Author Topic: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?  (Read 9858 times)

Offline MarcelRED147

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #15 on: September 18, 2017, 12:48:35 PM »
Not once it's revealed that Cowl is really Harry's time-traveled alternate dimension-hopping grandson through Maggie and Simon, who is currently living in the body of Justin DuMorne after Kemmler body-swapped him.

That's the current theory, yes?

Simon? As in Simon Pietrovich? That's dumb. Everyone knows that it's Dresden's grandkid through Maggie and time-travelling Steed.

Offline Snark Knight

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #16 on: September 18, 2017, 01:01:54 PM »
The other thing is questions of what counts as "involvement" with the court.
She can't just whack entirely unrelated people, but if you've done something that warrants her wanting revenge on you that badly, we're talking something more than just inhibiting her plans.  Which may include some other type of involvement.

I'm not sure Bob was even aware of Nemesis when he explained the Knight's role to Harry in terms of assassinating people the Queens couldn't touch for lack of "involvement" with Sidhe affairs, either. Which makes it difficult to definitely address whether spreading it counts as "involved".

Offline Rasins

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2017, 03:41:06 PM »
I think the real question is, what does "Attached" to one of the fae courts mean, when it comes to the Queen being able to do anything to them.
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Offline groinkick

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2017, 05:12:45 PM »
Or... he only finds out the identity after.

Remember, Jim doesn't enjoy torturing his characters, he enjoys torturing us.


Ooh yeah that's true...  Kills cowl, removes the mask *gasp*, *tears streaming down his cheeks* "why?"  "WHY!?"
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Offline dspringer1

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #19 on: September 18, 2017, 10:55:18 PM »
What we know or can be fairly certain about
* If you attack Mab directly, she can kill you. 
* If you are a random mortal, she can use her knight to kill you - but is unlikely to do so unless she has a reason.
* We do know that Aurora was able to attack Murphy ineffectually with the plant monster.  Enough to cause some bruises perhaps, but nothing more.   
*  We also know that the same restrictions apply to any agent Mab directs to harm you. 



Speculation
*  I think the restrictions on her actions are quite severe or she would not need a knight.  if all it takes is some illusion to manufacture a token offensive action against Mab, that would be child play for Mab to arrange.   
*  Equally sure, Mab can do all sorts of bad stuff to you that is NOT prohibited by this stricture.  Things like imprisoning you for a thousand years in a block of ice...   Yet that too seems a significant loophole.  I wonder if Mab's actual restrictions are much more than simply a limit against killing a mortal.   
*  Ditto with selecting an agent which is likely to harm you "on their own"   Seems a huge loophole. 


My own personal feeling is that the actual restriction is much broader than simply killing someone.  I think Mab is prohibited from harming directly or even somewhat indirectly any mortal that does not "choose" to involve themselves in fey business.    This includes her taking actions that are likely to result in harm, even if she does not direct it.   However, she is allowed to create conditions where an enemy feels motivated to attack or harm Mab in some way.  But they must be in the wrong, not Mab.   

Offline Rasins

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #20 on: September 19, 2017, 05:41:32 PM »
Not to pick nits (but then again, isn't that why we're here?) but didn't the Chlorofiend really try to avoid Murphy.  And any bumps or bruises we know of came from, for instance, Harry dumping out the marbles?
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Offline jonas

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2017, 05:50:05 PM »
Not to pick nits (but then again, isn't that why we're here?) but didn't the Chlorofiend really try to avoid Murphy.  And any bumps or bruises we know of came from, for instance, Harry dumping out the marbles?
Yea that was my point earlier. iirc the chlorofiend was Aurora's construct from what Harry Thinks, which that would confirm imo. It's inability to assault Murphy was because she was simply being mortal Murphy, Officer at law, maker of Choices.
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Offline Rasins

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #22 on: September 19, 2017, 05:58:13 PM »
Yea that was my point earlier. iirc the chlorofiend was Aurora's construct from what Harry Thinks, which that would confirm imo. It's inability to assault Murphy was because she was simply being mortal Murphy, Officer at law, maker of Choices.

