Need Character design help badly.

[Lawgiver]

Ok, gang. This is a weird one. Some setup is necessary to understand the problem.

I have several players in a new DFRPG game I just started running (set in the Paranet Papers version of LV). A couple of them work some odd shifts and show up when they can.

Player A works in the evenings, starting roughly 4:00 p.m.

Player B works earlier, getting off work around 3:00 p.m. and gets to the table until about 10 minutes before A leaves for work.

We’ve found a way for them both to play w/o having to have two characters that just pop in and out in odd ways disrupting continuity.

They have the same, shared Trouble Aspect: One Body, Two Souls

Player A’s player is male and the character is male, of Russian extraction, and roughly 45-ish in current world. Player B’s player is female and the character, though also Russian in extraction, is female and younger – about 25-30.

Player A’s character is former KGB (with a skillset appropriate to that), while Player B’s character is the daughter of an older time Russian Mafioso who is looking to try re-establishing mob influence in LV.

My problems are obvious.

Player A will begin the play session controlling his character. When he has to leave, Player B takes over the character but there area # of changes that have to occur that I’m having a horrible time deciding how to deal with.

Physically I have to account for the total change in bodies. Can’t have this middle-age Comrade in a young woman’s body… that could go all sorts of wrong way too fast/easy. Vice-versa for the change from female back to male for the start of the next session.

Skillset wise, this seems at least on par with the skill shuffle for shapeshifting but considering that it’s not the same set of skills that get shuffled, but outright swapped for another entire set… nor even the same set of stunts or supernatural powers, I’m really having a tough time figuring this out.

I’ve looked at variations of Demoic Copilot, True Shapeshifting, etc., including alteration of point costs to provide certain effects w/o over-charging them in points and turning them both into NPC as a result… and I am totally stuck.

I'm hoping there's a simple solution I'm just overlooking -- besides just doing 2 separate characters--- everyone at the table loves the idea and want to see how it plays out.

Suggestions?
*sigh*
ty for anything.

[Haru]

I think I would just let them play 2 characters and use the body flip thing as a justification to change characters mid session. So no demonic co-pilot, skill shuffle etc., that makes it way too complicated and seems like an in game penalty for an out game problem.

As for the reason they switch, how about some magical accident? The older one is a trainer/mentor to the younger one, they went on a mission together and fell into a magical fissure that suddenly opened into some bizarro-strange part of the nevernever. They got warped into one linked being in there and got spewed out like that a few days later. Now, when one of them emerges, the other one is drawn back into a pocket of the nevernever where they stay until they can emerge again. It'd be a bit of a Jekill and Hide thing, I suppose, only without the rage monster.

They should have the same or a similar aspect though, regarding the change. And maybe they can take some powers that might allow them to draw on the knowledge of the other one, since they are linked, but I wouldn't force any power on them from the start.

[Lawgiver]

We thought about some stuff similar, but as a group they go more for something like.,..

He was killed in action with unresolved "issues". Sort of like a ghost, but as with Harry he's actually the intact spirit who got jammed into her body... mainly because she was headed to Vegas anyway and that's where he's more likely to find resolution and 'rest'.

That's sort of why I was looking at the Demonic Copilot... her body is the 'original', he's her copilot, though not demonic -- thus a possible point cost alteration. It's the physical change we're all really getting hung up on. I suppose I could use True Shapshifting but only at, maybe -2 points instead of -4 because there's just the one shape shift (to his, then back to hers), all her powers go dormant while his are in force, etc. I even looked at a variant of Human Form [Rare/Involuntary Change] option spliced onto Shapeshifting, but doesn't fit the idea that he's a 'ghost' possessing someone else.

*sigh*

Heck, I was thinking about imposing both Demonic Copilot and a limited True Shapeshifting together with the cost offsets negating each other so it's a net zero cost.

Really... I would just as soon do the two character bit with the change being a meta sort of thing as you suggest, but the group really wants to see it in action from a game mechanics view. They're really wanting to see how such a complex (and odd) phenomenon can be explained with extant rules (don't have the Paranet extension yet).

Appreciate your input so far, please don't stop. Be creative... fast and loose with stuff is ok with me, if that's what's needed.

ty again.

[Haru]

Really... I would just as soon do the two character bit with the change being a meta sort of thing as you suggest, but the group really wants to see it in action from a game mechanics view. They're really wanting to see how such a complex (and odd) phenomenon can be explained with extant rules (don't have the Paranet extension yet).

