A thought About Butters

[Feral Plum]

Is Butters the first genius-level knight of the cross to have a multi year backing in wizardry as Butters does from Bob?
It seems we would have noticed such a character in history. Too early by far, but Solomon pops to mind. Could butters contain, or bottle, evil spirits?

[Mira]

Is Butters the first genius-level knight of the cross to have a multi year backing in wizardry as Butters does from Bob?
It seems we would have noticed such a character in history. Too early by far, but Solomon pops to mind. Could butters contain, or bottle, evil spirits?

Works for me, and gives Butters the supposed requirement of coming from a royal bloodline.

[Arjan]

Works for me, and gives Butters the supposed requirement of coming from a royal bloodline.

We will find one if needed. Just invent a genealogy, it is an age old tradition.

[K.L.O.E.]

Is Butters the first genius-level knight of the cross to have a multi year backing in wizardry as Butters does from Bob?
It seems we would have noticed such a character in history. Too early by far, but Solomon pops to mind. Could butters contain, or bottle, evil spirits?

If Butters is of David's line that makes an even easier explanation why he can be a Knight of the Cross. He's related to the mortal part of Jesus.

This theory is cool and the only qualifications seem to be some relation to royalty. I hope you're right.

I'm excited to see who gets Amorachius and what the story ends up being and it better be epic. It's Excalibur

[BrainFireBob]

I prefer bin Saul  or bin Ahab myself. Or even a Khazar Khan.

[Wicked Woodpecker of West]

Look if AfroRussian can have detectable lineage to Saladin, then I'm quite sure Butters can have detectable line to Genghis Khan

[Arjan]

Look if AfroRussian can have detectable lineage to Saladin, then I'm quite sure Butters can have detectable line to Genghis Khan

If you test his Y chromosome. Which means nothing. It must be about inheritance, a claim to the responsibility of kingship. There is a lot of mythology connected to that because in a lot of monarchies the kings claim godly authority, godly ancestry or even being gods. That brings belief and power and story.

So compare to the return of the king, Tolkien borrowed this idea. Half the nobility of Gondor must have had some line to some king of Gondor in the past, that did not count. And descendants of farmers daughters the king abused for a night didn’t count either.

Think holy blood, holy grail. The book that preceded the Da Vinci code.

[Wicked Woodpecker of West]

I don't think it's that hard.
I mean otherwise Charlemagne blood would not work for Michael - as he is definitely not legal heir to Carolingian monarchy.
I think any royal lineage - not even legitimate in sense of crown would work well enough - so even Y chromosomes would not necessarily work - it could all be through maternal lines. (Which also is a reason why I dislike this idea - because I guess at least half of mankind have SOME royal ancestor which makes whole RULE quite cheap.).

Michael may be descendant of Charlemagne in some way but he is definitely not one in line that would make him eligible to throne of France for instance. Neither are other guys. It's more than mystical element of king's blood stick around for a long time.

Now Aragorn had very fine claim to the throne as last descendant in direct male line of Elendil. But then if we compare it - Knight of the Cross is not a King. In fact probably he should not be a King (though we know there were exceptions) as it would make him involved in various mundane actions that are usually not so virtuous. - But let's compare it to Tolkien.

Sure Boromir, Faramir, Denethor - those guys have king's bloods, High Numenorean blood, thought they are not king lineage. They are not as strong, tall, longlived and willpowered as Aragorn, still they are way more powerful in those aspects for good or bad than any random Rohirrim or Daleman or Haradrim.

At least I hope so - because dammit if Jim's want to suggest Knights need not also king's blood but also legitimate claim, I'm gonna fly to USA, drive all the way from Chicago to whatever Kansas desert he's hiding and hit him with a head three times with some big, complex, academic book about history of medieval kingdoms.

[Mira]

Sure Boromir, Faramir, Denethor - those guys have king's bloods, High Numenorean blood, thought they are not king lineage. They are not as strong, tall, longlived and willpowered as Aragorn, still they are way more powerful in those aspects for good or bad than any random Rohirrim or Daleman or Haradrim.

If I remember also Denethor's line, though Numenorean, had become watered down over the centuries so their life spans were closer to normal humans.  Also it is repeated often in The Lord of the Rings that Aragorn is descended from the line of Luthien Tinuviel the elf princess who gave up her mortality for a mortal, Beren, "her line will never fail.."  So female descent was critical.

[Wicked Woodpecker of West]

Both Aragorn and Denethor house were descendants of Luthien and elven princess Idril Celebrindal through Elros.

Yes house of stewards married more among non-Numenoreans, still Denethor was probably second after Aragorn in amount of old Numenorean power. He was able to fight for palantir in will-duel with Sauron and win, this is not something common mortal could do.

Nevertheless this pure race aspect is less important in terms of real royalty as most kings married foreign princesses anyway

[Arjan]

And all Anglo Saxon kings descended from Woden. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Saxon_royal_genealogies

[K.L.O.E.]

And all Anglo Saxon kings descended from Woden. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Saxon_royal_genealogies

I wonder if he will be descended from an early Jewish Dynasty (or the first of it's kind's Jewish dynasty to fit the Khans which given his love of Polka might make the most sense) to compliment Shiro being descended from the Last King of Okinawa. Or Jim just pulled the location timing of the dynasties random and not tied to Shiro being the last true wielder of Esperachius as a sword proper before it was reignited.

[Wicked Woodpecker of West]

And all Anglo Saxon kings descended from Woden. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Saxon_royal_genealogies

Well so they claim. But I doubt eventual blood of Odin matters. As much as I understand WOJ about it - this whole king magic is more like state-wide obligation of responsibility and protection. A debt. A threshold... A mantle in a way. That's what causes descendants of kings (which are multiple) to have enough mojo to take Swords.

[Arjan]

Well so they claim. But I doubt eventual blood of Odin matters. As much as I understand WOJ about it - this whole king magic is more like state-wide obligation of responsibility and protection. A debt. A threshold... A mantle in a way. That's what causes descendants of kings (which are multiple) to have enough mojo to take Swords.

But te claim matters. If they make enough people believe it it will have a power of its own. And maybe it is even true. In the Dresden verse.

[TheCuriousFan]

So obviously it takes a special kind of person to be a knight of the sword, you've alluded to perhaps royal bloodline kind of stuff, but a lot of the people who have the sword have this kind of pretty typical holders Sanya with the saber, Shiro with the katana, Murphy with the heavenly judgment and stuff so my question is, are there particular characteristics or quirks that the swords kind of use to pick their people that transcend beyond standard virtue.

That's the thing you don't have to be special to pick up a sword and use it, you've got to be special to pick up a sword and use it right. Or at least one of the Swords which I assume will have a capital letter in Sword. What the sword looks for more than anything else is sort of the ultimate martial value, the ultimate martial value is love for the people in your life. Because if you love the people who are behind you, that's why you're willing to fight for them. So that's the first thing the sword always looks for, and if you don't have that you can't pick up a sword. Well you can pick it up but it won't do anything for you. That's the main thing, stuff like courage and athletic ability all that is secondary it's who are you and are you willing to die for someone else. That's really mostly what the swords care about, and then if someone uses them wrong they'll get shattered or whatever, you know, good job Murphy. But other than that.

Does that mean Butters is royalty?

Butters is Jewish, he's descended from the 12 tribes of Israel, he's going to have royalty in his bloodline somewhere. And not only that but really like- I think the number is at like 35 or 40 percent at this point of the people on the planet who have a king in their background somewhere. My family goes back to Charlemagne so you know.

The king stuff seems to have been a red herring in the end.