” “That before my service begins, you restore my body to health. That you grant me time enough to rescue my daughter and take her to safety, and strength and knowledge enough to succeed. And you give me your word that you will never command me to lift my hand against those I love.”

Butcher, Jim. The Dresden Files Collection 7-12: A Fragment of Life (The Dresden Files Box-Set) . Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

Mab’s burning eyes stared at me for a long moment. Then she began to walk again, more slowly on this, her third traversing of the circle around me. “You must understand, wizard. Once you are my Knight, once this last quest of yours is complete, you are mine. You will destroy what I wish you to destroy. Kill whatsoever I wish you to kill. You will be mine, blood, bone, and breath. Do you understand this?”

Butcher, Jim. The Dresden Files Collection 7-12: A Fragment of Life (The Dresden Files Box-Set) . Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

I'm just not seeing any wiggle room here. Mab has a cooperative understanding with Demonreach  and would not do anything to attack it as that would be an attack upon Harry that he could defend against but:

“You are not the first law-person I would want to be involved with,” I said. I raked my fingers back through my hair. “Okay,” I said, wincing. “The things in here. Are they dangerous where they are?” “THEY ARE ALWAYS DANGEROUS. BUT THEY HAVE THE LEAST OPPORTUNITY TO EXPRESS IT HERE.” I blinked. Those were some of the longest, most nuanced, and most complex sentiments the spirit had expressed to me. Which meant that we were speaking about something important—which only made sense. Demonreach didn’t care about friends or enemies or the price of tea in China. It cared about its inmates, period. Anything else, everything else, would be judged based upon its relevance to that subject. “But can they get loose?” “NOT WITHOUT OUTSIDE INTERVENTION,” Demonreach said, “OR YOUR AUTHORIZATION.” “Meep,” I breathed. “Uh. You mean I could turn these things loose?” “YOU ARE THE WARDEN.” I swallowed. “Is it possible for me to communicate with them?” “YOU ARE THE WARDEN.” “Oh, Hell’s bells, this is bad.”

Butcher, Jim. Cold Days (The Dresden Files, Book 14) (pp. 162-163). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.

Anything Demonreach has locked up, Harry can set free. This is from the word of Demonreach itself. And the armory is just as subject to Harry's control. There is no effect on his Warden status unless she tries to force him. Harry can refuse her order but there are ... consequences to this that Harry currently does not have the power to evade or avert. He'd have to go back to isolation on the island.

[deadvoid]

Demonreach Warden is outside of Winter Knight's mantle jurisdiction

[Dina]

I still disagree, Vincentric. Mab cannot force Harry to do anything about Demonreach. There is one reason no one thinks Mab has the Eye. It's not that she can control what is in Demonreach. She may, of course, orchestrate plans to force him to choose to use any weapon or prisoner of Demonreach, but she cannot directly order him to do that.

[Mira]

Anything Demonreach has locked up, Harry can set free. This is from the word of Demonreach itself. And the armory is just as subject to Harry's control. There is no effect on his Warden status unless she tries to force him. Harry can refuse her order but there are ... consequences to this that Harry currently does not have the power to evade or avert. He'd have to go back to isolation on the island.

Perhaps he would, but when he is on the island, he has the power, not her. 

Quote

    "Demonreach," I  said.  "If our guest pulls the trigger, take her below and keep her there."
    The guardian spirit's vast shadow fell over us even though there was nothing casting it, and Mab's eyes widened.
    "Servant," I said.  "I don't like that word.  I suggest that you consider where you stand and chose a different term.

Harry could lock her up, but he'd have to be able to bind her first though, which wouldn't be an easy thing.

[morriswalters]

It's an interesting question.  She made Harry stab himself in the hand in Summer Knight and rewrote his software in Small Favor. And she was in the Well when Harry's soul was out gallivanting.  So a better question might be, why would she?

If Merlin built the Well and traveled in time, barring idiocy on his part, Merlin would have thought about this and made provisions. Don't you think?

[Arjan]

It's an interesting question.  She made Harry stab himself in the hand in Summer Knight and rewrote his software in Small Favor. And she was in the Well when Harry's soul was out gallivanting.  So a better question might be, why would she?

If Merlin built the Well and traveled in time, barring idiocy on his part, Merlin would have thought about this and made provisions. Don't you think?

