Mab preventing use of Little Chicago

[Griffyn612]

We've seen Harry use locator spells before.  and it requires triangulation.  he ends up running around rechecking his results.  but little Chicago tells your where someone or something is exactly.  that's how they located Pell's theater as the nearest point to Molly's location.  he didn't project himself astrally to do that.

my issue with him not using little Chicago is that it's obviously the most efficient tool to find him if Thomas is being held in Chicago.  not using it at all, or even mentioning considering it or specifying why he's not, is extremely odd. 

I get that using little Chicago takes effort.  but was finding Thomas not worth the effort when other things failed?  when he started growing desperate from lack of options?

[Tami Seven]

We've seen Harry use locator spells before.  and it requires triangulation.  he ends up running around rechecking his results.  but little Chicago tells your where someone or something is exactly.  that's how they located Pell's theater as the nearest point to Molly's location.  he didn't project himself astrally to do that.

my issue with him not using little Chicago is that it's obviously the most efficient tool to find him if Thomas is being held in Chicago.  not using it at all, or even mentioning considering it or specifying why he's not, is extremely odd. 

I get that using little Chicago takes effort.  but was finding Thomas not worth the effort when other things failed?  when he started growing desperate from lack of options?

I agree with this. We don't know for sure what would have happened if Harry had tracked down Thomas earlier, but best case scenario would have been that Harry rescues Thomas before Shagnasty really starts torturing him.

Uriel had said to Harry that it wasn't his fault Thomas got tortured.....perhaps it's fair to say that it was Mab's fault.

[namkcas]

I agree with the Triangulation, but I think the thing I am thinking through is that I don't know if LC makes the Locator Spells more powerful...reaching further/overcoming more issues.  I thought that once he found that he could not make any Locator Spell work that it made LC not valuable to the operation.  It takes a long time to use LC and has lots of other issues as well.  If he could get a Locator Spell up, then I would have expected him to use LC.  But given his inability to get one going - and he tried several different ways, that it meant he could not use Locator Spells in any way to locate Thomas.  As I recall the other LC uses, he connected first with a standard locator and then used LC as an way of adding value to the tracking not a way to start the tracking.

[Griffyn612]

I agree with the Triangulation, but I think the thing I am thinking through is that I don't know if LC makes the Locator Spells more powerful...reaching further/overcoming more issues.  I thought that once he found that he could not make any Locator Spell work that it made LC not valuable to the operation.  It takes a long time to use LC and has lots of other issues as well.  If he could get a Locator Spell up, then I would have expected him to use LC.  But given his inability to get one going - and he tried several different ways, that it meant he could not use Locator Spells in any way to locate Thomas.  As I recall the other LC uses, he connected first with a standard locator and then used LC as an way of adding value to the tracking not a way to start the tracking.

In Proven Guilty he sits down to use Little Chicago to find Molly while running out of time, and did so without much preparation time or precursor location spells.

The fact that he had time to do numerous other searches that week failed indicates he had time to try little Chicago but didn't.  to me, that's suspicious.  if you don't see his lack of mentioning his number one location tool and magical construct as suspicious, there's nothing more I can do.

[namkcas]

I disagree with that entirely.  He went and got Charity'sblood and started a tracking spell.  Then he used LC to move around.  Without the tracking spell, LC would not have worked.

[Griffyn612]

I disagree with that entirely.  He went and got Charity'sblood and started a tracking spell.  Then he used LC to move around.  Without the tracking spell, LC would not have worked.

He very clearly does not cast a tracking spell before using little Chicago.

Then I pinked my fingertip with my ritual knife, touched the lock of baby hair to it, and laid it down within Little Chicago. I used a second drop of blood and an effort of will to touch the circle on the tabletop, closing it up and beginning the spell. I closed my eyes, focusing, murmuring a stream of faux Latin as I reached out to the model and brought it to life. 

And this is from when it failed.

[the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh]

Are we absolutely sure about that? We have zero information about who/what it was that put Shagnasty on to Morgan in the first place.

Considering that even a minor demon like the one in SF can rematerialise after destruction on Earth, I would not be surprised to find that the skinwalker in TC was actually the one Morgan nuked in the 1950s.

We also, IIRC, have a WoJ that the skinwalker has limited intellectus in the specific field of how to hurt people, which might be enough to explain it being on Morgan's trail without any other source of information being necessary.

[namkcas]

Failed trying a tracking spell at which point LC is useless....which is my entire point.  If you can't bring up a tracking spell, there is no point in using LC.  Harry already knows this at the time of TC.  So, the moment he can't track Thomas...LC becomes moot. 

[Griffyn612]

Failed trying a tracking spell at which point LC is useless....which is my entire point.  If you can't bring up a tracking spell, there is no point in using LC.  Harry already knows this at the time of TC.  So, the moment he can't track Thomas...LC becomes moot.

So to clarify, we have textual evidence that he has started using Little Chicago for tracking spells rather than his old method, but you think he reverted to the old method in this instance.

[knnn]

Random WAG:  If LC does include Demonreach, then maybe we have a new candidate for who fixed LC.   

[namkcas]

Griffyn,

I was saying that LC does not make a tracking spell work if it won't without LC.  What LC a does is allow more information to be gathered more easily from a tracking spell that would work.  So Harry can find out if a tracking spell would work without LC.  Since Harry could not track Thomas there seems to be no value in using LC in TC.  That is a reasonable explanation for why Harry does not use LC in the novel. 

[Griffyn612]

Griffyn,

I was saying that LC does not make a tracking spell work if it won't without LC.  What LC a does is allow more information to be gathered more easily from a tracking spell that would work.  So Harry can find out if a tracking spell would work without LC.  Since Harry could not track Thomas there seems to be no value in using LC in TC.  That is a reasonable explanation for why Harry does not use LC in the novel.

If that's enough for you, that's fine. 

You're ignoring the fact that after creating little Chicago, he doesn't do a tracking spell first to then do it again with little Chicago.  he just does it with little Chicago.

Random WAG:  If LC does include Demonreach, then maybe we have a new candidate for who fixed LC.   

I can't wait for DR to explain it.  And then Bob or SoI will have to dumb it down.

[TheCuriousFan]

What's to say that Mab didn't nudge shagnasty after Morgan? Its a variable outcome to know if Thomas would be kidnapped, but just brining shaggy into play increases the odds, especially when Mab knows about Thomas and that is a hot button when it comes to Harry.

WoJ says that the one who sent Shagnasty had been mentioned but not seen as of Turn Coat.

Will we run into whoever hired the skinwalker?
They have been mentioned, but they’ve not yet been onscreen.

... Could Little Chicago, and Harry's lab, still be in the basement of the BFS building?

And does Marcone have someone on staff to use it?

It had a building full of burning objects fall on it, it's gone.

[Sully]

Especially since they put another building on top of it.  Generally you don't build on top of piles of burnt rubble, you clear the rubble first.

[Lash Dresden]

WoJ is that the fire was hot enough Little Chicago was slag.