Nick and the Cup (New Theory?)

[Rasins]

We have WOJ that releasing them in the sense of breaking open the coins and letting them out, they'd be able to use their full un-restricted power on earth, but that it would destroy all kinds of cosmic balances. 

On the other hand, if Lucufer put them in the coins it might be possible for him to Replace them, which would put them back in Hell and entirely prevented from interacting with Earth the way the rest of the Fallen are.  Which seems to mean they can Choose to Act, but doing so provokes a response from Heaven, as was the case when Luficer intervened in SmF.

Do you mean like swap them out with other fallen?

[Quantus]

Do you mean like swap them out with other fallen?

Basically yes, though that is entirely speculation on my part.  Dont think either part can (easily) destroy their side of the Balance any more than I think either could actually "win" and entirely remove their opposite.  But since we do know that is was Lucifer's Choice as to whom got the coins in the first place, just like it remains God's Choice who gets offered a Sword, it seems reasonable that Lucifer (or I supposed whomever is currently in Charge down there if not Lucy) retains the right to Change his side's distribution. 

For example, maybe Lucifer is none too pleased that Lasciel's shadow so spectacularly Failed in tempting Harry, to the result of a Starborn wizard being granted Soulfire (yes it is more directly Luficer's own fault, but you try telling him that).

[Rasins]

While I like that idea, I don't think Lucifer has swapped any out.  That's not to say he can't, but it seems like Michael and the others knew all 30, and they haven't changed.

Then again, all records the Church kept have been destroyed over the centuries, so I suppose it could have happened.

[Quantus]

While I like that idea, I don't think Lucifer has swapped any out.  That's not to say he can't, but it seems like Michael and the others knew all 30, and they haven't changed.

Then again, all records the Church kept have been destroyed over the centuries, so I suppose it could have happened.

Oh, agreed, I have no reason at all to think he has done so already.  I just think it is the closest he can come to actually "freeing" one of the Denarian Fallen, since I dont believe he has the power/ability/freedom to actually destroy a Coin any more than Heaven can apparently take one completely out of Circulation.

[Rasins]

Ah .... Gotcha.

[Avernite]

My understanding of the Blackened Denarii is that it was Lucifer who bound thirty of his most troublesome employees to them to keep them out of contention for overthrowing the established order. These were those who had both ambition and enough power to make trouble for Lucy, especially working together. If anything could cancel out Lucy's binding, I'd imagine it would be something tied to the Anti-Lucifer. Not really sure the balance between thirty Coins and three Swords comes into play; just because something exists currently in balance doesn't mean that that balance can't be upturned—that was the crux of the plot in Summer Knight. It'd certainly be disastrous, but that's sort of the goal of Nic's plot.

And it'd also be cool to see what The White God does to counter such a move; I'd imagine Anduriel and Uriel wouldn't get along particularly well.

Well, an Archangel lent his Grace to countering it. I don't think he has many bigger tools to put in play...

Or for that matter bigger allies to throw in, since Mab and Hades were already in on this one (maybe not as allies by their own understanding, but eh).

[Kindler]

Well, an Archangel lent his Grace to countering it. I don't think he has many bigger tools to put in play...

Yeah, but that was just to counter a Fallen still trapped inside a Coin with a host; imagine Uriel vs. Anduriel without the whole host situation. Just raw, terrifying power.

For what it's worth, I'm reasonably certain Uriel would just sneeze and Anduriel would pop like a balloon.

[raidem]

I still think Uriel is trying to redeem Anduriel.  I mean they share part of the same name so I think there is a closer connection between these two angels than say two other angels with different names.

[WereElephant]

I still think Uriel is trying to redeem Anduriel.  I mean they share part of the same name so I think there is a closer connection between these two angels than say two other angels with different names.

Uriel apparently means something to the effect of "God is my light".

According to this reddit (https://www.reddit.com/r/dresdenfiles/comments/3hs0bj/anduriels_name/), Anduriel is a made up name.