Demonreach makes Harry an even more powerful and effective winter knight and also a more effective warden. Mab and the island came to an understanding about Harry, probably some sort of agreement and I don’t think Mab will mess that up, it won’t serve her purpose. Her words to Lara clearly shows that she thinks Harry’s responsibilities are not a problem for her.

Mab clearly understands the islands importance and in the past helped Harry to fulfill his obligations as the warden.

Mab does horrible things when she thinks it is necessary for her purpose and that includes teaching Harry some lessons but there is always some sort of ratio behind it.

[Mira]

It's an interesting question.  She made Harry stab himself in the hand in Summer Knight and rewrote his software in Small Favor. And she was in the Well when Harry's soul was out gallivanting.  So a better question might be, why would she?

If Merlin built the Well and traveled in time, barring idiocy on his part, Merlin would have thought about this and made provisions. Don't you think?

I think Harry has come a long way since that moment in his office.   I think he understands a bit more about power and the limits of it these days.  Remember what both Eb and Uriel told him about Mab forcing him to do anything.  That doesn't mean that she can't exert an enormous amount of power over him.

Demonreach makes Harry an even more powerful and effective winter knight and also a more effective warden. Mab and the island came to an understanding about Harry, probably some sort of agreement and I don’t think Mab will mess that up, it won’t serve her purpose. Her words to Lara clearly shows that she thinks Harry’s responsibilities are not a problem for her.

Mab clearly understands the islands importance and in the past helped Harry to fulfill his obligations as the warden.

Yes, and she also understands that Harry was able to jail a Titian and he is in possession of the Spear of Destiny.  Yes, elsewhere she can exert a lot of pressure on him, but on the island?  He has the last say, and she also knows that.  However that won't stop her from trying, and let us not forget she understands the subtleties of power and how to both exert it and withstand it.  It was that subtlety that enabled her to withstand the blunt of the Eye of Baylor, much of her power is indeed psychological.

[vincentric]

I don't believe Mab can force Harry to do anything. He has his free will. She just has the right to command him as her Knight. If Harry defies a command though, he'd be forced to the island to escape the consequences.

Mab doesn't want to give Harry a command that will cause his defiance though. He is the best Knight she has had in sometime and potentially one of the greatest ever. And she sees a kindred spirit in him. That won't stop her from punishing him horribly if he openly defies her, but I'm fairly sure only he gets private talks where he can ask the why of her orders.

[Dina]

Yes, I agree with that.

[Arjan]

I don't believe Mab can force Harry to do anything. He has his free will. She just has the right to command him as her Knight. If Harry defies a command though, he'd be forced to the island to escape the consequences.

Mab doesn't want to give Harry a command that will cause his defiance though. He is the best Knight she has had in sometime and potentially one of the greatest ever. And she sees a kindred spirit in him. That won't stop her from punishing him horribly if he openly defies her, but I'm fairly sure only he gets private talks where he can ask the why of her orders.

That is a definition of forcing somebody to do something that is based on Uriel’s definition of free will. The problem with that definition is that it becomes impossible for anyone to force anyone else to do something and so the word becomes meaningless and that it does not match the real world interpretation of the meaning of forcing someone to do something.

[The_Sibelis]

Perhaps he would, but when he is on the island, he has the power, not her.  Harry could lock her up, but he'd have to be able to bind her first though, which wouldn't be an easy thing.

I don't think he would have to bind her, at least not ritually like he did Ethniu. That scene implies DR could do so retroactively even with the warden dead. No real binding to speak of there.. I think it wouldn't be as effective though. The Warden, the one with the free will, is like the fulcrum of the lever when weighing DR against another. Without the leverage DR would have to use brute force so to speak. His metaphysical mass might be greater, but all the 'muscle' in the world doesn't help you if you can't apply proper leverage.

[vincentric]

That is a definition of forcing somebody to do something that is based on Uriel’s definition of free will. The problem with that definition is that it becomes impossible for anyone to force anyone else to do something and so the word becomes meaningless and that it does not match the real world interpretation of the meaning of forcing someone to do something.

That's true in real life also. You can always defy someone trying to coerce you. The question is, are you willing to accept the consequences that they may inflict on you and remain resolute? It may not be realistic in extreme cases but defiance is always an option even if it's an unpalatable one.