Order of the blackened Denarius Question.

[HumAnnoyd]

I guess what I am trying to ask is would the Denarion have to break the human before they will get the shadow? Or would simply placing a coin in their hand while they are restrained be enough to...infect them?

[Haru]

Ah, ok. Well, I think the shadow has a pretty easy way of getting in. A simple touch and there it is. But it doesn't really have any power then. I would say it is mostly bound by the laws of hospitality, though they can bend those pretty far. For example, they can't directly harm you, but if you think jumping out of the window to escape the illusionary fire is a good idea, that's not the fallen's fault.

And of course they can play with you. They can make you think they are controlling you, and it only takes that one moment you slip up for them to get a hold of you.

[HumAnnoyd]

OK. That is pretty much what I was thinking but wanted clarification.  My group will be facing a Denarion Big Bad in a final showdown next session and I want to be prepared for any eventuality.  <insert evil laughter here>

[Haru]

Take a note from this thread though and don't force a shadow on one of the players. It's a cool thing to do if one of them wants to introduce that into the campaign, but if it is forced, it's not going to be fun for anyone.

[HumAnnoyd]

Take a note from this thread though and don't force a shadow on one of the players. It's a cool thing to do if one of them wants to introduce that into the campaign, but if it is forced, it's not going to be fun for anyone.

No I hear you.  Any taking of coins will be a choice.  With implications laid out up front. 

[Rossbert]

I feel like it isn't that big a crime.  You can make people face all sorts of challenges without express permission.  You go up against gangsters, you risk coming in contact with bullets, you fight vampires you risk venom, you fight denarians you risk coins.  Make it like how a lot of people handle killing, just let them be aware of the risk if they continue with their actions, and then feel free to impose it if they undergo a course of action that would reasonably result in it.

[PirateJack]

The problem with that view is that you're affecting another person's character, forcing a major change on them that they may not want to take. It can make the game less fun for them, which is against the point of roleplaying games in the first place.

[Jabberwocky]

It's always the result of a mix unique to each and every group. With one GM it feels like jerkishness and railroading, with another one it's just an unexpected story twist and good storytelling. Two players can feel and interpret the same thing in (at least) two ways. But I agree - if it's not fun there's no point in doing it.

[Sanctaphrax]

I'd be okay with getting Denarian-ized against my will. I'd want a defence roll, though, and I can see why other players might not be okay with it.

So there are some nuances to the issue.

But I'm not sure nuances are appropriate here. This:

What bugs me is he threw this coin at me during RP and when I caught it his exact words "You're screwed now" and he immediately went into explaining the permanent penalties i would be taking to all social rolls...

looks pretty awful.

[narphoenix]

But I'm not sure nuances are appropriate here. This:

looks pretty awful.

Amen. That's bullshit. I'm all for torturing characters, but you have to talk it over wth the players to make sure you're torturing them in the /right/ way, to make a better story. If my GM did that to me, I wouldn't speak to him ever again. Screw the game.

[Cadd]

It's basically summed up like this: Screw over the character, not the player (and cooperate in doing so).

[Grasharm]

I would also like to point out that my character wears leather gauntlets at all times as they are my Evocation Foci. However when i cited the same thing about skin contact and even referenced Thomas and his coin and how his gloves protected him he answered as follows "Thomas is a Supernatural Creature and Can't have a coin". Which may be true but he went to presume that gloves offer no protection against the coin or the Angel imprint unless they were on par with the sanctified cloth the Knights of the cross use to transport the coins.

[narphoenix]

I would also like to point out that my character wears leather gauntlets at all times as they are my Evocation Foci. However when i cited the same thing about skin contact and even referenced Thomas and his coin and how his gloves protected him he answered as follows "Thomas is a Supernatural Creature and Can't have a coin". Which may be true but he went to presume that gloves offer no protection against the coin or the Angel imprint unless they were on par with the sanctified cloth the Knights of the cross use to transport the coins.

Yeah... Dump him on his ass. Call railroading. Cuz that's /total/ bullshit.

[Haru]

I would also like to point out that my character wears leather gauntlets at all times as they are my Evocation Foci. However when i cited the same thing about skin contact and even referenced Thomas and his coin and how his gloves protected him he answered as follows "Thomas is a Supernatural Creature and Can't have a coin". Which may be true but he went to presume that gloves offer no protection against the coin or the Angel imprint unless they were on par with the sanctified cloth the Knights of the cross use to transport the coins.

Did he read the books?

[Grasharm]

Apparently he did read all of them, both him and his "Triumverate" ironically made up of multiple females and single male which he would often consult after gaming to help him with messing with our game. That is neither here nor there. I would like to thank you all for your input on this matter. It seems the general consensus is that I did the right thing leaving the game especially since the recurring theme that he took delight in mentioning at every session was "It's my job to bring misery to your characters".  Now to paraphrase the wisest wizard i know “There are things you can't walk away from. Not if you want to live with yourself afterward. Thankfully this game isn't one of them.”