The "el" suffix, as we know, is the "of God" portion of an angel's name, so removing that leaves "Uri" and "Anduri", or possibly "Ur" and "Andur", depending on how the construction works. "Anduri" could be construed as a direct negative of "Uri", like adding "dis" or "un" to a Latin root. While Uriel would mean "God is my light", Anduriel could mean something like "God is my darkness". That would imply that when Anduriel rebelled, he chose a rebellious name, overriding whatever his original God-given name was.

Based on that reasoning, either Anduriel is a moniker chosen out of spite and as foil to Uriel's office, or it is the original name of the Fallen Angel with a different and unknown root. In either case, though, Anduriel's name doesn't seem directly related to Uriel's.

I could easily be wrong, though. Etymology excites me, and I will readily follow linguistic rabbits down numerous holes.

[Lost Merlin]

I would think that based on the names and based on their jobs that Uriel is very closely linked to Anduriel.  When the linkage occurred is up for debate. 

Uriel - Spook of TWG.
Anduriel - Information Gathering Specialist. 

[Kindler]

I would think that based on the names and based on their jobs that Uriel is very closely linked to Anduriel.  When the linkage occurred is up for debate. 

Uriel - Spook of TWG.
Anduriel - Information Gathering Specialist.

For the record, "Anduriel" translates to something like "God is not my home" or "There is no God in my home." (A/An- prefixes in Latin/Greek literally translate as "Not," or "lacking." "Duriel" in Hebrew translates something like "My home is with God.")

But I agree, their roles are very similar, and their names both have "Uriel" in it. And Raidem, I believe that redemption is always the preferred option, and Uriel wishes it—but I also doubt he'd hesitate if that became impractical. Uriel and Anduriel mirror Michael and Nicodemus very well; we saw Michael desperately trying to save Nicodemus (in some of my favorite scenes in the series—notably, Nicodemus denies three times in Skin Game, if memory serves), but then saw him take the gloves off for the first time when it became clear it wouldn't work.

Not trying to start any real debate, but there have been theological arguments for centuries now over whether or not Fallen angels can be redeemed; many say no. I don't know how it works in the Dresden Files, but I'd guess that it's possible for it to happen, but like a psychologist's patient, they have to want to change (and ask for it).

[Rasins]

I would think that based on the names and based on their jobs that Uriel is very closely linked to Anduriel.  When the linkage occurred is up for debate. 

Uriel - Spook of TWG.
Anduriel - Information Gathering Specialist.

That would make sense with Anduriel's ability to know what's going on in shadows.

[raidem]

Hey, maybe Harry will change Anduriel's name.  Uriel felt the magnitude of Harry's naming.  If Harry so chose to name Anduriel differently, he could change Anduriel to something other than what he was.  Harry was able to name Lash and by doing so helped liberate her from Lasciel.  I think Harry could target Anduriel for redemption.

Harry has already changed the Denarians in general to Nickleheads, so he has already in a way degraded their strength.

So going with what some have said before about Anduriel vs. Duriel.  Maybe Harry will end up assisting Anduriel changing to Duriel.

[Lost Merlin]

Uriel apparently means something to the effect of "God is my light". ...
...The "el" suffix, as we know, is the "of God" portion of an angel's name, so removing that leaves "Uri" and "Anduri", or possibly "Ur" and "Andur", depending on how the construction works....

...Uriel felt the magnitude of Harry's naming.  If Harry so chose to name Anduriel differently, he could change Anduriel to something other than what he was.  Harry was able to name Lash and by doing so helped liberate her from Lasciel...

Just a side interesting thought.
I think Harry Shortened Uriel to Uri, which following Were's etymology would drop the 'el' getting rid of the 'of God' part of the name, maybe making Uriel fall or stripping him of his powers. 

[raidem]

Harry attempted to Name Uriel differently but got stared down and firmly corrected.  Harry revised the Name from Uri to Mr. Sunshine to which Uriel replied something to effect of "that's fine."

You guys think Harry will ever call Anduriel, "Duriel" in an attempt to change him?