Proven Guilty speculation, because, why not?

[Bad Alias]

@Kindler: Michael had Thorned Namshiel's coin, so it was on the helicopter. I think Nic knew that.

@Morris: Namshiel is covered in thorns, so he/she is called "Thorned" Namshiel. It isn't really his name, and it might just be by Harry like "Shaggy Feathers"; I'm not sure on that second point.

[g33k]

... although the fact that the central spire in the courtyard which contained the Wellspring was untouched - there were no markings of hellfire or acid on the walls or base - is remarkable. Either this was the only piece of rebuilding Mab did, or some event forced the attackers to stop/ divert/ retreat.

Honestly, I still think Mab suckered the BC/Namshiel/whoever.  The queen of Winter sitting at the Wellspring...   She could have shut them down any time she wanted.

She gave a carefully staged resistance, based upon the attackers' belief that Mab was off at the battle-front shaping up vs. Summer.

She spent the defenders on exposing the actual identities of the attackers, so she could know who she needed to burn in payback.

Once she knew her targets, she asserted herself; and they retreated post-haste.  Then she set the stage for Harry & Charity.

[kbrizzle]

@morriswalters
It was a comment about the naming convention of the Fallen - some are referred to by their host (Nic, Deedee, Tessa), others by their Fallen’s name (Magog, Ursiel, Urumviel).

@g33k
I dunno, I still have difficulty buying that she set things up in the way they happened. It seems likely to me that while was she waiting for an attack of some sort, she didn’t expect to be sucker-punched in the manner she was. The assault, sending her troops to Summer etc. all negatively impacted her allies (Venatori & WC) for nearly a year, allowing the Ramps/ BC to do a fair amount of damage.
In many ways, Mab sitting almost alone in a bombed out stronghold, betrayed, while thousands of her personal troops lie dead mirrors where the White Council is at this point - their allies are no longer helping them (Venatori have been attacked severely & the Fae are in a stalemate with each other), hundreds of wardens/ thousands of civilians have died & they have been betrayed (Cairo attacks etc).
If you notice, the Ramps/ BC are generally winning the war until PG - after PG, the Ramps/ BC start losing - so PG is an important turning point in the war. I think this is where Mab & the WC fully realize they are fighting a supranational conspiracy amongst the Signatories (Black Council), not just the war in front of their eyes.

[morriswalters]

Mab doesn't hit bottom until after the events of Proven Guilty.  The only thing that I can see that justifies her behavior in PG, is that she is hunting traitors in Faerie.  She knows Lea is nemfected. And she must think that Aurora was as well. What she can't know is how deep the problem goes.

Look at where the situation stands in retrospect.  Three of the most powerful beings in Faerie are compromised.  Maeve, Lea and the Winter Knight.  So she stands alone, even if she doesn't know it yet.  And she has had to go to war with Titania because Aurora either was insane on nemfected.

[kbrizzle]

Look at where the situation stands in retrospect.  Three of the most powerful beings in Faerie are compromised.  Maeve, Lea and the Winter Knight.  So she stands alone, even if she doesn't know it yet.  And she has had to go to war with Titania because Aurora either was insane on nemfected.

This is why I’d argue that Mab does hit rock bottom in PG - she is completely bereft of her allies within Winter (Maeve, Lea, no WK); the WC is fighting a war for survival with little bandwidth & traitors within; Titania is uninterested & Lily is marching to Maeve’s tune.
Her stronghold has been openly breached, maybe not the Wellspring but the gates to her palace literally don’t exist anymore - they’ve been blown apart. Maeve is going around calling her mad. Her only real ‘ally’ is Harry, who doesn’t care for her too much.

All of this changes after PG. In SmF, she picks up Marcone as another ally & gets revenge on Namshiel/ other Denarians. And then again in Changes, CD & SG.

[morriswalters]

Proven Guilty will work.  The next story involving Mab is Changes and by that point she has Lea and will get Harry, so her star is rising again.  But her weakness at the time of PG is the basis of my WAG.

[Kindler]

Point of order: the next Mab story is Small Favor, not Changes. That's when she's so furious she can't speak with her own mouth anymore. In other words, by Small Favor she knows how vulnerable her position is, and is working in concert with Uriel if not exactly on his side. Lea does not appear to be free yet; her next legit appearance is indeed in Changes. Not sure how that impacts things, just wanted to bring it up.

[morriswalters]

You are correct.  I shouldn't post when I'm tired.