Author Topic: Just a guess about Peace Talks  (Read 15413 times)

Offline KurtinStGeorge

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Just a guess about Peace Talks
« on: February 07, 2018, 10:23:22 PM »
There has been a trend of the Dresden Files novels getting longer, though Skin Game had a lower word count than Cold Days.  Also, if you compare the Cinder Spires book with the first book of the Alera series; well, there is no comparison.  "The Aeronaut's Windless"  a much longer and more involved story.  Now we know Jim has had various life issues which have contributed to Peace Talks taking so long to get done, but does anyone else think (because I do) that Peace Talks is going to be a more complex story (or have more stories to tell within it) than what we usually get from a Dresden Files novel?  I mean Skin Game had a pretty basic story idea; a heist story where Harry was forced to work with Nicodemus and both of them would try to double-cross one another.  There were of course unexpected complications, but I'm just talking about the main plot of the novel.  Many of the early novels had easily identifiable A and a B plots.  For example, in "Blood Rites" Harry is trying to stop an unknown foe who is using an entropy curse to kill people on a porn movie set and at the same time he's organizing a strike team to find and kill Mavra.  These A and B plots are often related to each other in ways that Harry didn't understand, but again, I'm just talking about the basic plot structure, not how various elements might be blended into the overall story arc. 

I'm thinking that in Peace Talks, Jim has more balls to juggle than in perhaps any other Dresden Files book before it.  If you've read the preview first chapter you know that
(click to show/hide)
So if you didn't read the spoiler there are two issues that Harry will be involved with in some manner.  However, that leaves many other potential complications that in themselves may become their own, let's call them C and D plots.  Not to mention that the first issue in the spoiler is a rather open-ended one.  It's not a straightforward idea like, I want you work with Nicodemus and “I expect you to skin them alive” or "They've taken our daughter."  We can only guess where this story element may go and there is really nothing in the earlier novels that might give us more than a tiny hint of how this could play out.

Jim has said that Changes, Ghost Story and Cold Days could be described as an internal trilogy within the series, that turns it in a new direction.  I would argue that Skin Game should be added to this list and call it a quadrilogy within the overall story arc, because SG settles the issue of the "parasite" inside Harry's head we learned about in Ghost Story and it demonstrated that Harry; though at times with some difficulty, was learning to control the Winter Knight's mantel.  So we had Harry's life deconstructed in Changes and it has taken until the end of Skin Game to see that a new life is now possible for him.  So now that Jim has fully turned the ship around that means Harry will face more complicated situations to untangle and I think they begin in Peace Talks.

Just to give one example, we don't know what the future holds for the White Council and its most prominent members.  In Changes it almost seemed like a civil war was possible or that a coup was about to take place.  I suspect Jim was setting up serious complications and likely endings for one or more characters on the Council.  I won't be surprised if we see one or more of those complications or endings happen in Peace Talks.  That is just one possible avenue Jim might explore.  Think about all the other possible complications that might arise, and even if only one or two come to a boil, you've got a bigger and hopefully engaging novel for us to (eventually) read, and one that takes some effort to tie together.  All that said, I'm hoping that really soon we will read that Jim has finished or as he has often done in the past, he announces that only the denouement is left to write.   

PS: If you would like to make a guess at likely complications or plot twists we might encounter, feel free to do so.  I think it's about time we start compiling a prediction list and later see who came closest to the mark.       
« Last Edit: February 12, 2018, 10:37:35 PM by KurtinStGeorge »
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Offline wardenferry419

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2018, 10:41:42 PM »
I am really hoping that the book has an "And then there were None" or "Clue" type murder mystery going on. BK14 and BK15 were missing the detective elements.
Thomas as new Lord Raith.
Justine gives birth to twins, one WCV and one normal.
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Offline RobReece

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2018, 10:51:56 PM »
I think that we will see a representative from the Government want a seat at the table.  Maybe the Librarians or Tilly.  They've noticed an escalation of the impact that the supernatural is having on the normal world and want in or something along those lines.

Offline KurtinStGeorge

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2018, 07:25:27 AM »
I think matters between Harry and Marcone will become tense, but it won't lead to open warfare between the two.  Instead, it will set up a meeting between Harry and Alt-Marcone in Mirror Mirror where Harry learns more than he ever could about the crime lord in his own reality.  That's a long-term guess.  In the short run I won't be surprised if at least one member on the White Council dies.  If it should be Ebenezer then Harry's position with the Council becomes more precarious.  Though I have to say I wouldn't be surprised if Luccio or Ramirez bought it in this one. 
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Offline Kindler

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2018, 02:49:32 PM »
I think you're right. I think Peace Talks is going to be a very, very complex story; it's a UN summit for the supernatural world. You have so many conflicting interests—in fact, to start, let me list what I think will be important players.

