Author Topic: What questions should Harry be asking?  (Read 19922 times)

Offline morriswalters

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #15 on: November 09, 2019, 08:22:27 PM »
Ask Toot what?  It's like you asking, "What law might I break?"  Might I suggest 10,000 possibilities?  Certain things you know, like Toot, are things you know because you are of the culture.  In the story itself, asking people about things, like what it means to be a star born, might put you at risk of giving away what you don't know.  Which has it's own risks. To quote Mark Twain,
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It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.
And the people who know about Margaret's evil plans are her fellow conspirators. People you can't ask, like Cowl or Lord Raith.

Offline Dina

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #16 on: November 10, 2019, 02:05:40 AM »
All your questions, and this:
"Who is my grand mother? Do I have aunts or uncles? Eb has siblings?
Who exactly took care of me immediately after my mom dies, until dad took me? And of course, I want all details about mom's final day".
Missing you, Md 

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Offline Firestarter

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #17 on: November 11, 2019, 11:52:47 AM »
Harry is a wizard. He understands and has demonstrated that knowledge is power.

But he only asks pertinent questions when the house is on fire. Apparently - his brain is functional, long-term.

According to WoJ the books are actually Harry's diaries [ like the one of Ebenezer ] so it's not unimaginable that we only get to read the diaries from the few exciting weekends.

Still: the progress of Harry's analysis is too slow and too little.

"Who is my grand mother? Do I have aunts or uncles? Eb has siblings?
Quote from: Harry Dresden
Why do I like sheep so much?
Where can I buy a kilt?

The obvious questions posted above.

I mean: I get it: Harry's a hikkikomori who only goes to work to pay the rent. Otherwise he's at home, reading books, tinkering with magic, occasionally being sociable. Right...

So... why don't we see more gadgets? I understand Jim's reasoning, I don't undertand Harry's - his gadgets have saved his hide and other people several times over;
 - escape potion
 - boost when he jumped out of the car to face the Streetwolves
 - protective charm he gave to Lydia
 - anti-vampire venom
 - bear-charm [ would have been extremely useful in the Shedd Aquarium - even a gamechanger ]
 - Little Chicago - is now available to BFS [ yes, the house burned down. The lab was in the sub-basement, a concrete box, and I'm betting it survived ], but the few uses have been worth it.
 - panic room - great. Needs more.


What I'm missing based on what happened in the books:
 - longitude and latitude coordinates have been in use for centuries before GPS was ever invented. Harry is an old-fashioned guy but doesn't think of checking out a map? [ and yes, for those of you, who aren't aware, paper maps generally have longitude and latitude info in them... or they used to at least ] Maybe the search spell needs vamping up?

 - He's a magic nerd/geek but he doesn't jump at the possibility of checking out swords made by Lucio ??? Really? I don't believe that. Not in a million years.

 - HEALING ITEMS. Seriously, by now, with a bunch of shapeshifters figuring out healing, how come Dresden doesn't even heave a headache cure around??? Even if it's just a tiny boost. Dresden keeps getting busted up for 10+ years now - every normal person would try to figure out a way how to get out of hospital bed faster and with less trouble. I'm saying this as someone who spent a lot of time in hospital beds. Trust me, after a few weeks you don't care how nice the hospital personnel is. You want to go home.
   HIS HAND!!! Gods, just making it better a bit faster should have been motivation enough. That should have been the turning point; the reason why Dresden learns basics of healing magic.

 - Harry keeps whining about using his 3rd Eye. Ok, cool. So how come there is no gadget that helps him with that? Seriously! Harry is a snoop. You'd expect him to have a pair of enchanted glasses or a monocle to help him at least see parts of what he'd normally have to use his 3rd eye to see.

 - Back to healing magic - Carlos got hurt, Murphy got hurt, Michael got hurt, Shiro died from torture and a curse, Thomas endangered people when he was hurt, Molly got hurt, ... kids got shot and mauled to death by monsters. Again - at least a 1st aid to stop/slow down bleeding, you know, basic treatment that _EVERYONE_ who keeps getting injured learns eventually. If a spell is too complex, again, back to healing items.

