A Question About Naagloshii

[Mira]

If it were under orders/compulsion, then sure; it could have done whatever it needed to.  Then I move over to wondering who/what gave the orders, and why, and whether THAT is going to become part of the ongoing DF plotline(s)?

But if it weren't compelled... I return to thinking that any extended seduction would have been more time and effort than it would have found worth expending for ANY mortal.  I think a "simple" seduction, lost-weekend style, or overt rape, would be all the time & effort a naagloshi would be willing to expend on any mortal.

Except Mr Grey seemed to know his father, or at least what it was..  I think you are underestimating the amount of sadistic pleasure gained by the naagloshi...  It does have it's sadistic pleasures, that is why it spent so much time on poor Thomas...  The time and effort are worth it...

[exartiem]

First, rape is not just an act of violence.  It is a violation of free will. 

Secondly, from what Jim has shown us, the skinwalker is not the type to commit to a long term plot.  I don't think it would pretend to be a loving, caring mate for nine months just for one pay-off at the end.  It seems more likely to commit one act that would continue to torture the woman, making her fear what was growing inside her.

After giving birth she could do many different things (kill the baby, abandon it, etc...), but while still pregnant her options would be fewer.

Unless the creature's plan was to create an offspring.

[Mira]

First, rape is not just an act of violence.  It is a violation of free will. 

Secondly, from what Jim has shown us, the skinwalker is not the type to commit to a long term plot.  I don't think it would pretend to be a loving, caring mate for nine months just for one pay-off at the end.  It seems more likely to commit one act that would continue to torture the woman, making her fear what was growing inside her.

After giving birth she could do many different things (kill the baby, abandon it, etc...), but while still pregnant her options would be fewer.

Unless the creature's plan was to create an offspring.

That could indeed have been it's plan... Agreed that rape is a violation of free will, however posing as a lover or husband is also a form of rape..  As to long term plots, getting back at Morgan for killing one of them was a long term, plot.

[g33k]

... getting back at Morgan for killing one of them was a long term, plot.

waitWHAT?

Did I forget or overlook something?  Where did we see a long-term Naagloshi plot to get revenge upon Morgan?

[g33k]

... Secondly, from what Jim has shown us, the skinwalker is not the type to commit to a long term plot.  I don't think it would pretend to be a loving, caring mate for nine months just for one pay-off at the end...

This is my feeling too.

But as was pointed out to me, they ARE capable of the deception, and a powerful-enough entity could MAKE them do it.

And they would undoubtedly do a very good job at it, and engineer the matter for maximum (eventual) torment to their victim.
 

[Mira]

waitWHAT?

Did I forget or overlook something?  Where did we see a long-term Naagloshi plot to get revenge upon Morgan?

Because Morgan is one of the very few that was able to kill one of them... That is in Turn Coat..

[nadia.skylark]

Because Morgan is one of the very few that was able to kill one of them... That is in Turn Coat..

Yeah, but I don't remember anything about a long term plot to kill him for it.

[Mira]

Yeah, but I don't remember anything about a long term plot to kill him for it.

  Perhaps not plot, but motive....  Revenge doesn't need a plot..  Apparently the skinwalker was ordered by ]to go after Morgan.. The reason it captures Thomas is to trade him for Morgan..

[nadia.skylark]

Apparently the skinwalker was ordered by ]to go after Morgan.. The reason it captures Thomas is to trade him for Morgan..

Yeah, but that wasn't a revenge thing. That was because the Black Council could cause lots of problems if Morgan vanished, so they were trying to take him out.

[Mira]

Yeah, but that wasn't a revenge thing. That was because the Black Council could cause lots of problems if Morgan vanished, so they were trying to take him out.

   I still believe it was a part of what motivated the skinwalker,  as Listens-to-Wind said, it draws power from spreading it's reputation..  Morgan managed to take out one of it's own.

[nadia.skylark]

I still believe it was a part of what motivated the skinwalker,  as Listens-to-Wind said, it draws power from spreading it's reputation..  Morgan managed to take out one of it's own.

You can believe anything you want, but that's not what the book says. The book says that the Skinwalker was working for the Black Council.

[g33k]

  I still believe it was a part of what motivated the skinwalker,  as Listens-to-Wind said, it draws power from spreading it's reputation..  Morgan managed to take out one of it's own.

I guess there may have been a bit of extra motivation there... ?

But that's a long way from anything like a long-term plot or plan to take revenge.

It was... What... 30-40 YEARS after Morgan lured the Naagloshi to it's doom, until Morgan died... And that just doesn't build up a fearsome rep.  I can't believe that they couldn't have tracked him down if they wanted to.  Morgan was in the field a LOT, they'd have found him if they wanted to.

They just don't care enough.  Humans don't MATTER enough to them; no human does.  Not even one who killed another Naagloshi.

[Mira]

They just don't care enough.  Humans don't MATTER enough to them; no human does.  Not even one who killed another Naagloshi.

They do when it has a goal, it says outright it will kill every last one of Harry's friends, of those associated with Morgan unless he is turned over to it..  A thing that can focus like that does care, it lives off of fear.. Not caring would make it indifferent.. 

[Bad Alias]

You can believe anything you want, but that's not what the book says. The book says that the Skinwalker was working for the Black Council.

Isn't that just a theory of Murphy's that is highly compelling instead of an express statement of fact? Note: Murphy doesn't theorize that it's the "Black Council," but whoever killed LaFortier.

[g33k]

They do when it has a goal, it says outright it will kill every last one of Harry's friends, of those associated with Morgan unless he is turned over to it..  A thing that can focus like that does care, it lives off of fear.. Not caring would make it indifferent.. 

Hmmm.

I still think that they could have found Morgan much sooner if they had wanted to; I can only conclude that they didn't care enough to do so.

That said, I think you are right, that they DID have an extra edge of hate and animosity for Morgan, a grudge they had nursed down the decades.  I found as much in some WoJ's I was looking at last night.

I guess I just have to put it down to the inhuman perspective of the Naagloshi, that they might be nursing a grudge for decades, have it really easy (for them) to go out and get their revenge, and still not DO it...   

But yeah -- WoJ says you're right, Morgan was extra-specially on their ShitList.