Soulfire Question for PP

[zoellert]

Since the release of the Paranet Papers and the changes to Soulfire, I have a question for everyone here's interpretation.

According to YS288 it says

In addition, if you already practice evocation, you may use a sponsored power source to “supercharge” an element you've already specialized in.

but in PP under The Mechanic of Soulfire it doesn't say anything about being able to supercharge spells. I don't know what to do any my GM is stuck as well. What does the board think it means?

[Haru]

I haven't read the Paranet Papers yet. In the old version, you can take sponsor debt to do all kinds of things. You could take a point of sponsor debt to increase your roll by 2. You could take a point of sponsor debt to put an aspect on your spell that might change how it behaves. So instead of a fireball you might conjure up a butterfly made of flames that can fly around a corner to hit a target.

[zoellert]

I haven't read the Paranet Papers yet. In the old version, you can take sponsor debt to do all kinds of things. You could take a point of sponsor debt to increase your roll by 2. You could take a point of sponsor debt to put an aspect on your spell that might change how it behaves. So instead of a fireball you might conjure up a butterfly made of flames that can fly around a corner to hit a target.

yes, i get that, but PP replaced debt with a stress track for Soulfire now so it seems you could only supercharge a spell if you take a stress on the Soul track but since it wasn't clear we weren't sure.

[Sanctaphrax]

There are three effects of Soulfire that I think you could describe as "supercharging" evocation.

First, it provides +1 power to "creative" evocations.

Second, it makes your magic more effective against Toughness.

Third, it lets you cast from the soul stress track.

Is that what you're after, zoellert?

[zoellert]

There are three effects of Soulfire that I think you could describe as "supercharging" evocation.

First, it provides +1 power to "creative" evocations.

Second, it makes your magic more effective against Toughness.

Third, it lets you cast from the soul stress track.

Is that what you're after, zoellert?

Kind of, my main question is do you have to take soul stress when using Soulfire?

For instance: Can you supercharge an evocation to downgrade a creature's toughness for "free" like you can with other sponsors? Or must you pay a soul stress to use it?

[Sanctaphrax]

You do not have to take soul stress when using soulfire. There's nothing in the writeup that suggests that the other bonuses depend on the use of the soul stress track.

[zoellert]

You do not have to take soul stress when using soulfire. There's nothing in the writeup that suggests that the other bonuses depend on the use of the soul stress track.

It says somewhere about the stress track that "You must choose to use it to enhance your spells." So it wasn't 100% obvious to me us if it was allowed to use without taking Soul stress immediately.

[Sanctaphrax]

Huh.

You know, I read that completely differently. To me it just seemed like a re-statement of the earlier sentences in that paragraph.

But now I'm doubting myself a bit. I still think what I said above is true, but I'm a bit less confident now.

Gah. As if the writeup wasn't ambiguous enough already.

[zoellert]

This is our solution: my GM let's me use it for free and if in an instance I would take sponsor debt, I use the stress track instead.

Does that sound right to you?

[Chee]

That would be my solution, as well. I think the track was meant to step in for the sponsor. But it really is ambiguous.

[Shaft]

...it makes your magic more effective against Toughness.

I always assumed that it actually triggers the Catch against anything vulnerable to Holy attacks.

[Chee]

It does that too. Anything it doesn't meet, it degrades.

[Theogony_IX]

Yeah, the soul stress track appears to replace the sponsor.  The example in the book allows you to absorb backlash with the soul stress track.  It also says you can self-inflict the stress to deal with any associated magic costs.  I would interpret that to mean that if you want to increase the power of a spell, you can absorb the stress of summoning power with the soul stress track as well.

In other words, its just an additional stress track for magic casting costs only.  You can cast longer and/or bigger with this additional stress track.  Using your soul track to pay for your casting in any way triggers the catch satisfying effect.  The +1 bonuses apply to any magic cast in the specified themes whether using the soul track to fuel the spell or not.

EDIT:  Maybe I missed it, but the part that isn't clear for me is whether you can split stress between the soul track and other tracks.  I want to cast a spell that requires I take 4 mental stress, but my #4 mental stress box has already been filled.  Can I take 3 mental and 1 soul?

Personally, I'd say yes.

[Sanctaphrax]

I'd say no. You can't usually split stress, and Soulfire is already plenty strong.

This is our solution: my GM let's me use it for free and if in an instance I would take sponsor debt, I use the stress track instead.

Does that sound right to you?

Kind of. I think he's right to let you use it for free, and the stress track was explicitly intended to replace sponsor debt, but it's not usable in the same situations. So in some of the instances where you would take sponsor debt, the stress track won't be appropriate.

For example, you can't use the stress track to hit a dodging opponent.

[Taran]

Can I take 3 mental and 1 soul?

It sounds like it works more like

Mental   / Soul stress
0000    (00)

So it's like the extra boxes on toughness?