 - Moneymaker - Dresden should have an item that helps him make money more easily. I'm not saying "cheating" as such. Just another tool to help him get the funding he needs. It's obvious from the books that money is always an issue, so I don't see a reason why he doesn't do what everyone does when they can: make their job a bit easier. You know, like a lie detector, better search spell, stuff like that.

 - More holding items like the unicorn hair rope. Even if they don't work as well. Something is always better than nothing. Christ, even cops have handcuffs which would be arguably better than bare hands when dealing with the fae.

...
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Offline Dina

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2019, 05:07:43 AM »
I agree, we here (in the forum, not in this thread) has been discussed magical items for ages. Yes, I understand some of them could be very expensive, but making one magical item every six months or so could be affordable. And I want healing potions too. I am sure Butters could help with the theory  :)
Missing you, Md 

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Offline Kindler

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #19 on: November 15, 2019, 05:47:07 PM »
I think Harry would have a lot of trouble with crafting healing items. I don't know how they could be made to function reliably, with predictable (identical, repeatable) results. You might be able to cheat with it by making it work similarly to watercrafting in Codex Alera—basically, you help the body heal itself rather than close the wound.
I don't even know if healing magic is all that big a thing in Dresden. The only one who we've met who is confirmed to be capable of anything like it is Listens-to-Wind, but (evidently) it can't do things like mend broken bones (Luccio certainly should have been healed, right?) I mean, the number of injuries to Council wizards who should have access to the best healing magic the White Council has to offer is really, really high. Half the wardens have been shown to be in slings, on crutches, wrapped up with bandages, etc.
Even a necromancer, a wizard-level talent with power over life and death, was only able to prevent a dying man from dying. She was able to anchor his life to his body, right? But the guy still had to go to the hospital, and required tons of medical assistance to stay alive after the spell would run out. So Kumori was able to keep someone alive, but unable to do anything with the injuries.
And I can also totally see something that could work like that being really, really dangerous to mess around with. Cuz you can't see inside someone's body, right? Imagine if Harry tried to close up an internal wound with magic. He'd probably end up ripping more holes open.
Items... maybe. I don't know how they would work. Because, again, the issue is repeatability, right? You need an item that can, for example, slow blood loss from a variety of different wounds. Maybe potions? I don't know. I'd have to see how it would work. But sure, I guess that could be a possibility.

Harry could've used some money help up until Skin Game, agreed. Should've learned some more geomancy from Eb, gone down to a mountain range, and pulled up a gold vein. Or, hell, used it to find freaking oil or something. Instead he was working for fifty bucks an hour (and probably only about 10-20 hours a week) finding people's keys.

There are tons of places where his gear could've been improved. How about an extra enchantment on his duster that worked like his force rings, except they channeled the energy into a kinetic shield instead? Would be really nice if Harry didn't have to constantly get hit with "major league fastballs" every time a thug with a Mac 10 opened up on him. I even thought about doing something simple, like duct taping a bunch of extra force rings to the hubcaps of the Beetle. Let the rotation charge them up. Just drive the car around the block a few times in ten minutes instead of beating a speed bag for a half hour (or waiting three weeks of normal use or whatever).

Since he's the Winter Knight, it'd be kind of appropriate if he could magic up the Dresden equivalent of Aleran coldstones, too. Or toss around those Mind Fog dealies (which is apparently not a violation of the Laws of Magic if Butters does it?)

Or he could just use what he's got. I'm reasonably certain that the gem his mother left him with directions through the Ways is a lot more than just an auditory map. I think there's more information in there, since it appears she used it kinda like a tape recorder. I really, really want to know if there's more information in that gem, and it's barely been touched since it was introduced in Changes. It was, if I remember right, literally the only possession he still had in Cold Days, thanks to Mab keeping it safe for him.

Offline Dina

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #20 on: November 15, 2019, 11:50:39 PM »
Just to be clear, I would never say that Harry should be an Inspector Gadget kind of wizard. I just think that he needs to craft one item or two every several months. And you are right about healing-  It seems to be something very difficult in the Dresden verse and I think that only some minor injuries should be feasible (unless you want to risk giving someone a cancer) . But still, Harry seems to be unable to cure even a hit point ( :P) and that seems to be quite extreme.
Missing you, Md 

There are many horrible sights in the multiverse. Somehow, though, to a soul attuned to the subtle rhythms of a library, there are few worse sights than a hole where a book ought to be. Someone has stolen a book (Terry Pratchett)

Offline Bad Alias

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #21 on: November 16, 2019, 04:00:34 AM »
I don't even know if healing magic is all that big a thing in Dresden. The only one who we've met who is confirmed to be capable of anything like it is Listens-to-Wind
I'm assuming you're intentionally leaving out fairies. Ebeneezer did those stones that stopped the pain and restored the blood flow to Harry's hand in Blood Rites. Elaine did the "Reiki" in White Night.

