Author Topic: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers  (Read 191456 times)

Offline belgarion

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 581
  • Careful, or you'll end up in my novel
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #75 on: August 19, 2008, 02:20:52 PM »
Hi,

Priscellie is correct. Kalare is on the west coast.
I'll look in the books and find the references which led us to placing him there.
One was in the last book CaF where Amara flew east from Kalare into Attica where she and Bernard stopped to clean up.
Another were the families involved in Kalare's kidnapping victims in CuF. Placida, Ceres, and Atticus.
I'm still looking through the comment file but those two stand out.

M.

Hi,

I best start my 2 cents here with the confession that I'm geographically challenged. So my suggestion might be completely off.

Looking at the maps you came up with so far (great work btw!), I was wondering why you'd put Kalare somewhere with a west coast. I can't remember a passage in the books where this is implied and I think that some of the problems you're running into might be solved if you switch Kalare to the south coast. The westernmost states would then be:

1. Antillus (north)
2. Placida (middle on the north-south axis, but clearly west, north of the Tiber)
3. Ceres (south, south of the Tiber, kind of a large west-east span, but not a lot of north-south)
4. Forcia

I'd put Kalare east of Forcia, with a south-coast only. Ceres would then be on the north of both Forcia and Kalare, those two states being longer on the north-south axis than the other way round.

The Blackhills could be a mountain range that divides the western southern states from the eastern ones, with just a couple of passes between them. I think that the Tiber river could have its source in the Blackhills, because the Tiber seems to be the border between Ceres and Placida, and the southern tip of Placida's lands - where the First Aleran was first stationed - was in the Blackhills as well, probably the northern tip of that mountain range.

With such an arrangement, you can more easily put the city of Ceres on the marching route between Kalare and Alera Imperia, with no other big obstacles between them - assuming that the Tiber isn't that large farther east and nearer its source. It'd also better explain how the First Aleran moved away from the theater of the war when they were ordered to guard the Elinarch and why Kalare would invite the Canim in the first place: his own lands would be far away from the threat and the Cane would only be a problem for his enemies Ceres and Placida.

If there's a reason Kalare has to be on the west coast, you can just ignore the stuff I've written. :)

Offline Zaphodess

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 975
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #76 on: August 23, 2008, 08:25:49 AM »
Hi,

Priscellie is correct. Kalare is on the west coast.
I'll look in the books and find the references which led us to placing him there.
One was in the last book CaF where Amara flew east from Kalare into Attica where she and Bernard stopped to clean up.
Another were the families involved in Kalare's kidnapping victims in CuF. Placida, Ceres, and Atticus.
I'm still looking through the comment file but those two stand out.

M.

Hm, yeah. I think I found another one: In the prologue of CaF, the conversation between Miles and Amara, where Miles said that the Canim protect Kalare's northern flank, while Kalare protects their southern. And that they could attack Kalare from two sides if the Canim were out of the equation.

There's another theory of mine being flushed out down the toilet. :)

I guess the forces Miles and Aquitaine were commanding must be attacking Kalare from the east, from Attican and/or Placidan territory. And if Kalare's on the south-west coast, both the southern and the western flanks are protected by the sea. But there's the problem imho: Where on Carna is Forcia? None of the characters mentioned anything about Forcian legions or about what Lord Forcia was doing. ???

I'd suggest it's the territory the Canim have occupied if the holder who was fleeing from the Canim raiders that Tavi first met hadn't been expecting Ceresian military. (p. 252, hardback ed. CuF, ch. 31) It's theoretically possible that the Canim occupy both Forcia and a part of Ceres, but that begs the question why the Forcian legions aren't fighting them.

Another theoretical possibility would be that Forcia is north of the Tiber, where the First Aleran are stationed, and that Placida is further north. But that would also mean that the Forcian legions had every reason to help fight the Canim, yet they don't. Not to mention that it'd be rather unlikely that so many Placidan ex-Legionares settled around the Elinarch if Placida was very far away.

If Forcia's a peninsula south of Kalare, like you had on your first draft, the Kalaran swamps wouldn't really be the southernmost part of Alera, like it's said somewhere, iirc. And there's the problem that Kalare could be attacked from the south, so they would already have the option to open a second front on him. Except if Lord Forcia is neutral for some obscure reason or if he's secretly joined the rebellion (but nobody mentioned it so far, or could prove it   ???). That would at least explain Kalare's 7 legions: 3 Kalaran, 3 Forcian and 1 rogue, but that doesn't sound right imo.

