Mac's True Nature (spoilers for BG)

[Telynn]

Exactly, but putting his blood on the Placard and hanging it up, is.

You also have to wonder if there is a cost of some sort that you eventually have to pay to gain the protection given by the Placard.  Maybe something like his life force is tied to that location now.

[Griffyn612]

Exactly, but putting his blood on the Placard and hanging it up, is.

That's your opinion.

[Arjan]

That's your opinion.

Is opinion the right word here?

Hypothesis. As soon as it is testable and you can draw testable conclusions from it it becomes a theory. If it is confirmed sufficiently it becomes in practice a fact.

You doubt the validity of her hypothesis. In your opinion....

Proposed facts can be true, false or just unconfirmed. Opinion is more like a value attribute.
I would say your interpretation. Or maybe your, in my opinion, wrong or insufficiently supported, conclusions.

Opinions and facts are not interchangeable.

[Mira]

That's your opinion.

Of course it is, just like yours..

You also have to wonder if there is a cost of some sort that you eventually have to pay to gain the protection given by the Placard.  Maybe something like his life force is tied to that location now.

Lots of blood is associated with the Crucifixion, from the whipping, from the Crown of Thorns, from the nails in Jesus's wrists and feet, from the spear piercing His side.  I think the smear of blood on the back of the Placard is tied to that somehow, pledge to sacrifice one's self maybe. 

[Dina]

Lots of blood is associated with the Crucifixion, from the whipping, from the Crown of Thorns, from the nails in Jesus's wrists and feet, from the spear piercing His side.  I think the smear of blood on the back of the Placard is tied to that somehow, pledge to sacrifice one's self maybe. 

In that particular aspect, I disagree. Blood has been used to activate spells and artifacts, from circles to the Demonreach pokeballs, all around the Dresdenverse. That is, regardless of its rapport to Christ or christianity in general.

[Arjan]

Of course it is, just like yours..

Lots of blood is associated with the Crucifixion, from the whipping, from the Crown of Thorns, from the nails in Jesus's wrists and feet, from the spear piercing His side.  I think the smear of blood on the back of the Placard is tied to that somehow, pledge to sacrifice one's self maybe.

And in the end it is a human sacrifice but I do not think Mac would go that far and he knows more about it than Harry does.

[Mira]

In that particular aspect, I disagree. Blood has been used to activate spells and artifacts, from circles to the Demonreach pokeballs, all around the Dresdenverse. That is, regardless of its rapport to Christ or christianity in general.

True, but one would think more so in this case..  The Blood of Christ takes center stage from the Last Supper through to the Crucifixion, those events are the origins of the artifacts.

And in the end it is a human sacrifice but I do not think Mac would go that far and he knows more about it than Harry does.

But that was his pledge when he smeared his blood on the Placard wasn't it?  We still don't know what if anything the Placard does.  Harry said, now if the bad guys wanted in they'd have to go through Mac.  Well, wasn't that the case before he pulled out the Placard?  Did it make the bar door a super threshold?  It never sent out power vibes like the Spear did.  When Murphy asked Harry what it was, he said it was the sign above Christ's head on the Cross, and that it stood for intercession.  Looked that word up and it had a lot to do with asking God or some deity for aid.  Which for Mac, as an exiled angel playing strictly neutral might not be that easy, unless at last he has decided to take a stand and a side for humanity's sake.

[Griffyn612]

Is opinion the right word here?

Hypothesis. As soon as it is testable and you can draw testable conclusions from it it becomes a theory. If it is confirmed sufficiently it becomes in practice a fact.

You doubt the validity of her hypothesis. In your opinion....

Proposed facts can be true, false or just unconfirmed. Opinion is more like a value attribute.
I would say your interpretation. Or maybe your, in my opinion, wrong or insufficiently supported, conclusions.

Opinions and facts are not interchangeable.

That's your opinion. 

[Mira]

That's your opinion. 

Yup, we all have an opinion and like to express it, that's why we are here!

[Lehane]

And I still don't know who told Harry all that about the pieces but I want to know what all of them (including the Grial) do in the Dresdenverse.

Off topic but I do wonder why the Real Shroud of Turin hasn't been used to either heal Helen Bickett's daughter (aka Persephone) or Murphy. Although honestly it is Persephone that has me wondering more cause Murphy likely declined if offered.

[Avernite]

True, but one would think more so in this case..  The Blood of Christ takes center stage from the Last Supper through to the Crucifixion, those events are the origins of the artifacts.
But that was his pledge when he smeared his blood on the Placard wasn't it?  We still don't know what if anything the Placard does.  Harry said, now if the bad guys wanted in they'd have to go through Mac.  Well, wasn't that the case before he pulled out the Placard?  Did it make the bar door a super threshold?  It never sent out power vibes like the Spear did.  When Murphy asked Harry what it was, he said it was the sign above Christ's head on the Cross, and that it stood for intercession.  Looked that word up and it had a lot to do with asking God or some deity for aid.  Which for Mac, as an exiled angel playing strictly neutral might not be that easy, unless at last he has decided to take a stand and a side for humanity's sake.

Of course if we just take not intercession, but the verb intercede, it just says 'intervene on behalf of another.' So I'm more on the following argument:

By taking up the placard, Mac is intervening on behalf of the people inside his bar. He intercedes between whatever may come at them and his guests. Hence, he's not taking a side, he's focusing any outside threat on him, whatever he really is, which is more powerful than just pretending to be a guy with a shotgun.

Likewise, in the crucifixion, TWC placed Himself between whatever ailed them (possibly the sins of mankind) and mankind or maybe just between those ills and the Jewish people (what with the inscription, at least in our world, mentioning the Jews). But in that case, through the additional artifacts used, it probably worked more permanently (or maybe TWC is just hiding deep in the NeverNever so that noone can break that intercession).

[Telynn]

So it seems to me we have two options on how the placard works.  Passive, which would mean that everyone in the bar is safe as long as Mac is alive.  The protection is a 'threshold' sort of protection.  Or non-passive which would mean that Mac himself has pledged to fight for and protect anyone seeking sanctuary in the bar.  Either way Mac is putting himself on the line and as is said, taking a side.

[Dina]

I think it's passive, mainly because Jesus did not attack the Romans 

[Griffyn612]

So it seems to me we have two options on how the placard works.  Passive, which would mean that everyone in the bar is safe as long as Mac is alive.  The protection is a 'threshold' sort of protection.  Or non-passive which would mean that Mac himself has pledged to fight for and protect anyone seeking sanctuary in the bar.  Either way Mac is putting himself on the line and as is said, taking a side.

I'll agree with everything except for taking a side.  The only side he's taking is by upholding the accords which he's already agreed to.  The faction attacking Chicago were in violation of the accords.  He is agreeing to uphold his signing of them. 

To me that's not taking a side, but if that's not others interpret it, okay.

[Mira]

I'll agree with everything except for taking a side.  The only side he's taking is by upholding the accords which he's already agreed to.  The faction attacking Chicago were in violation of the accords.  He is agreeing to uphold his signing of them. 

To me that's not taking a side, but if that's not others interpret it, okay.

Wasn't he already doing that when Harry brought in the Placard.  But hold it a minute, Mac's Bar is neutral territory, different factions meet there from time to time.  Did Mac ever sign the Accords? If he had, he cannot reside over neutral territory, signing the Accords is taking a side.