Instead he was working for fifty bucks an hour (and probably only about 10-20 hours a week) finding people's keys.
He was up to $75 an hour by Blood Rites, but point taken and agreed to.

Mind Fog dealies (which is apparently not a violation of the Laws of Magic if Butters does it?)
Right?

His mom's gift should totally be used more. I'd imagine Mab would take advantage of his having it.

I do think Harry/a wizard should be able to come up with a lot of first aid level magical equipment. Also, combining Bob's alchemy knowledge, Butter's medical knowledge, and whatever Elaine was doing with that Reiki stuff, they should probably be able to come up with some sort of healing potion that does something useful even if not that miraculous. Maybe something gives you the equivalent of at least a day's recovery (but not rest).

Maybe that's mostly the sort of thing LtW does. Instead of taking 6-12 weeks, broken bones heal in 3-6 weeks.

Offline morriswalters

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #22 on: November 16, 2019, 05:10:10 AM »
He has a limited market for magical items.  And anything he can make so can any other wizard.  And most of them don't have a full time gig saving the world.

Offline Larry Fowler

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2019, 05:13:37 AM »
The item I would most like to see Harry create is a staff (or what ever item) that would conjure a frozen turkey to home in on his foes! :o

As for selling an magically crafted item, with the kind of luck Harry has, if he ever did it would come back to bite him in the worst possible way...
« Last Edit: November 16, 2019, 05:29:27 AM by Larry Fowler »
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Offline Bad Alias

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #24 on: November 16, 2019, 08:43:58 PM »
He has a limited market for magical items.  And anything he can make so can any other wizard.  And most of them don't have a full time gig saving the world.
While I agree that crafting random magical items probably isn't the best way to make money for a wizard, there is a market for it in the DF. Harry has bought things from svartalves. Surprisingly (maybe), there is a real world market for charms and blessings. See https://www.texasmonthly.com/the-daily-post/louisiana-witch-doctor-jailed-for-aiding-texas-cocaine-cartels/.

Offline wardenferry419

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #25 on: January 20, 2020, 02:29:17 PM »
Harry should be asking the questions that he probably doesn't want the answers to.
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Offline Firestarter

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #26 on: September 22, 2020, 09:40:13 PM »
Just to be clear, I would never say that Harry should be an Inspector Gadget kind of wizard. 
Several points here:
- That's the strange part. Dresden is a nerd. A geek. He loves reading fantasy adventure books ffs!
- Another thing: On one hand we hear Harry talk about being prepared almost as often as if he was one of the advisors for Soviet children camps [ the motto was: "Ready at all times!". We don't really know what they were supposed to be ready for. A war, most likely ], we read about him researching magic, because he really loves doing magic... We even read about his attempts to make a flying broomstick.
  It really bums me out when I'm reading about a character who's supposed to be smart, yet they keep acting dumb or at the very least, not acting smart. Sure, Dresden doesn't think highly of himself.

But consider how Thomas or Murphy describe him.

Plenty of fairly smart people don't actually consider themselves smart, they only realize that, for some weird reason, other people don't understand some fairly elementary ideas...

And you are right about healing-  It seems to be something very difficult in the Dresden verse and I think that only some minor injuries should be feasible (unless you want to risk giving someone a cancer) . But still, Harry seems to be unable to cure even a hit point ( :P) and that seems to be quite extreme.
Let me put it this way: If Billy and the Werewolves can figure out closing surface wounds just like that [ admittedly, Billy's got an engineering degree or something similar IIRC, but he's younger than Dresden and Dresden is basically a kid compared to other wizards ], how come Listens-to-Wind, a shapeshifter, a shaman, a doctor with a LIST of university degrees, with centuries of experience never even considered that? [ I'm expecting some kind of retconning here in the future ]

That's not "difficult healing in the Dresdenverse", that's a worldbuilding/character design flaw. Either Billy and the Werewolves never should have been able to figure it out or Listens-to-Wind is nerfed beyond a bad patch of World of Warcraft levels.