I'm tempted to put Forcia on an island west of Kalare. And the Canim didn't try to settle there cause Sarl thought they'd still need their ships if they had to defend that place, so he couldn't burn them.  :-\






Offline belgarion

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 581
  • Careful, or you'll end up in my novel
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #77 on: August 26, 2008, 02:18:24 AM »
As far as Forcia being on the west coast, here's mostly why it's where it's at:

In AF, near the end of the book, when the guard escorts Tavi into the High Lord's sitting room, Tavi looks around the room and notes that "...everything made of the fine, dark hardwoods of the Forcian forests on the west coast...."

There's also a paragraph in CaF describing the Demo's ship sailing south, avoiding Parcia and landing at Forcia before the trip upriver to the capital. Haven't found it yet. Still looking.

M

Hm, yeah. I think I found another one: In the prologue of CaF, the conversation between Miles and Amara, where Miles said that the Canim protect Kalare's northern flank, while Kalare protects their southern. And that they could attack Kalare from two sides if the Canim were out of the equation.

There's another theory of mine being flushed out down the toilet. :)

I guess the forces Miles and Aquitaine were commanding must be attacking Kalare from the east, from Attican and/or Placidan territory. And if Kalare's on the south-west coast, both the southern and the western flanks are protected by the sea. But there's the problem imho: Where on Carna is Forcia? None of the characters mentioned anything about Forcian legions or about what Lord Forcia was doing. ???

I'd suggest it's the territory the Canim have occupied if the holder who was fleeing from the Canim raiders that Tavi first met hadn't been expecting Ceresian military. (p. 252, hardback ed. CuF, ch. 31) It's theoretically possible that the Canim occupy both Forcia and a part of Ceres, but that begs the question why the Forcian legions aren't fighting them.

Another theoretical possibility would be that Forcia is north of the Tiber, where the First Aleran are stationed, and that Placida is further north. But that would also mean that the Forcian legions had every reason to help fight the Canim, yet they don't. Not to mention that it'd be rather unlikely that so many Placidan ex-Legionares settled around the Elinarch if Placida was very far away.

If Forcia's a peninsula south of Kalare, like you had on your first draft, the Kalaran swamps wouldn't really be the southernmost part of Alera, like it's said somewhere, iirc. And there's the problem that Kalare could be attacked from the south, so they would already have the option to open a second front on him. Except if Lord Forcia is neutral for some obscure reason or if he's secretly joined the rebellion (but nobody mentioned it so far, or could prove it   ???). That would at least explain Kalare's 7 legions: 3 Kalaran, 3 Forcian and 1 rogue, but that doesn't sound right imo.

I'm tempted to put Forcia on an island west of Kalare. And the Canim didn't try to settle there cause Sarl thought they'd still need their ships if they had to defend that place, so he couldn't burn them.  :-\


Offline divad

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 908
  • If you taunt tigers you may get killed.
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #78 on: September 08, 2008, 05:27:17 AM »
I just looked at your most recent map of Calderon and I am wondering where the woods are that Tavi and Fade escaped into after the fight at the Rill water.
"for certain ye must be lost to find a place that can not be found."

"For the Pizza Lord, attack!

Offline belgarion

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 581
  • Careful, or you'll end up in my novel
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #79 on: September 10, 2008, 02:23:09 PM »
I have a forest(woods) just north of Bernardholt with the Rill Water running through it.
I played around with it being further east but it seemed to fit there.

Mikey

I just looked at your most recent map of Calderon and I am wondering where the woods are that Tavi and Fade escaped into after the fight at the Rill water.

Offline belgarion

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 581
  • Careful, or you'll end up in my novel
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #80 on: September 16, 2008, 11:49:09 PM »
We will have the first 6 preview chapters of Princep's Fury next week, thanks to Jim and Priscellie. I'll start working on PF maps then.

