Vampiric Mental Attacks

[rientelfon]

Hey everyone,

It has been a little while since I posted a question, but recently I got to think a little more about mental attacks, the variety of mental attacks, and the targets of these types of attacks.

Question #1: Are White Court Vampires immune to attempts by other White Court Vampire uses of their Invoke Emotion ability? This may have been covered in the books, but I can't seem to recall if this was ever stated explicitly.

Question #2. Would a zombie (undead creation) be immune to the mental attacks of a White Court Vampire? This to me makes sense if they are immune, since they are just animated and are performing actions as directed by the creator thus having no real motivations or mind.

Question #3: Would constructs be immune to the mental attacks of a White Court Vampire? This seems like the would be immune much to the same as my thoughts on question #2.

What does everyone else think? Do I have it right?

Thanks in advance! 

[Shaft]

#1: Are White Court Vampires immune to attempts by other White Court Vampire uses of their Invoke Emotion ability?

I don't think so.  However, most White Court have a pretty high Discipline, so they'd be harder to influence.

#2. Would a zombie (undead creation) be immune to the mental attacks of a White Court Vampire? This to me makes sense if they are immune, since they are just animated and are performing actions as directed by the creator thus having no real motivations or mind.

If the creature has a mental or social stress track, I'd think it can be affected.  An "automaton" type of undead like a skeleton or animated corpse would be immune.  Undead that is sentient like a vampire or even some types of spirits would not.  I would think that if the creature is capable of choosing to run away to preserve itself, it can be affected by emotion control. [/quote]

Question #3: Would constructs be immune to the mental attacks of a White Court Vampire? This seems like the would be immune much to the same as my thoughts on question #2.

I think so.

These answers are my interpretation, of course, so feel free to disagree with me or better yet, prove me wrong.

[nadia.skylark]

Question #1: Are White Court Vampires immune to attempts by other White Court Vampire uses of their Invoke Emotion ability? This may have been covered in the books, but I can't seem to recall if this was ever stated explicitly.

Definitely not--it's the way Lord Raith controlled his daughters, and the way Lara now controls him.

[rientelfon]

Definitely not--it's the way Lord Raith controlled his daughters, and the way Lara now controls him.

This is accurate, initially I thought differently, but Quantus clarified for me.

I don't think so.  However, most White Court have a pretty high Discipline, so they'd be harder to influence.

I could see this and agree.

If the creature has a mental or social stress track, I'd think it can be affected.  An "automaton" type of undead like a skeleton or animated corpse would be immune.  Undead that is sentient like a vampire or even some types of spirits would not.  I would think that if the creature is capable of choosing to run away to preserve itself, it can be affected by emotion control.

The "automaton" type of undead was the type I was going for when thinking about the question. Seems to make sense that you can't really mess with their minds.

[Quantus]

I don't think this is accurate, because Lord Raith could not use his powers because he could not feed. This was the reason he was so crippled and actually not a threat to Lara once she decided to take control of the House of Raith.

That was only in the most recent couple decades.  He'd had centuries to establish his dominance with his daughters (and get his bluff in) before he was crippled.  Only Thomas and Inari came of age in that time; Thomas was protected by Papa Wraiths heterosexual preferences, and Inari was freed of the Wampire world before it became an issue. 

[rientelfon]

That was only in the most recent couple decades.  He'd had centuries to establish his dominance with his daughters (and get his bluff in) before he was crippled.  Only Thomas and Inari came of age in that time; Thomas was protected by Papa Wraiths heterosexual preferences, and Inari was freed of the Wampire world before it became an issue. 

Sorry, I stand corrected. Thanks for clarifying.

[Ulfgeir]

Hey everyone,

It has been a little while since I posted a question, but recently I got to think a little more about mental attacks, the variety of mental attacks, and the targets of these types of attacks.

Question #1: Are White Court Vampires immune to attempts by other White Court Vampire uses of their Invoke Emotion ability? This may have been covered in the books, but I can't seem to recall if this was ever stated explicitly.

The rulebooks does not say, but we do know from the actual Dresden files-books that they are most assuredly not imune. The one time we see it on stage is in the "Bigfoot on campus"-story.

/Ulfgeir

[Mr. Death]

Lara also uses her vampire mojo against Madeline in Turn Coat pretty directly.

[Lawgiver]

Hey everyone,

It has been a little while since I posted a question, but recently I got to think a little more about mental attacks, the variety of mental attacks, and the targets of these types of attacks.

Question #1: Are White Court Vampires immune to attempts by other White Court Vampire uses of their Invoke Emotion ability? This may have been covered in the books, but I can't seem to recall if this was ever stated explicitly.

Question #2. Would a zombie (undead creation) be immune to the mental attacks of a White Court Vampire? This to me makes sense if they are immune, since they are just animated and are performing actions as directed by the creator thus having no real motivations or mind.

Question #3: Would constructs be immune to the mental attacks of a White Court Vampire? This seems like the would be immune much to the same as my thoughts on question #2.

What does everyone else think? Do I have it right?

Thanks in advance! 

I would think it would depend on whether or not the entity the WCV was directing its abilities at were capable of experiencing the emotions being projected.

1. A WCV would be susceptible to other WCVs. This is proven in BR, when Lara whammies Papa Raith > WCV to WCV directly.  That might be looked at as "same type" meaning Lust vs. Lust = no immunity, whereas Raith Lust vs. Malvora Fear maybe not?  Very hard to tell.  I'll stand on, if they can experience the emotion they're not immune.

2. Can it feel emotion? And, even if so, can it feel the emotion being projected.  For example, while a zombie might feel an emotion we might call hunger, can it feel something like the Lust projected by a Raith, or the Malvora's fear?

3. Like #2, can the construct feel experience the emotion?  Can a Raith "seduce" a truck or a Malvora scare an elevator?  Constructs are primarily machines and don't have emotions, so aren't susceptible to emotional manipulation any more than a camera or a garbage disposal.

I agree with the precept that the target would have to have an appropriate stress track... I'm not sure which one would be most appropriate.  I'm fairly sure the Social one has some applicability, because that's the one where a character can be made to feel shame - an emotion.  Mental is far more for concentration and memory recall so I'm ambivalent whether it would apply.