Is Eb the Bad Guy?

[ClintACK]

In the Dresden's backstory, when he's a child, Justine DuMorne, widely-respected warden of the White Council is an abusive foster parent and teacher who tries to isolate Harry and then put the mind-whammy on him to make him into a starborn thug under DuMorne's control.

That goes wrong when Harry (inexplicably) kills DuMorne and is arrested by the White Council for murder.

Harry's version of events is that Eb is a saintly old man who risks his life to spare Harry, takes him into his home and teaches him the good parts of magic and self-control and makes him the man he is today.

And yet...

That's not what we see when Eb is on-screen, and it's not what we see in how other people react to Eb, and it's especially not what we see in Peace Talks.

Every book where Eb is on-screen, we learn that he's not at all who Harry thought he was. In Summer Knight we learn that the irascible hermit is politically connected enough to swing a Senior Council vote. In Blood Rites we learn that the "magic is not for killing" sensei is actually the White Council's dirty-jobs assassin. In Changes we see him ripping the life out of humans, just shredding the first law and everything he's taught Harry.

And Harry's still isolated -- which we're told in the text is "what abusers do". After years of living with Eb, and years of living after that, he doesn't have a single wizard friend until Luccio drags him into the Wardens and he meets Carlos. That made some sense when we thought Eb was a loner hermit, not so much now that we know he's a political mover and shaker with lots of wizard friends.

What are the big fights about in Peace Talks? Eb wants Harry to cut himself off from Maggie -- to whom he says exactly four words, upon first meeting his great-granddaughter, before disengaging from her completely to have a knock-down-drag-out fight with Harry insisting that he has to send her away.

The other is about the White Court Vamps -- but is that really about protecting Harry from them, or about a predator marking his territory? If Eb does use subtle mind-control magic, he might worry that WCVs would be able to spot it in Harry. Could he have been freaking out about Thomas because he thought Thomas could expose him? (Did he arrange Thomas's death for that reason, and to isolate Harry from both the Whampires and the Svartalves?)

And then there's the cornerhounds... we see Eb getting Harry to do two things which are explicitly Warlock-bad things: using a ring of fire and making direct mental contact with the Outside. We only have Eb's word, in a vague and shifty fashion, that the latter is actually safe for Harry. And the former seemed like an unnecessary risk.

And imagine what that scene looks like to a White Council that's thinking about kicking Harry out, again.

Anyway... if we imagine that Ebenezar McCoy was Peabody's boss and has been trying to isolate and mold Harry into his tool, a lot of these things make sense.

[Bad Alias]

I want to tell you how wrong you are, but that's well reasoned. It's not anything like proof or conclusive, but it's certainly suspicious.

[TrueMonk]

It was my clear impression that Eb was living the loner life on his farm and staying out of council politics untill he was forced to join the senior council to save Harry. (Or maybe the loner life except for some black staff action when the council really needed it). But then his friend Simon was killed and the martial voice on the council was gone and he had to save his grand son. So those two things forced him back in the world (I think).

To me that explains the isolation.

[SerScot]

I want to tell you how wrong you are, but that's well reasoned. It's not anything like proof or conclusive, but it's certainly suspicious.

Eb recruits Harry into a shadowy sub-organization that is deliberately working secretly and counter to some of the White Council’s goals. I’ve wondered if the “Gray Council” could actually be the “Black Council”.  The only thing that says no to me is Odin’s presence on the Gray Council.

Unless we’re all wrong and the White Council is truely rotten and evil and the “Black Council” is really on the side of the angels?  That seems really unlikely.

[Mira]

Eb recruits Harry into a shadowy sub-organization that is deliberately working secretly and counter to some of the White Council’s goals. I’ve wondered if the “Gray Council” could actually be the “Black Council”.  The only thing that says no to me is Odin’s presence on the Gray Council.

Unless we’re all wrong and the White Council is truely rotten and evil and the “Black Council” is really on the side of the angels?  That seems really unlikely.

Oh I hope not...

[morriswalters]

That misstates the goal of the Grey Council.  Their goal is to act against the Black Council whom they believe has infiltrated the White Council.  However what Eb himself does is represented in the real world by paramilitary police death squads. Murderers above the law. I don't really get the urge to give Harry the Black Staff given that, but whatever.

[Navis]

It seems good reasoning except for the fact that it seems that  Donar Vadderung has his back and from what i've read he seems to be a pretty good judge of character.

[ClintACK]

I like Vadderung. He made a great impression in Changes, but is there any reason to put him on a moral tier above Marcone? His business model is hiring out brutal killers to very bad people.

In Jury Duty, we see his einherjar fighting against Dresden over whether or not to "disappear" an innocent child because she witnessed the killing of a predator who was going to torture her to death.

[SerScot]

Indeed.  Odin is more Neutral than “good”.  That is borne out by the Odin mythos as well.  Odin is very... pragmatic.

[Conspiracy Theorist]

No Einenjaren in jury Duty, is was Riley and his ex-Marines.

[TrueMonk]

A good first reason to put him above Marcone is that he is Santa Claus.

Another would be that his primary activity seems to be keeping humankind safe from monsters. It is the main good thing about him in Norse mythology and in the dresdenverse the earliest deeds we have heard of from him helping the Vikings fight the Grendelkin.

It so also my impression that the Einherjaren are not for fights with other mortal gangs, but a counter for supernatural threats.

