How effective is a threshold?

[Researcher]

Now, I get that a wizard crossing a threshold uninvited will leave his power "caught" in the threshold, or most of it.  My question is this; If, say, Harry were to make a pair of potions, one that made someone very strong, and another that made them very tough, and gave them to, oh, Murphy, then sent her into a home uninvited, and she takes the potions after crossing the threshold, what happens?

Do the potions have no effect?  Full effect?  Somewhere in the middle? 

Same question for something along the lines of Harry's force rings.  If he made one of those for Murph, and she went inside a home uninvited with the ring fully charged with kinetic energy, would it work?

I'm going to be dealing with these questions in-game soon, and I'm waffling on where to go with it.  My first inclination is to lower the effectiveness of the potions slightly, reducing the effective strength one level, and to have the enchanted item fail completely, but I'm open to other suggestions.

Thanks in advance for the input.

[RonLugge]

In each case, I'd subtract shifts from the effect equal to the threshold rating.  So if you had a 4-shift kinetic ring attack, and walked into a house with a threshold of 2, your weapon:4 attack is now weapon: 2.  If the threshold was 4, well, I'd allow the (technically illegal, since spells 'must' have one shift) weapon:0 attack.  A threshold of 5 would shut down the ring entirely.

As for the potions... again, just subtract shifts.  If that makes them stop working, well, oops.  No more potion effects.

[Lonelylurker]

This brings up another question.

In this example the person using the item/potion is different from it's creator, What would happen if the bearer had an invitation to cross the Threshold but the enchanter didn't, or vice-versa?

[Jabberwocky]

Two options, basically:
1) Solve it as a block. I'd subtract the rating of the threshold/ward from any (reasonably affected) magical effect and call it a day.
2) Solve it as a compel. I'd just compel a relevant aspect (e.g. the High Concept of the caster) and let the effect be somehow affected by the threshold/ward or fail utterly. This option allows for more narrative freedom. Worth a FP, of course. If the wielder is the one affected by the compel rather than the caster the FP should go the wielder's way.

[Ardrikk]

Personally, I would not have potions or enchanted items be affected by a threshold at all. They're static magic bound into some inanimate object and inanimate objects can't be invited in. When their effects are used, no one is actively drawing on any magical power, as the magic is already set and self-contained.

[RonLugge]

Personally, I would not have potions or enchanted items be affected by a threshold at all. They're static magic bound into some inanimate object and inanimate objects can't be invited in. When their effects are used, no one is actively drawing on any magical power, as the magic is already set and self-contained.

From a balance perspective, crafter type wizards are already a tad bit too powerful.  I don't think handing them more power is a good approach.

From a reality perspective... the item itself may or may not be invited in, but the bearer definitely can be.  Using a magic item simply makes it an extension of your own abilities.

[Theogony_IX]

I might do it one of two ways for enchanted items:

1) An enchanted item is what it is.  But the wizard may not be able to pull up enough 'will' to trigger the item.  I might have the wizard roll against the threshold to summon enough will to trigger the item.  Fail, no trigger.  Tie, maybe face stress equal to the effect strength (or roll to defend against an attack equal to the effect strength).  Success, item is triggered without a hitch.

2)  Compel the wizard to be unable to trigger the item.

I would decide between these based on the situation.  If it's the beginning of the scene and this will likely end the scene quickly, I'd go with the compel to avoid an anticlimax (unless the anticlimax is worth having).  If they've been at the scene for a while and have exhausted quite a few other options and this might mean the difference between success or failure, then I'd go with the roll.

For potions though . . . there really isn't any will involved.  I think I'd just handle them through compels.  They've been discovered, you spill it, it gets ruined somehow, it doesn't work the way you want, etc.

[Ardrikk]

From a balance perspective, crafter type wizards are already a tad bit too powerful.  I don't think handing them more power is a good approach.

From a reality perspective... the item itself may or may not be invited in, but the bearer definitely can be.  Using a magic item simply makes it an extension of your own abilities.

Would you rule that Harry's duster wouldn't give him the magical protection that's been ensorcelled into it while he was inside a home, with a threshold, that he hasn't been invited into?

[RonLugge]

Would you rule that Harry's duster wouldn't give him the magical protection that's been ensorcelled into it while he was inside a home, with a threshold, that he hasn't been invited into?

In a heartbeat.  There's a reason things that go bump in the night respect thresholds, after all.

[Jabberwocky]

It also depends on the emphasis. How powerful does the group/GM want thresholds to be? In our game thresholds are a serious thing that offers protection and can't be taken lightly. But this can vary in other games.

[Researcher]

Wow, thanks, everyone.  You've given me some definite food for thought, here. 

Hopefully, I settle on a solid strategy before game night!

[Taran]

In each case, I'd subtract shifts from the effect equal to the threshold rating.  So if you had a 4-shift kinetic ring attack, and walked into a house with a threshold of 2, your weapon:4 attack is now weapon: 2.  If the threshold was 4, well, I'd allow the (technically illegal, since spells 'must' have one shift) weapon:0 attack.  A threshold of 5 would shut down the ring entirely.

As for the potions... again, just subtract shifts.  If that makes them stop working, well, oops.  No more potion effects.

I'd go with this, regardless of who's wielding them.  If you get invited in, then you're good. 

[Arcane]

In each case, I'd subtract shifts from the effect equal to the threshold rating.  So if you had a 4-shift kinetic ring attack, and walked into a house with a threshold of 2, your weapon:4 attack is now weapon: 2.  If the threshold was 4, well, I'd allow the (technically illegal, since spells 'must' have one shift) weapon:0 attack.  A threshold of 5 would shut down the ring entirely.

As for the potions... again, just subtract shifts.  If that makes them stop working, well, oops.  No more potion effects.

So what would happen if an item anyone could use or potion was given to or taken by someone who's home it is or was invited in?  Would the suppression of its power by the Threshold lift or would it still be in effect due to being brought in by someone uninvited?

[RonLugge]

So what would happen if an item anyone could use or potion was given to or taken by someone who's home it is or was invited in?  Would the suppression of its power by the Threshold lift or would it still be in effect due to being brought in by someone uninvited?

Trying to parse your question, but the point is that the *bearer* of the item must be invited in, or the item grounds out on the threshold.  When you're invited in, anything you're carrying with you is invited as well.  Something of a two-edged sword.

[Taran]

I'm invited in with my potions of doom.  My wizard friend is not.  I toss a couple of potions his way, after we're inside.  Do they get reduced?

I might say no...but would, instead, give the wizard a penalty to use them.  Or just say they get reduced because they wizard is activating them.  In any case, I think there would be some kind of draw-back to the action due to the threshold.