Focus item

[Hogeyhead]

Alright I have a focus item question. The game states that if you make a focus item dedicated to just one spell you get one free upgrade point. Considering how limited focus items are in some ways, this could be very useful. However when they say 'one spell' how restricted are we talking? Are we talking the same as a rote, or is there some amount of flexibility?

[Sanctaphrax]

It says

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such as an established evocation rote or a divination spell that always looks for the same thing

so I don't think there's much flexibility. Never seen a player take that option, probably because it's so unappealingly narrow.

[Gilitine_Memitim]

I have. I had a baseball bat for my kinetomancer that worked the same way each time. It was a simple force spell like harry's rings but a bigger. It was fun. Bazooka powered force push from swinging a baseball bat. But practitioners are narrow focused anyways.

[Hogeyhead]

For most applications I have to agree. However I had a thought. next refresh I will have 2 power specialization in air (and 1 control) sometime soon (I don't know when, but likely 5-6 skill points from now so actually not that soon) I'll have 5 conviction. if I take a refresh to get a two (therefore 3) point focus I will have an effective conviction for one defensive rote of 10. then I decide to draw 13 shifts of power for the rote, dedicating two for duration I could have a shield that I could cast with just stress at least once of 11 that lasts three full rounds (whatever they are called in this system I can never remember). In any case I feel that 11 is just a lot more appealing than 10 as just one lucky shot kills it, and sometimes the stuff we face is just that nasty. Eventually as I get more points in specialization I will be able to cast it for less and less stress. Okay my effective discipline for this rote will be a pitiful 5-7 or something, but rotes specify that you can still apply aspects to help control, unless there was an errata or something...
Eventually I guess I could make a second focus that would help with control in the exact same way...

[blackstaff67]

For most applications I have to agree. However I had a thought. next refresh I will have 2 power specialization in air (and 1 control) sometime soon (I don't know when, but likely 5-6 skill points from now so actually not that soon) I'll have 5 conviction. if I take a refresh to get a two (therefore 3) point focus I will have an effective conviction for one defensive rote of 10. then I decide to draw 13 shifts of power for the rote, dedicating two for duration I could have a shield that I could cast with just stress at least once of 11 that lasts three full rounds (whatever they are called in this system I can never remember). In any case I feel that 11 is just a lot more appealing than 10 as just one lucky shot kills it, and sometimes the stuff we face is just that nasty. Eventually as I get more points in specialization I will be able to cast it for less and less stress. Okay my effective discipline for this rote will be a pitiful 5-7 or something, but rotes specify that you can still apply aspects to help control, unless there was an errata or something...
Eventually I guess I could make a second focus that would help with control in the exact same way...

If it's a Rote spell, then you automatically control it.  If you're calling up more shifts then your Conviction + Foci plusses you will take Mental stress over and above the normal one-stress hit for casting a spell. 
Example:  I have Conviciton of 5.  I have +2 for Power in Air.  I have a Foci that gives me a +2 for defensive power and a +1 for defensive control (for those moments when the spell I cast isn't a rote spell).  I can safely cast a nine-shift rote spell for defensive purposes for only one-stress.  If I cast a ten-shift rote defensive spell, then I'll be taking two stress to cast it.

And yeah, not sure about Aspects for defensive spells.

[Haru]

Huh. I know I read about that, but I've never seen it in play. Never even thought about using it myself. This could have potential for some characters.

But yeah, definitely tied to a rote spell. Not even an extra rote spell, just one of your rote spells.

[Hogeyhead]

If it's a Rote spell, then you automatically control it.  If you're calling up more shifts then your Conviction + Foci plusses you will take Mental stress over and above the normal one-stress hit for casting a spell. 
Example:  I have Conviciton of 5.  I have +2 for Power in Air.  I have a Foci that gives me a +2 for defensive power and a +1 for defensive control (for those moments when the spell I cast isn't a rote spell).  I can safely cast a nine-shift rote spell for defensive purposes for only one-stress.  If I cast a ten-shift rote defensive spell, then I'll be taking two stress to cast it.

And yeah, not sure about Aspects for defensive spells.

You don't automatically control it. You are considered to roll a 0 on your dicipline roll for control. You can have a rote that automatically gives fallout/backlash, unless there was an errata...

[Taran]

You don't automatically control it. You are considered to roll a 0 on your dicipline roll for control. You can have a rote that automatically gives fallout/backlash,

This.

If you have a spell that is Power 9 but your control is only 5, you are considered to have rolled +0 on your dice.  You, therefore, must take 4 points of backlash or fallout.

You may invoke aspects and use fps to make up the difference.

It's great for a big hit that you build towards, if you design a rote that way.  Take a round or two to get some maneuvers out, then throw out a big spell.

[dragoonbuster]

You may invoke aspects and use fps to make up the difference.

As far as my own table's interpretation of this, the use of those aspects must also be built into the rote or they can't be used towards the control--otherwise, it's not the same exact spell being cast each time. You can still use aspects to improve your targeting roll either way.

To continue using your example Taran, if you wanted to cast that Power 9 rote without Backlash/Fallout, you'd have to specify the tag/invocation of [Gathered Power] and invocation of your High Concept (or any specific, legitimate combination of two aspects) in the definition of the rote.

[blackstaff67]

This.

If you have a spell that is Power 9 but your control is only 5, you are considered to have rolled +0 on your dice.  You, therefore, must take 4 points of backlash or fallout.

You may invoke aspects and use fps to make up the difference.

It's great for a big hit that you build towards, if you design a rote that way.  Take a round or two to get some maneuvers out, then throw out a big spell.

Ah, page 258 YS.  My bad.  Sorry for the erroneous advice.

[Taran]

As far as my own table's interpretation of this, the use of those aspects must also be built into the rote or they can't be used towards the control--otherwise, it's not the same exact spell being cast each time. You can still use aspects to improve your targeting roll either way.

To continue using your example Taran, if you wanted to cast that Power 9 rote without Backlash/Fallout, you'd have to specify the tag/invocation of [Gathered Power] and invocation of your High Concept (or any specific, legitimate combination of two aspects) in the definition of the rote.

I'm not so strict with that.  But every table is different.

[Lavecki121]

Probably a good enough place for this question without starting a new thread. Crafting Specialization works the same as Evocation/Thaumaturgy specialization correct? -1 to gain two specializations? Or is it completely separate. Its been a while since i have looked into these rules.

Thanks guys

[Taran]

Crafting is a thaumaturgy specialty so it fits into your thaum pyramid. 

Frequency and power are the two crafting specialties. 

[Lavecki121]

Thanks Taran

So If I am reading this correctly (which i doubt) I would have Summoning, Binding, Conjuration, Divination, Veils, Wards and Crafting for my Thaumaturgy pyramid?

EDIT: Or would it be based on thematics? Biomancy, Diabolism, Ectomancy, Entropomancy, Necromancy, Photomancy, Psychomancy,Crafting?

EDIT: EDIT: Trying to get a tree for my crafting specialization basically.

[Taran]

They are both right.

I can see crafting as a thematic specialty.

But it can also be a type of thaumaturgy. 

So, if you are a crafter, you could have crafting themed wards, binding etc...
IMO.

But if you are a diabolist, your crafting will be all demon-themed.

If you are a straight up thaumaturgist, crafting is one of the categories for your pyramid.