How often to actually give Significant Milestones

[Ardrikk]

So, when running Dresden Files, how often do you give out Significant Milestones?

The book suggests at the end of a Scenario (Adventure), but it also suggests this will happen every 2-3 sessions. I don't know about anyone else, but my Scenarios don't end that quickly. It seems to me that a Scenario is a specific arc that isn't finished until the bad guy's immediate plan is foiled or the immediate problem is solved.

But is that stretching these Significant Milestones out too far for the purposes of player advancement?  Thoughts?

[blackstaff67]

Depends.  Speaking from personal experience, this is something you might want to discuss with your group. 

My current (second) campaign build on the lessons learned from my first campaign and so advancement is slower, discouraging what I feel to be the "superhero mentality."  I've mandated a two Stunt mandatory purchase first and foremost  to avoid the tendency for players to only acquire powers instead of stunts because "everyone knows powers are better than stunts."  Not a single member of my current group disagrees with me yet, so I'm feeling hopeful.
I feel that stunts provide the a more distinctive feel to a character and curb the power-gaming some. I feel that stunts are knowledge, stunts are power that cannot be taken from you, and if you're powers are stripped from you yet you cannot point to at least two stunts you've acquired, it's a sorry PC, IMO.

Anyhow, discuss with your group on how fast you want to advance.  It could be what you have in mind and what they have in mid are two different things.

[RonLugge]

I'm not sure I like the idea of a mandatory 2-stunt minimum, myself.  Glad it works for your group, but... A lot of my characters would deeply, deeply, *deeply* resent that 2-stunt 'tax' on their available refresh.  And it suddenly makes a lot of character types even harder to afford, like wizard or Knight of the Cross.

[Lavecki121]

Like blackstaff said its going to depend on your group and your gm style. Generally you are going to want to give them out when a significant story arc has been acheived. As an example: in a game I was running the main bad had been doing some pretty terrible things to pretty much everyone in the city. Part of the investigation into this let the characters to a fomor hideout, where they proceeded to deal with a large fomor threat. After they had dealt with that I gave them a significant milestone. My game was going to arc for quite some time and this gave them a stat boost. It occured after maybe 6-7 sessions, with one or two major milestones between it. It really comes down to how the flow of your game goes/how long you are planning the game to last/when you feel its appropriate. There really isn't a set time for it. I would say a major milestone should be every 2-3 sessions, not a significant, but still its a matter of narrative timing.

[Lawgiver]

I agree with the rest, it's up to you and the group overall.  Consider -- how strong will they have to be to defeat the BigBad?  Not wipe him out, just beat him...  Try to pace their power ups as the story progresses so they can reach that threshold just in time for the showdown.  This will require plot progression and info reveals to be rationed or paced.  That's not an easy job for any GM, even one who knows his group really well.  But it's a must.

[Ardrikk]

Like blackstaff said its going to depend on your group and your gm style. Generally you are going to want to give them out when a significant story arc has been acheived. As an example: in a game I was running the main bad had been doing some pretty terrible things to pretty much everyone in the city. Part of the investigation into this let the characters to a fomor hideout, where they proceeded to deal with a large fomor threat. After they had dealt with that I gave them a significant milestone. My game was going to arc for quite some time and this gave them a stat boost. It occured after maybe 6-7 sessions, with one or two major milestones between it. It really comes down to how the flow of your game goes/how long you are planning the game to last/when you feel its appropriate. There really isn't a set time for it. I would say a major milestone should be every 2-3 sessions, not a significant, but still its a matter of narrative timing.

Significant is the middle one and Major is the big one that gets them the extra point of Refresh.

[Sanctaphrax]

I wouldn't worry about it if I were you. Giving the "wrong" number of Significant Milestones shouldn't be too problematic; you could have one every session or you could literally never have one and either way the game would still work.

[Mr. Death]

Honestly, in my experience at least, the book is way off when it comes to its estimations of how long sessions take in-game, how long a scenario lasts, etc. The book seems to take it as a given that any one session is going to encompass several days of activity, while most of the games I've ran, a period of two or three days might take a dozen or more sessions, with each session picking up immediately where the last left off and the occasional timeskip of a handful of hours. According to the book, that would mean a character recovering from a bad concussion over the course of a couple hours instead of weeks, or Harry being able to use his force rings much more frequently than the canon suggests.

So while it may be a useful guideline, take it with a grain of salt.

My general guideline has been to have Significant milestones after mid-boss fights or some other equivalent accomplishment, Major milestones at the end of a Scenario.

[Ardrikk]

Honestly, in my experience at least, the book is way off when it comes to its estimations of how long sessions take in-game, how long a scenario lasts, etc. The book seems to take it as a given that any one session is going to encompass several days of activity, while most of the games I've ran, a period of two or three days might take a dozen or more sessions, with each session picking up immediately where the last left off and the occasional timeskip of a handful of hours. According to the book, that would mean a character recovering from a bad concussion over the course of a couple hours instead of weeks, or Harry being able to use his force rings much more frequently than the canon suggests.

So while it may be a useful guideline, take it with a grain of salt.

My general guideline has been to have Significant milestones after mid-boss fights or some other equivalent accomplishment, Major milestones at the end of a Scenario.

Yeah, tonight is going to be my 7th session of my first Story/Scenario/Adventure and we've progressed just about 24 hours in game time.  There's been a fight with a Renfield and a bunch of Darkhounds, some investigations, some interrogations, and some character discussion and planning.  But I don't feel anything has progressed to the point where there should be a Significant Milestone.  I expect there will easily be another 5-10 sessions before they reach the end of this Scenario, depending on choices the PCs make, etc.

Your idea of giving out a Significant Milestone mid-Scenario, at a "mid-boss fight," and a Major at the end of a Scenario isn't bad.  But with an extra point of Refresh coming at the end of every storyline/adventure/scenario, I think the PCs will scale up in power too fast.  I do like the idea of a Major Milestone happening every 2-3 Stories/Scenarios or when a Big Bad in the world is taken out as I think that sets a decent pace.  I don't know, I think I'll keep with my progression.  I don't think Fate is as much about "levelling up" as some RPGs.  It's more about the stories and the characters' growth as people and as a group.  I've tried to give my players that expectation, so we'll see how that works out as we continue to move on.

I did start them out at Submerged, so it's not like they're lacking in power! 

[Lavecki121]

@Ardrikk: I get those two confused every time. Still, just take what I said and flip them.

@OP: What I said could still apply, its based off an achievement of some sort. Its really just some sort of thing that you led them to that they overcame.

[Ardrikk]

@Ardrikk: I get those two confused every time. Still, just take what I said and flip them.

@OP: What I said could still apply, its based off an achievement of some sort. Its really just some sort of thing that you led them to that they overcame.

I actually get them mixed up all the time too.  I almost always have to look them up....just like I did before correcting you...to make sure I was actually right.