Mikey

Offline Priscellie

  • Timeline Chick and Industrious Little Gnome
  • The Gatekeeper
  • Seriously?
  • ******
  • Posts: 12791
  • Icon by Daoine! <3
    • View Profile
    • Priscellie.com
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #81 on: September 24, 2008, 01:31:22 AM »
We will have the first 6 preview chapters of Princep's Fury next week, thanks to Jim and Priscellie. I'll start working on PF maps then.

Mikey

The chapters will be posted over the next month.  As in, the prologue was posted today, chapter one will be posted on the 30th, chapter 2 on the 7th, etc., up to chapter 5 on October 28th.

Offline belgarion

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 581
  • Careful, or you'll end up in my novel
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #82 on: September 24, 2008, 02:24:46 PM »
The chapters will be posted over the next month.  As in, the prologue was posted today, chapter one will be posted on the 30th, chapter 2 on the 7th, etc., up to chapter 5 on October 28th.

Misunderstood the posts.
M.

Offline belgarion

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 581
  • Careful, or you'll end up in my novel
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #83 on: October 01, 2008, 03:11:40 AM »
I've added the following file to flicker:

http://flickr.com/photos/21582563@N03/2903029723/

Start of the map of the Cannim Homeland. As always, we'll modify it as we get more information.
Thank you Jim for the clues in the first chapter.

Mikey

Offline divad

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 908
  • If you taunt tigers you may get killed.
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #84 on: October 04, 2008, 03:39:15 AM »
it seems to me that it should flare back out towards the Aleran coast. The way I see it is that Alera exists solely in the nothern hemsphire and the bloodlands in both north and south. Also I expect that the continets sort of fit together just like ours.
"for certain ye must be lost to find a place that can not be found."

"For the Pizza Lord, attack!

Offline belgarion

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 581
  • Careful, or you'll end up in my novel
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #85 on: October 06, 2008, 12:34:48 PM »
it seems to me that it should flare back out towards the Aleran coast. The way I see it is that Alera exists solely in the nothern hemsphire and the bloodlands in both north and south. Also I expect that the continets sort of fit together just like ours.

I can adjust that according to continental drift theory. This was a very preliminary cut since we now know at least one city name in the bloodlands.
I'm pretty sure the Aleran continent spans across the equator. I don't believe it's just in the northern hemisphere. I do agree the bloodlands appear to be far larger than Alera based on the first ch in PF. But there's a pretty big point in most of the books that states that the southern lords support the northern lords against the icemen. Support being supplies, foodstuffs etc. The southern lords would need an almost constant warm environment to be able to do that.

I usually check the topic every day, but I'm working on a graphic novel and haven't checked here. I'll try to get back to checking every day.

M

Offline belgarion

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 581
  • Careful, or you'll end up in my novel
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #86 on: October 07, 2008, 01:28:22 PM »
I've updated the Princeps Fury Map somewhat. Now that we know that the name the cannim give to their homeland is Canea:
http://flickr.com/photos/21582563@N03/2920992753/

Mikey

Offline Priscellie

  • Timeline Chick and Industrious Little Gnome
  • The Gatekeeper
  • Seriously?
  • ******
  • Posts: 12791
  • Icon by Daoine! <3
    • View Profile
    • Priscellie.com
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #87 on: October 07, 2008, 01:45:34 PM »
I can't wait to see what you guys come up with after the book finally comes out!  Way to be on the ball, belgarion. :D

Offline JRBobC

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 2700
    • View Profile
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #88 on: October 07, 2008, 03:16:47 PM »
I've updated the Princeps Fury Map somewhat. Now that we know that the name the cannim give to their homeland is Canea:
http://flickr.com/photos/21582563@N03/2920992753/

Mikey

I'd say about the only thing that needs to be added in that map is the islands that are about 2-3 weeks sail from Canea.  Other than that kick ass map ;).  And this is coming from someone who doesn't give a rats behind about such things :D.
Patience is a virtue, patience is a virtue, PATIENCE IS A F***ING VIRTUE.  There, now I might be able to follow it.

Regarding Cover art: "You have no control. If you’re really lucky you get an art director who will let you use Vaseline when he bends you over." -Glen Cook

ToddM326

  • Guest
Re: A Map (cont'd) Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers
« Reply #89 on: October 07, 2008, 08:50:23 PM »
kind of looks like a profile of a panda bear....