Sorry, I was replying to dspringer1's post.
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Offline Snark Knight

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #23 on: September 19, 2017, 06:44:35 PM »
*  Ditto with selecting an agent which is likely to harm you "on their own"   Seems a huge loophole. 

Somebody put the Hobs on a collision course with Ivy. And I don't see how it suits Nemfected Maeve to try to kill her off before Nemfected Tessa / Rosanna / Namshiel (or some combination of the three) got a chance to subvert Nic's plan and seize her for their own interests. Mab outright said the enemy could not be allowed to gain the child archive's power.

Offline jonas

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #24 on: September 19, 2017, 08:14:07 PM »
Sorry, I was replying to dspringer1's post.
....So... i'm not 'allowed' to reply to yours in tandem lol?
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Offline forumghost

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #25 on: September 19, 2017, 09:20:37 PM »
Somebody put the Hobs on a collision course with Ivy. And I don't see how it suits Nemfected Maeve to try to kill her off before Nemfected Tessa / Rosanna / Namshiel (or some combination of the three) got a chance to subvert Nic's plan and seize her for their own interests. Mab outright said the enemy could not be allowed to gain the child archive's power.

I don't know that Mab would be foolish enough to send a bunch of useless Mooks after the friggin Archive though.

That's kinda like sending a bunch of Ants to fight a Foot.

Offline Trebek

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #26 on: September 19, 2017, 09:35:49 PM »
Somebody put the Hobs on a collision course with Ivy. And I don't see how it suits Nemfected Maeve to try to kill her off before Nemfected Tessa / Rosanna / Namshiel (or some combination of the three) got a chance to subvert Nic's plan and seize her for their own interests. Mab outright said the enemy could not be allowed to gain the child archive's power.

I believe the Archive is a signatory to the Unseelie Accords, which means that at some point, that entity made a deal with Mab. 

Offline dspringer1

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #27 on: September 19, 2017, 10:32:34 PM »
Quote
Not to pick nits (but then again, isn't that why we're here?) but didn't the Chlorofiend really try to avoid Murphy.  And any bumps or bruises we know of came from, for instance, Harry dumping out the marbles?

You are right of course.   All of the serious injuries came from the ghoul (who was Ace's agent) or harry himself.  Whatever injuries the chlorofiend inflicted were very minor and almost certainly immaterial.


Offline dspringer1

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #28 on: September 19, 2017, 10:36:14 PM »
Separate question.

Murphy took a chain saw to the chlorofiend and it hurt Aurora -- clearly she felt a lot of pain from the (iron assisted) attack.   However, I do not recall the chlorofiend suddenly being able to target Murphy freely after this point.   

Why would attacking an Aurora possessed plant creature not constitute involving herself in faerie?  I had always assumed that attacking a queen freed them up to counter-attack.   But this example proves me wrong (if I am remembering it correctly at least). 

I am not sure myself, so I think I am missing something.

Offline Rasins

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Re: How far can Mab go to seek revenge on a mortal?
« Reply #29 on: September 20, 2017, 02:23:26 PM »
Separate question.

Murphy took a chain saw to the chlorofiend and it hurt Aurora -- clearly she felt a lot of pain from the (iron assisted) attack.   However, I do not recall the chlorofiend suddenly being able to target Murphy freely after this point.   

Why would attacking an Aurora possessed plant creature not constitute involving herself in faerie?  I had always assumed that attacking a queen freed them up to counter-attack.   But this example proves me wrong (if I am remembering it correctly at least). 

I am not sure myself, so I think I am missing something.

I would say it's because she wasn't attacking the Queen.  She was attacking something the Queen was animating.  Further she didn't know it was the Queen.

Lastly, it's entirely possible that Aurora's Nemfection just didn't let her think along those lines.
At times I wish I had a clone, but then I realize, I could never live with that a-hole.

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