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Author Topic: Is Mac God?  (Read 16177 times)

Offline raidem

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Is Mac God?
« on: April 05, 2018, 03:28:30 PM »
We have Griffyn612 theory that Mac is a transubstantiated Raphael.  Considering the same evidence that Gryffyn puts forth for Mac to be Raphael, I'll put forth for him being God. 

So, do we have evidence that precludes Mac from being God?  What does it mean to be God within the Dresdenverse.  Definition of DF God: ?.

We know that Mac creates "God's brew". And He is often described as downright Angelic.

If Mac is indeed some projection of God, then it makes more sense that he was more of a target in Cold Days with the Outsider attack on Demonreach than we believed.  And Harry brought him there.  Mac couldn't compromise mortal free will, therefore he followed.  The attack on Demonreach with Mac upon the island then isn't possibly as much about destroying the island, releasing the sleepers, etc but doing away with God's projection within this reality.  I don't think it would really 'hurt' God so much but it could cause a wrinkle in the balance of power for a moment.  We now know per WOJ that God has commanded Outsiders to remain outside of Creation, outside of the Sandbox he has given us. However, he has given creation this sandbox, given mortals free will, so if we are going to wreck this creation by bringing in the void (Outsiders), then that is on us.

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A: Almighty isn't really about determining the order of the universe.  He isn't a GM.  He made us a sandbox game and then let us decide how to play it, and mod it.
   Now He's already told those forces, 'stay out of my sandbox' and they do.  But He's also gives us the sandbox.  And if we want to invite them in to screw it all up, well.  The void is still there.  Waiting.

I think even if God has settled on allowing Us to choose our Fate, I wouldn't put it past him to place a transubstantiated form in play of himself.  And who better for this form to be than a bartender making God's brew, interacting with a Starborn that will likely be the deciding factor in the Fate of the Universe/Multiverse.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2018, 04:38:19 PM by raidem »
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Offline raidem

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #1 on: April 05, 2018, 03:54:26 PM »
Is there a good thread on Mac out there that I can borrow from. I don't feel like going through and gathering all the heavenly references to Mac or his brew.  I found one.  Just linked a prior thread that hit upon much of the discussion.

Topic: Oh No! Another Mac WAG!  (Read 1569 times)
http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,49643.15.html
« Last Edit: April 05, 2018, 04:49:26 PM by raidem »
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Offline raidem

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2018, 04:53:48 PM »
Check out this thread for New WOJ's on God, Lucifer, and the argument between the two.

http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,51089.0.html

These WOJ's would have relevance to Mac should he be a projection/transubstantiated form of God.
Essentially, God considers his job done with respect to having given us the sandbox of creation.  It is up to us to keep it.  So, given this, I think God sees his role limited with respect to Outsiders, he has already commanded them to remain outside of the Sandbox but he has given us free will so if mortals open up a way for Outsiders to come in that is on us.  I could see God step in and take a transubstantiated form in pivotal times to take actions that he wouldn't be able to take as God.
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Offline Rasins

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2018, 06:13:17 PM »
Mac is not the White God.  Mac is a retired member of Merlin's inner circle.  He's the Beeromancer of the group.  Used to be a big partier, but now just likes to watch others have fun.
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Offline Snark Knight

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2018, 06:18:01 PM »
I don't see it. That maenad in the short story really put one over on Mac. It's one thing for him to respect mortal free will, but I don't see Mac letting a supernatural being mess with him like that if he had omniscience and omnipotence going for him.
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Offline nedserD C B yrraH

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2018, 06:24:37 PM »
Sharkface's reaction seemed less in line with meeting a remnant of TWG. I would expect more victory or gloating, less annoyance. Plus Mab's interaction with him on the island. And the whole "I'm out," thing doesn't seem possible for TWG since it is everything. IDK.
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Offline Quantus

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2018, 07:13:28 PM »
Quote from: nedserD C B yrraH on April 05, 2018, 06:24:37 PM
Sharkface's reaction seemed less in line with meeting a remnant of TWG. I would expect more victory or gloating, less annoyance. Plus Mab's interaction with him on the island. And the whole "I'm out," thing doesn't seem possible for TWG since it is everything. IDK.
Same.  Im not saying there arent more people like Nic that would love the chance to literally tweak God's nose, but the scenes we've had with people who know his deal just dont seem to fit right. 
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Offline jonas

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2018, 07:20:46 PM »
Sorta, yes, and definitely not...
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Offline Kindler

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2018, 07:32:03 PM »
Bluntly, I don't think so. Nor do I think he's Raphael.

I think he's Frankenstein's monster, a functionally immortal mortal who used to work at the Outer Gates as an assistant to the previous Gatekeeper because, due to his state, he is incorruptible.

Kidding. I don't know what he is. But I really, really doubt he's part of any Judeo-Christian hierarchy, TWG or otherwise.
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Offline peregrine

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2018, 09:01:06 PM »
No. 
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Offline wardenferry419

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2018, 11:47:41 PM »
Mac being TWG would be kinda boring. It least it would be to me.
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Offline raidem

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2018, 01:14:53 AM »
Well the way it could work for me is the Corwin=God angle where God really isn't TWG either.  He was just some entity in another work of fiction, the amberverse, that ended up creating a twinned multiverse.  I just then place this God construct over Corwin, and have him participating in things as Mac.

Now that Sid there clearly is a God vs. Lucifer argument going on.  So it isn't merely maneuvered, but I like this take because it downplays the religious connotations with him and makes h ok m into a dresden files being, not real life.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2018, 01:30:18 AM by raidem »
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Offline groinkick

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #12 on: April 06, 2018, 01:42:32 AM »
I don't think Mac is God because I think he'd be more active in the Denarian story line.  It would be very subtle, of course.  But he seems more involved with the Sidhe, Outsiders, and Demonreach possibly.
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Offline Griffyn612

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #13 on: April 06, 2018, 02:35:48 AM »
Seems unlikely.  Mac has never once mentioned skee ball.
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Offline jonas

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Re: Is Mac God?
« Reply #14 on: April 06, 2018, 06:45:48 AM »
Quote from: groinkick on April 06, 2018, 01:42:32 AM
I don't think Mac is God because I think he'd be more active in the Denarian story line.  It would be very subtle, of course.  But he seems more involved with the Sidhe, Outsiders, and Demonreach possibly.
That could mean they have orders to stay away too though... God and Lucifer want the Sandbox intact, His 'out' being respected by Denarians even should say WORLDS about his affiliations...
Id insist he is one of the angels whose Graces power the swords. Most likely the sword of love, cause of the Arthur connotations in his DR visit.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2018, 08:14:06 AM by jonas »
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