I think Harry would have a lot of trouble with crafting healing items. I don't know how they could be made to function reliably, with predictable (identical, repeatable) results.
Ok, let's start:
Magic does business with physics. Or to quote an expert "Fire, summoned with magic, is still fire! Murph."
Dresden can use magic to manipulate energy. Yes, he calls them "Fire magic","Air magic","Earth magic","Water magic", etc. But once he declares that he's basically just handling physics, it's simply a different application of what he already knows. And I'd imagine it should be hell of a lot simpler to use the magic to guide the energies than it is to conjure up fire. [ and yes, if you're wondering by now, I did study STEM >.> ]
  Therefore once Dresden starts understanding magic well enough to craft his 2nd bracelet, he's pretty much also capable to create the same effect as an MRI machine. And since he's receiving a direct feedback via magic, the "resolution" or in other words "the amount of data", shouldn't be an issue. He's literally feeling the magic, how it responds to fluctuations and similar.

The only one who we've met who is confirmed to be capable of anything like it is Listens-to-Wind, but (evidently) it can't do things like mend broken bones (Luccio certainly should have been healed, right?)
Nah, Billy stops bleeding from a knife wound  after Marcone throws said knife at him in the "Aftermath". He gets a scar, but the wound does close up. Billy doesn't have much magical power and definitely doesn't have much experience to "feel" the difference the way Dresden does.

The Leanansidhe heals Harry in Blood Moon. Mab repairs Harry's broken back. There are possibly a few more instances when a character is affected in this manner, but they are there.

Even a necromancer, a wizard-level talent with power over life and death, was only able to prevent a dying man from dying. She was able to anchor his life to his body, right?

Yup. Necromancy can't be used for healing. But it is great for making sure the patient doesn't die until he gets healed.

Cuz you can't see inside someone's body, right? Imagine if Harry tried to close up an internal wound with magic. He'd probably end up ripping more holes open.
You're thinking about using magic like using a hammer or an axe, possibly tweezers and similar. Yet we by now know very well that Dresden doesn't require line of sight to cast a spell and depending on the spell, he also receives feedback on whether the spell landed or not [ Proven Guilty, tracking spell on where Harry sent the fetches after knowing that the spell has hit the target over a fairly large distance ]. Therefore applying magic to redirect moving energies, including receiving proper feedback [ magic is the Power of Life, after all ], there's basically 0 likelihood that Dresden would cause cancer. Whether he rips something apart or not depends solely on his level of fine control. And while we know that Dresden keeps saying that he doesn't have very fine control, we're not talking about editing DNA. We're talking about "fusing back together parts that were originally one", so I'm pretty sure that Thaumaturgy would cover a lot on this topic, one way or the other.

How about an extra enchantment on his duster that worked like his force rings, except they channeled the energy into a kinetic shield instead?

Well... this is not nearly as simple as you're making it sound.
What you're talking about is a combination of several spells into a single enchantement with at least two active components:
- a radar-like spell to constantly monitor close surroundings for signs of approaching energies
- a Friend-or-Foe recognition spell that can recognize incoming energy as non-malevolent.
Therefore Dresden would get pretty much worn out after wearing it for some length of time.
But the idea might be pretty sound for training to increase his magic capacity.

Or toss around those Mind Fog dealies (which is apparently not a violation of the Laws of Magic if Butters does it?)
Butters is not a member of the White Council and I'm pretty sure that the laws of magic don't apply to him. Especially since he's not using his own magic, however he's fueling his gadgets. And the laws say that you're not supposed to use magic to do those things. In pure theory, if we got a Doctor Who x Dresden crossover and Dresden would travel in time via TARDIS, he didn't break the laws of magic.

And: Yeah, by now you'd think that Dresden turned his Silver bear charm into a bunch of tiny magic grenades. I mean: The guy was fighting in a war. He's a nerd with a serious hatred towards the Red court. You don't get more Ka-boom than that.