Against Odin being a nice guy, Gard thinks Marcone is too soft because he won't kill the workers that builds his secret hideout to be sure they keep silent.

[SerScot]

A good first reason to put him above Marcone is that he is Santa Claus.

Another would be that his primary activity seems to be keeping humankind safe from monsters. It is the main good thing about him in Norse mythology and in the dresdenverse the earliest deeds we have heard of from him helping the Vikings fight the Grendelkin.

It so also my impression that the Einherjaren are not for fights with other mortal gangs, but a counter for supernatural threats.

Against Odin being a nice guy, Gard thinks Marcone is too soft because he won't kill the workers that builds his secret hideout to be sure they keep silent.

Do you have any idea how sacrifices to Odin were made?  He’s the “Gallows Lord”. 

https://en.natmus.dk/historical-knowledge/denmark/prehistoric-period-until-1050-ad/the-viking-age/religion-magic-death-and-rituals/human-sacrifices/

[Smaug with OCD]

That's not what we see when Eb is on-screen, and it's not what we see in how other people react to Eb, and it's especially not what we see in Peace Talks.

Every book where Eb is on-screen, we learn that he's not at all who Harry thought he was. In Summer Knight we learn that the irascible hermit is politically connected enough to swing a Senior Council vote. In Blood Rites we learn that the "magic is not for killing" sensei is actually the White Council's dirty-jobs assassin. In Changes we see him ripping the life out of humans, just shredding the first law and everything he's taught Harry.

And Harry's still isolated -- which we're told in the text is "what abusers do". After years of living with Eb, and years of living after that, he doesn't have a single wizard friend until Luccio drags him into the Wardens and he meets Carlos. That made some sense when we thought Eb was a loner hermit, not so much now that we know he's a political mover and shaker with lots of wizard friends.

What are the big fights about in Peace Talks? Eb wants Harry to cut himself off from Maggie -- to whom he says exactly four words, upon first meeting his great-granddaughter, before disengaging from her completely to have a knock-down-drag-out fight with Harry insisting that he has to send her away.

The other is about the White Court Vamps -- but is that really about protecting Harry from them, or about a predator marking his territory? If Eb does use subtle mind-control magic, he might worry that WCVs would be able to spot it in Harry. Could he have been freaking out about Thomas because he thought Thomas could expose him? (Did he arrange Thomas's death for that reason, and to isolate Harry from both the Whampires and the Svartalves?)

WARNING: The following paragraph is kind of jumbled.

The "Ebenezer is behind Thomas' actions" theory is a compelling one, especially when one looks at ALL the different theories out there and compiles the various pieces of evidence different people present. But, I don't think Ebenezer is or was purposefully trying to isolate Harry... in the early days. They have two VERY different approaches to life as a result of their histories. I suspect that is the driving force behind their disagreements up until Peace Talks. Now, I am firmly in the "Ebenezer is Nemfected" camp(along with Gedwig from Svartalf security, but we aren't talking about that right now). I won't go into the "why" I think this. There are so many theories out there that it's not hard to dig up half-a-dozen reasons it could be the case, or even a dozen. If that counts as Eb trying to isolate Harry, meh. I'm not sure it does, though. The possibility of an Obadiah Stane "Who do you think locked you out?" line is quite possible next book.

And then there's the cornerhounds... we see Eb getting Harry to do two things which are explicitly Warlock-bad things: using a ring of fire and making direct mental contact with the Outside. We only have Eb's word, in a vague and shifty fashion, that the latter is actually safe for Harry. And the former seemed like an unnecessary risk.

And imagine what that scene looks like to a White Council that's thinking about kicking Harry out, again.

THIS! THIS! The "oh, and this is what a Starborn is" exposition seemed so out of place that it was almost jarring. A reveal like that seems like it would be something more suited to a climactic battle or high point during a book.

Anyway... if we imagine that Ebenezar McCoy was Peabody's boss and has been trying to isolate and mold Harry into his tool, a lot of these things make sense.

Now, this I don't believe for a moment. If this were true, Eb could have just not done anything during the mistfiend incident, or more effectively he could have started throwing power around AT THE OTHER WIZARDS IN THE ROOM. As the heavy-weight, bestestest fighting wizard on the planet there would have been a ton more deaths, and the white council could have either been crippled or undergone began a civil war while they were already occupied with the Reds. The outcome, no matter what happened, would have been absolutely DEVISTATING.

Eb trying to mold Harry is quite possible, though. Into what, though, is an important question.

However what Eb himself does is represented in the real world by paramilitary police death squads. Murderers above the law. I don't really get the urge to give Harry the Black Staff given that, but whatever.

To be fair, Harry and Eb are already in the same line of work. They just have different bosses, and Eb has a LOT more experience.

[ClintACK]

No Einenjaren in jury Duty, is was Riley and his ex-Marines.

Oh. Yeah. Sorry. I got confused when a valkyrie showed up working for Lara. It made me retroactively think that the extreme professionals she had around might have also been hired from Monoc. But there's nothing to support that in the text, and Marcone's einherjar have always been described with nordic names and accents.

[BrainFireBob]

My 2 cents is that that's the currency Monoc accepts: Einherjar.

I'm firmly of the opinion that Hendricks was either re-hired from Monoc, or he's pledged to Gard on death, and that Gard has a remit to recruit from Marcone's soldiers. I imagine that Lara has a similar contract now that she's using professionals.

How immortal Einherjarin are is an interesting question.