A warden's sword for Harry...

[LordDresden2]

WoJ somewhere saying something about if Harry used a sword he'd fall and stab himself on it.  Think he was answering a question about the Summer Knight having a sword, and if Harry would get one.

So my personal opinion is he won't be getting one based on what Jim said.

It's true that to use a sword effectively takes practice and training, quite a bit of it.  You need a certain basic amount just to avoid making the sword more dangerous to you than your foe, and more yet to use it well.

That's true of all weapons, of course, but more so of sword and their kin than things like guns.  One of the early reasons for the adoption of firearms as weapons, even aside from their power, was that you could learn to use one effectively more quickly than you could older weapons.  That was part of why guns were in use even when they still weren't all that much more potent than blades and bows yet.

[Quantus]

It's true that to use a sword effectively takes practice and training, quite a bit of it.  You need a certain basic amount just to avoid making the sword more dangerous to you than your foe, and more yet to use it well.

That's true of all weapons, of course, but more so of sword and their kin than things like guns. One of the early reasons for the adoption of firearms as weapons, even aside from their power, was that you could learn to use one effectively more quickly than you could older weapons.  That was part of why guns were in use even when they still weren't all that much more potent than blades and bows yet.

Philosophically I entirely disagree with this, just because I think it take a hell of a lot of training and practice to safety use a gun in a combat situation, or anywhere outside a controlled space like a gunrange.  The only difference I see versus a Sword is that a Sword take a lot more training before it becomes truly dangerous, whereas a gun can accidentally kill in anyone's hands. But being able to Kill somebody is the lowest possible bar for competency, a monkey with a stick can do that.  Guns won out over swords in warfar because they were cheaper than crossbows and it was a lot easier to just hand one to untrained conscript and point him in the general direction of the enemy. But that didnt stop lots of them from accidentally loading a dozen balls into their musket and never realizing they failed to fire it (a common occurrence in the US revolution and Civil war era's). 

[Snark Knight]

One of the early reasons for the adoption of firearms as weapons, even aside from their power, was that you could learn to use one effectively more quickly than you could older weapons.  That was part of why guns were in use even when they still weren't all that much more potent than blades and bows yet.

By some measures, after the use of armor trailed off again, bows were better until well into the 1800's. The problem was it took decades of practice for an archer to get to peak performance, and given that most military purposes were shooting into a crowd rather than trying to pick off specific targets, it just wasn't worth the training time.

[Quantus]

By some measures, after the use of armor trailed off again, bows were better until well into the 1800's. The problem was it took decades of practice for an archer to get to peak performance, and given that most military purposes were shooting into a crowd rather than trying to pick off specific targets, it just wasn't worth the training time.

Which in turn is why the Crossbow was such a big advancement.  Much less skill required, and far less reliant on individual arm strength.  Where it still fell short vs firearms was in the ammunition logistics (ie cost and volume).  A crossbowman could go through similar numbers of Bolts as an archer did Arrows, and it took literal wagon-loads to keep a longbowman firing throughout an engagement, and arrows required trained (if modest) craftsmen.  By comparison, lead and powder are bulk commodities, and anyone with a campfire and a plier-like mold could make musket-balls. 

[khadgar4606]

WoJ somewhere saying something about if Harry used a sword he'd fall and stab himself on it.  Think he was answering a question about the Summer Knight having a sword, and if Harry would get one.

So my personal opinion is he won't be getting one based on what Jim said.

harry cant use a sword unless that sword has intellectus of how to wield it so he is better use kusunagii( which comes with spirit of blade thanks to japanese smithing) instead of warden swords by the way BAKAİ!

[Rasins]

Seems to me that Harry's training with the quarter staff was time better spent than time training with a sword he didn't receive. 

And I thought Harry said he was a far better fencer than swordsman. That he had reach enough to hit from the next county over.  Though I thought a fencer WAS a swordsman.

[DonBugen]

Sorry, but I don't believe that Harry will ever get a Warden's sword.  It seems to me that Jim is purposefully holding Harry back from wielding any sword.  Considering Harry's slow but steady change of opinion in regards to God, faith, his devotion to Magic, the fuzzy undefined nature of the White God in the Dresden Files, and his respect to the Swords - not to mention Michael's subtle actions indicating that he believes Harry could be a wielder - I personally believe that Harry will one day be put in a position in which he's forced to take up the Sword of Love, and thus discard one Mantle of power for another.  He's being prepared for it.

Yeah, it's currently a huge stretch for his character, but that's the fun thing about predicting things that will happen in the Big Apocalyptic Trilogy.  If a halfhearted Baptist, an Atheist, and a Jew can be a Knight of the Cross, then I don't see why a wizard can't.

[Quantus]

Seems to me that Harry's training with the quarter staff was time better spent than time training with a sword he didn't receive. 

And I thought Harry said he was a far better fencer than swordsman. That he had reach enough to hit from the next county over.  Though I thought a fencer WAS a swordsman.

Cant find the correct passage off-hand, but I think he just meant that his reach makes up for his overall lack of skill, but only when applied to that one specific type of swordmanship. 

[Rasins]

Cant find the correct passage off-hand, but I think he just meant that his reach makes up for his overall lack of skill, but only when applied to that one specific type of swordmanship. 

Agreed.  I wasn't suggesting that he was a good fencer, just that he thinks he knows how to keep the pointy end out of himself.

[kazimmoinuddin]

While Harry will never full become a warden, the sword is a powerful and capable foci, with its ability to attack magic. With the inevitable large scale combat approaching, such a force multiplier would be invaluable.

[groinkick]

Harry's sword training

[Quantus]

Agreed.  I wasn't suggesting that he was a food fencer, just that he thinks he knows how to keep the pointy end out of himself.

Oh agreed.  I was just equally confused by the apparent distinction between a fencer and a swordsman. 

While Harry will never full become a warden, the sword is a powerful and capable foci, with its ability to attack magic. With the inevitable large scale combat approaching, such a force multiplier would be invaluable.

Harry's quite literally More Warden than any other person on the Council; Even setting aside that he's a fully empowered Regional Commander with other wardens under his command (Pre-death, at least) he's also THE Warden, occupying the original role which all the others are just a pale imitation of. 

[kazimmoinuddin]

We are pretty sure the circle has mortal magic users at their disposal, so having a sword to counter them would be useful. There are going to be done council traitors, so Harry might himself may need to face warden swords.

[LordDresden2]

harry cant use a sword unless that sword has intellectus of how to wield it so he is better use kusunagii( which comes with spirit of blade thanks to japanese smithing) instead of warden swords by the way BAKAİ!

Even if he had intellectus for us, unless that extended to physical things he would still have to train his body and train his reflexes to use his knowledge.  Even if Harry somehow had the knowledge of the world's greatest swordsman, his body would still have to be trained to use that knowledge effectively.

[LordDresden2]

Philosophically I entirely disagree with this, just because I think it take a hell of a lot of training and practice to safety use a gun in a combat situation, or anywhere outside a controlled space like a gunrange.

Not as much as swords, or longbows, or the like.