Hell! A whole arsenal of weapons would be more accurate. People living in peaceful parts of the world don't understand that people who live in conflict really start appreciating simple things in life. LIKE SURVIVING!!! And they also tend to err on the side of caution and arm up. Really, really, REALLY arm themselves to the teeth.

He has a limited market for magical items.  And anything he can make so can any other wizard.  And most of them don't have a full time gig saving the world.
Oh, I'm not suggesting he sells the magic items for profit. I'm saying: craft more tools to make your life easier. You know? Pragmatic approach to life? Something you'd expect from someone who went through the foster system and had to learn to rely on himself first and foremost?

Although, I'm pretty certain that he could be making and selling some protective charms to ward off ghosts and stuff like that.

..whew. Now there's a wall of text.
I apologize for having worn out your eyeballs this much. I promise that after tonight I'm staying away from the forum for some time again ;D
« Last Edit: September 22, 2020, 09:43:29 PM by Firestarter »
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Offline Mira

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #27 on: September 22, 2020, 10:38:34 PM »


I don't think one can craft magical healing items, if one could, Listens to Wind would have them.  He doesn't, he learned his the old fashioned way, in medical school..  The Fae are different, they have the power if they want to use it.

Offline vultur

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #28 on: September 23, 2020, 02:21:52 AM »
Course, letting Harry fumble around in the dark is a pretty stupid idea so I don't get why they don't just be a bit straighter with him.

If by "they" you mean the various powers involved in Harry's life (Eb, the Gatekeeper, Mab, Uriel, etc.) I think it's to steer what Harry does and (except in Uriel's case) that they don't want him to be more powerful than he needs to be to do what they want him to do.

The "in the know" members of the White Council aren't sure which way Harry is going to go (I think that's why Eb is so reluctant to tell him anything about being Starborn until his life's on the line), Mab is apparently wary of Harry (there is a WOJ that things were bad in Faerie last time something like this happened and "Mab is keeping her enemies closer"), etc.

Let me put it this way: If Billy and the Werewolves can figure out closing surface wounds just like that [ admittedly, Billy's got an engineering degree or something similar IIRC, but he's younger than Dresden and Dresden is basically a kid compared to other wizards ], how come Listens-to-Wind, a shapeshifter, a shaman, a doctor with a LIST of university degrees, with centuries of experience never even considered that? [ I'm expecting some kind of retconning here in the future ]

Self vs. others, I think. Listens-to-Wind can turn himself into all kinds of animals, he could certainly close his own wounds, IMO.

But doing that kind of magic on others... much harder.

The Second Law probably also has made the White Council very leery of experimenting much with biological magic on others beyond the basics (much as White Council mental training was extremely rudimentary before recent events).

Quote
The Leanansidhe heals Harry in Blood Moon. Mab repairs Harry's broken back. There are possibly a few more instances when a character is affected in this manner, but they are there.

These are incredibly powerful entities, far beyond the scale of even the Senior Council. Lea is second to Mab, stronger than the Winter Lady, and she killed two Lords of Outer Night (beings that Odin calls "mostly retired gods") with one spell.

Quote
And: Yeah, by now you'd think that Dresden turned his Silver bear charm into a bunch of tiny magic grenades. I mean: The guy was fighting in a war. He's a nerd with a serious hatred towards the Red court. You don't get more Ka-boom than that.

Well, I think the force rings were his version of that. Magic grenades would be too uncontrollable, Harry is extremely wary of the First Law. The force rings let him modulate the force so he can just "pull the punch" rather than deliver a lethal blow against mortals.

Also, there's a WoJ that the items Harry had (pre-Changes when he had a full set) were all he had the time to maintain. He can't just keep adding more stuff and keep all his old stuff working.

Offline Yuillegan

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Re: What questions should Harry be asking?
« Reply #29 on: September 23, 2020, 04:17:44 AM »
It occurs to me that at least my first question is now partially answered (thanks to Eb practically shoving it down his throat) and Harry's reaction is "the timing isn't right!" as though that's the reason he hasn't been asking...

Unfortunately, we didn't get the whole story and of course Harry won't bother looking into it until the next character decides Harry should know.

Sadly 2 is unanswered still, and 3 is teased at (elemental chaos etc). But still mostly nothing. A few teases to the rest but by and large still in the dark.



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