In this case, I would stress the above solution again. All that this is accomplishing is to give an ingame solution for an outgame problem. Unless the character is able to shift back and forth at will, meaning one player could play both characters, it's not worth charging refresh for. In fact, charging refresh for it would be a penalty to both players, since that would mean they can take less other powers because of their work schedules. I think that's an important thing to drive home. Not everything that's happening has to be put into mechanics, especially if it's just a flavor thing, as it is in this case.

If there are benefits they get from this, you should absolutely let them pay for it. But as long as it doesn't, there's definitely no need. So if it were a single character powers would make sense, since that's part of the character. But in this 2 player solution, I would advise against it.

So let's say she's not too good at shooting guns, while he was a master marksman. If you add on demonic copilot, she could draw on his expertise to be a better shot. Likewise, he could draw on her expertise when hacking into a computer system. Or any other situation that might fit. Demonic Copilot would absolutely make sense there. But if it's just to say "the character is possessed, it needs to have a power for that", no. That's what aspects are for. They are just as much a game mechanic as anything else.

If you go with a possession, that might complicate matters in terms of plausibility when it comes to shapeshifting. Why would his soul impose his physical form on the body he's possessing? I mean, sure, it absolutely can, but it seems weird without an explanation. A story explanation that is, not a mechanical one.
Are they related in any way? Blood of my blood, add some magic, boom? That might be a decent enough explanation how this would be possible.

[Theogony_IX]

Co-Pilot doesn't make sense because they are never both active at the same time.  Unfortunately there is no mechanical advantage to that needs a cost.  Skill shuffle costs because you can switch between them to your convenience.  This isn't that though.  One player gets one character and the other player gets the other.  Neither gets both.  You might offer a rebate if they don't share information.  If one comes out in the middle of conflict with no idea what's going on, that might be worth +1 refresh.  But if they are aware of what's happening while dormant then I wouldn't even offer that.  Basically what you have is this:

[+0] Shared Body - Your body contains two or more souls.  For each soul create a fully developed character sheet.  Each sheet must have at least one aspect that they share related to this power.  Each character created must belong to a different player.  Whenever a player with an assigned character joins the game, that character's appearance, skills, aspects, and consequences are embodied.  All others fall dormant.  This is not a voluntary change, and so this power should not be taken by two or more players who wish to play at the same time.
     [+1] Slumbering Souls. You may take this upgrade only if information is not shared between the souls that inhabit the one body.  When a character is embodied, he or she should have no recollection of what is happening and how they came to be wherever they are.  This information should not be given freely or easily either.

[Lawgiver]

Hmmm... that last idea seems sort of juicy.

I think I have enough ammo now to give them a wave off w/o too much resistance. We'll work on figuring out how much each personality knows/remembers about what the other experienced while dormant... though I must say that it might not matter. The rest of the group are liable to force-feed info to the new personality as soon as it manifests, just to keep themselves from suffering for ignorance.

Rregardless, though... seriously, I appreciate the help.

Anyone else wanting to contribue, please, feel free. If someone can give me a method I can try, I'm game. W/o that, I'll just do the 2 sheets bit and let it go at that.

You guys rock.
ty so much.

[Taran]

If you don't want force feeding info, use compels. 

If they are sharing a body or have conflicting goals or motivations, make sure each character sheet has an aspect that reflects that that you can compel.

Maybe the other players force feed info but the new persona is so horrified by how the other is dealing with events that they try to undo it or redo it their own way.

Maybe the two personas should be a married couple

In any case, It's the aspects that are going to make this 'character' interesting, not the mechanics.

[Sanctaphrax]

I'll add my voice to the two-character chorus.

But if you really want to use one character sheet for both people, you might be able to hack something together with the +2 variant of Human Form, Beast Change, and the Variable Abilities custom Power. You might have to invent another new Power to change the Aspects around, and I'm not sure you'll be playing Human Form strictly by the book, and you'll have to make sure the skill lists follow the Beast Change rules, but if you get past all that you ought to be able to create something very similar to just using two characters.

[Lawgiver]

I'll add my voice to the two-character chorus.

But if you really want to use one character sheet for both people, you might be able to hack something together with the +2 variant of Human Form, Beast Change, and the Variable Abilities custom Power. You might have to invent another new Power to change the Aspects around, and I'm not sure you'll be playing Human Form strictly by the book, and you'll have to make sure the skill lists follow the Beast Change rules, but if you get past all that you ought to be able to create something very similar to just using two characters.

Yeah, after looking at the above suggestion/commentary I've gone with the "Shared Body" idea. Gets the job done with minimal fuss  (read effort), keeps the two sheets discrete from each other and reminds the group (and myself) that we don't have to rely just on what's in the books; "mash up", "house rule", "homebrew"... call it whatever, we can make up our own stuff and keep chugging along. It will be part of what makes oru game unique from every one else's.

Big smiles