Mirror Mirror and the dual conflicts

[Yuillegan]

So Jim talked about being inspired by The Frighteners (one of Peter Jackson's earlier films) in the DragonCon Ghosts and Spirits panel. He commented that one thing he loved was the duality, the mirror image of two conflicts happening simultaneously (spiritual and physical) which were connected yet couldn't really touch - but would affect the outcome of the other conflict. I think most of Ghost Story exemplifies this. But I also wonder if the extended multiverse might do that too - for instance, actions in Harry's universe might affect things in other verses, and vice-versa. I also believe what happens in each Nevernever then might also have a similar effect.

So the problem is both horizontal and vertical in layers (if you get the idea). Many levels and many simultaneous issues.

When he goes on to talk about the limits of the Angels and Fallen and why they cannot just tear everything up, it is because they cannot really change themselves. They are elemental, they always are who they are (but in balance) and so it is mortal choices that sort of define that. I think there was a really excellent theory (several perhaps) that basically talked about how each choice moves each universe closer to a pole (light or dark/chaos or order etc) and it was not only on a horizontal axis, but also a vertical axis. There is infact an image in the Dresden Files that really illustrates this type of battle (but on a much more limited scale) - the Battle in Chicago-over-Chicago in Summer Knight. Mab and Titania when they fight are essentially equal (as the bulk of Mab's forces are tied up at the Outer Gates). It is the mortals that help decide the outcome. When Harry views it with his Sight, he sees a great battle field with the energy that each Queen is expending pouring out against each other like a giant grid or game of chess, focused around the Stone Table. In the greater more cosmic analogy - I think Earth is the Stone Table. Just my thoughts.

[Bad Alias]

I also thought of how that fit in with Ghost Story when I heard it, but I also thought about how it didn't fit because there was a lot of direct interplay between the physical and spiritual in Ghost Story. I'm not so sure if it applies to Mirror Mirror, but your guess is as good as mine, if not better.

One thing we have heard is that the Archangels are the same throughout the multiverse and so is the Outside. Stated another way, there is only one Uriel and one Outside throughout the multiverse. Therefore it stands to reason that if what happens on one Inside affects the Outside and the Outside affects (or can affect) every Inside, then every universe affects (or at least has the potential to affect) all of the multiverse.

[Yuillegan]

Pretty much bang on I think. It is very much an everything is connected game. Which lends weight to the conflict between Heaven and Hell - each individual Choice, each Soul, is incredibly valuable.

I think it is a matter of the degree to which each thing affects the other things. I mean Mirror Mirror couldn't happen if there was no effect at all.

[Bad Alias]

If we can rely on Fool Moon, which is suspect, Hell gets something out of having a soul condemned, and it seemed to me that they got more than just a thumb in the eye of TWG. The thumb in the eye is the typical justification I've seen in fiction. Occasionally, souls are a source of power.

[Snark Knight]

One thing we have heard is that the Archangels are the same throughout the multiverse and so is the Outside. Stated another way, there is only one Uriel and one Outside throughout the multiverse. Therefore it stands to reason that if what happens on one Inside affects the Outside and the Outside affects (or can affect) every Inside, then every universe affects (or at least has the potential to affect) all of the multiverse.

Walkers being multiversal entities might explain Before's Multiple-Man act, and possibly also Before's simultaneous there-but-not-there behaviour.

[Yuillegan]

Mmm yes I think it is definitely more than merely just taking away TWG's toys. I suspect there is real power involved, and that the war is more of a cold war between Heaven and Hell. Souls as a power source has been done before, and I am sure Jim will have an interesting take on how it works.

Snark Knight: Not sure that the Multiple Man act was all the different versions of Before coming together (unless of misunderstand your comment). I think it far more likely he is simply strong enough that he can be a sort of gestalt consciousness, inhabiting many vessels (which he perhaps creates himself). Only mortals would be so limited to operating the one meatsuit, I think stronger beings could have many avatars being used simultaneously. Which is not to say mortals don't have that potential, but our earthly physical limits would likely prevent this. Lea gives some hint to this when saying that the brain is not the only storage facility for memories, in fact often a poor receptacle for such things. The body seems to be an actual limit to the full potential of a Soul. Not sure what you mean about the "there-but-not-there" behaviour...were you referring to his power being impossibly deeper than Mab's (the photo of a sculpture vs the actual sculpture itself)? If so, I totally agree. But I think it is because the Outsiders only ever put a portion of themselves into Reality, they have more "essence" than is truly comprehendable and compatible with Reality and so are limited by whatever amount of themselves has been "invited" in. Think the Void Lords in WoW or the Daemons of Chaos in Warhammer/40K, or the Outer Gods in Lovecraftian Mythos.

[Kindler]

One thing we have heard is that the Archangels are the same throughout the multiverse and so is the Outside. Stated another way, there is only one Uriel and one Outside throughout the multiverse. Therefore it stands to reason that if what happens on one Inside affects the Outside and the Outside affects (or can affect) every Inside, then every universe affects (or at least has the potential to affect) all of the multiverse.

Is there a WoJ on this that I don't remember? I've see this before, but assumed it was fan speculation.

[Bad Alias]

I've heard that these are WoJ's, but haven't seen/heard them myself.

[Yuillegan]

It is WOJ

2015 San Francisco signing (Coopersfield Books)

I’m pretty sure the outsiders are the outsiders and they just sort of look different depending on which universe they are trying to get into and destroy.

2014 Dragoncon WoJ time stamped youtube link of a rambling WoJ about pandimensionality, extradimensionality (Outsiders) and aliens

One of my favorite parts of your novels are the divine and the demonic, and kind of how they offer (?) each other, and how they have rules, and I wanted to ask, what made you decide that Chicago wasn’t enough, that all of Creation has to be at stake?
Well, it’s not all of Creation.  It’s just all of THIS Creation. We haven’t really pulled the camera back far enough yet.  There’s a lot of reality in the Dresden Files.  The Dresden Files is a universe that is driven by Free Will, and every time you make a choice, it creates a new universe.  So, there’s this vast spectrum of universe out there, and it’s not just ours, there’s causality going off in every direction.  So a philosophical war on that scale is something that is just so tremendous you can barely imagine it.  And while it dwarfs into unimportance our particular universe, at the same time, the only way to win that war is one choice at a time, one person at a time. And that’s really what’s going on at the level where the angels are operating, that’s what they’re concerned about.

Hope that clears it up. Took some finding though I must admit. The second quote works in context really with everything Jim has already said about multiple parallel realities and angels etc. Basically that's why there is only really one version of each Angel, Archangel, Fallen, Outsiders etc. Because they are spread out across a continuum of ALL realities, perhaps an infinite amount. I imagine that is the same for similarly powerful beings such as the Mothers.

What really gets interesting is if each mortal has an "immortal" soul, and as most recent WOJ states souls are sort of functioning on a cosmic scale (part of the foundational energy of the universe etc), do each parallel version of mortals have different souls from their counterparts or are they sort of connected, perhaps even shared?