1. The White Council
2. The White Court
3. Winter (and Mab and Molly will likely have some kind of conflict)
4. Summer (Sarissa and Titania
5. Fomor
6. Marcone's Barony
7. Law enforcement
8. Wyldfae (though this may be tied to either of the above Fae courts; Wyldfae seem to have a predilection toward one side or another—although I do think that Kringle or the Erlking will be hanging around, along with the Za Lord's Guard)
9. The Circle/Black Council/Nemesis/Whatever
10. Monoc Securities
11. The Magical Have-Nots Desperately Trying to Stay Off the Radar
12. Miscellaneous others—Alphas, Elaine, Thomas/Justine (cuz I don't count them among the White Court), Mavra, Murphy (though she can be rolled into law enforcement), Mac, the Knights (mostly Butters—there is absolutely zero chance, in my opinion, that Butters doesn't play a part in Peace Talks, not after Skin Game), Paranetters (I'm separating Elaine from that; I also want to know what happened to Abby after getting gutshot in Ghost Story), and probably others I'm missing.
13. A dragon? Ferrovax or Pyrovax?
14. That shapeshifter freeholding lord Harry mentions in the end of White Night?

I do want Tilly to have a seat at the Big Kids' Table. It'll be especially interesting to me if he does it through working with Marcone. But Tilly was too cool of a character to waste, and WOJ confirmed that he'll be back eventually, so I'm thinking it might be in Peace Talks—someone's going to have to be providing the intelligence to the right people to organize a military strike against Kaiju come book 18-20something.

Anyway, with that huge array of conflicting interests, there is definitely going to be a whole swath of things for Harry to have to juggle. Add in Harry's conflicting loyalties—Winter, the White Council, his friends/Chicago, Demonreach—and you have a recipe for a great big mess. It's going to be a beautiful disaster and I can't wait.

Offline Rasins

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2018, 03:58:44 PM »
I'm wondering WHERE they'll hold the talks?  All those supernaturals and you can't just rent out a conference center.

Since it's in Chicago, do you think Marcone will host it at his place?  That would totally ruin his threshold.

I kind of doubt they'll want to have it at the BFS location.

DemonReach is out.

Any ideas?
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Offline Kindler

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2018, 04:08:55 PM »
Undertown?

Offline peregrine

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2018, 07:31:57 PM »
Justine gives birth to twins, one WCV and one normal.
I doubt it.  There's no real difference between them until they hit puberty as near as we can tell.  They've got to get that first kill before it happens.  Otherwise you get into some really messed up parts, like a toddler who eats sex, basically.  I can't imagine Jim wanting to go down that route.

Offline Rhetoric

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2018, 07:50:01 PM »
All those supernaturals and you can't just rent out a conference center.

Erm, why not, exactly?

Offline Griffyn612

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2018, 10:22:44 PM »
I said this a few years back, but since it's been a while, I'll rehash it.

My prediction/hope was that the Talks would be held in a hotel in Chicago (maybe the one from Skin Game, maybe the Rothchild from Summer Knight).  Harry would be there as the Winter Knight (escorting the Winter Lady).  It would be hosted by Marcone, with the hotel closed off to the general public, and a bunch of wards protecting the place.

It'd start with the attendees being introduced, and one of the reveals would be the Eebs arriving with a small retinue of Ramps (either as the inheritors of the Red Court, or as Fomor members).

Things would really snap off when one of the Eebs ended up dead, which would trigger wards that would lock down the hotel, preventing anyone from coming or going.  A bunch of powerful beings would be trapped together, none of them trusting each other, and believing the others are trying something.

Harry will be accused of the murder (something on the nose, like the Eeb being found frozen and shattered, a known method of execution for Harry now) and he'll have to solve the murder to clear his name, find the real killer, uncover the plot, and release the wards.

The sealed-off hotel would allow for that Shining-feel of isolated desperation. 

And of course, despite Harry's efforts, the Talks will be a disaster, people and things will die, the war will continue, and everyone will blame him.

Offline raidem

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2018, 10:57:12 PM »
 Wcv don't need to kill to be a wcv.  There are other ways Lord raith chose to bring his brood into power via kill during sex.  That doesn't mean there isn't a way to bring the phage into the world via a 'better' act.  I believe there is wojl that talks about this option.  It is also likely inari will come to power in a new way of things, maybe by actually loving someone during sex.  No death needed.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2018, 10:59:57 PM by raidem »
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Offline peregrine

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2018, 11:59:44 PM »
I'd like to see that WoJ, because Thomas flat out says the first time they feed it's always fatal.  With Inari possibly killing off her Hunger by having sex with someone she Loves as her first time.  And nothing I've read suggests there's some other way to fully become a WCV without sex (or fear or despair, if they're not of the Raith variety).

Offline RobReece

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2018, 06:14:26 AM »
I agree with Griffyn. 
I've also stated this before that since the first chapter stated that Marcone had already agreed to host the talks AND he already owns a hotel in Chicago, it would be be very easy for him to use that location.  And if any of the attendees need to relieve some stress, the Velvet Room, sorry Executive Priority Health Club, in the same building.

Offline exartiem

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2018, 12:27:56 AM »
The conference will likely be held in Undertown.

Offline Griffyn612

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Re: Just a guess about Peace Talks
« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2018, 12:35:34 AM »
I agree with Griffyn. 
I've also stated this before that since the first chapter stated that Marcone had already agreed to host the talks AND he already owns a hotel in Chicago, it would be be very easy for him to use that location.  And if any of the attendees need to relieve some stress, the Velvet Room, sorry Executive Priority Health Club, in the same building.
I don't know that Marcone would risk subjecting any of his employees to the tastes of monsters.  If he offered the service to one tasteful attendee but not an unsavory one, then it would appear to be favoritism, and would start things off on the wrong foot