question on healing

[Sanctaphrax]

Maybe some forms of magical damage resistance should impede consensual transformations.

But not all. Toughness can take many forms.

And when you look at the mundane stuff, it just makes no sense at all. People with better health are harder to heal? That's totally backwards!

Consequences are screwy too. A PC with 20 shifts of consequences being ridiculously harder to heal than an NPC with 0 is weird.

And having a mental trauma/a physical injury/a damaged reputation make it easier to transform you is just bizarre.

[Blk4ce]

Only the last part I disagree with. If you have a mental trauma you are more susceptible.

[vultur]

Maybe some forms of magical damage resistance should impede consensual transformations.

But not all. Toughness can take many forms.

OK, sure. But I think it's "close enough" to make it reasonable to use existing mechanics rather than invent something new.

And when you look at the mundane stuff, it just makes no sense at all. People with better health are harder to heal? That's totally backwards!

Well, that's why I said it shouldn't work that way for healing. Harder to transform into a dog? Maybe a bit more plausible.

Though I guess you could use a "base difficulty" + consequences if you're unwilling sort of setup

Consequences are screwy too. A PC with 20 shifts of consequences being ridiculously harder to heal than an NPC with 0 is weird.

You're not forced to take consequences, so they should never affect the difficulty of any consensual spell.

[Sanctaphrax]

Well, that's why I said it shouldn't work that way for healing. Harder to transform into a dog? Maybe a bit more plausible.

Even for consensual transformation it seems wrong to me. Healthier people have fewer weird things wrong with their body that you need to adjust for, and they can survive complications in the dog-transformation process more easily.

You're not forced to take consequences, so they should never affect the difficulty of any consensual spell.

I don't think everyone who uses the stress + consequences model agrees with you there.

And I can kind of see why. 5 complexity is enough to push through any mundane stress track, and that's not very much complexity. Seems too easy, unless you add another cost.

[vultur]

I don't think everyone who uses the stress + consequences model agrees with you there.

Possibly not -- I can't speak to what other people think about it -- but I don't see any rules reason you would be required to take consequences to avoid a result you don't want to avoid...

And I can kind of see why. 5 complexity is enough to push through any mundane stress track, and that's not very much complexity. Seems too easy, unless you add another cost.

EDIT: Going by book examples of thaumaturgy it would be max possible defense roll + stress track + 1. So probably more like 9-13 rather than 5.

Here's how I would do actual transformations (not healing, I posted how I'd do that above).

That (defense roll + stress track +1) is just kind of a "base cost". But that only gives you a cosmetic change. If you want the change to make a mechanical difference then it's +2 complexity per refresh point of powers, and somebody (either caster or recipient) has to spend fate points for the powers as per the temporary powers rules (to avoid constant power switching effectively giving everybody modular abilities with no refresh surcharge).

Changing skills would be +2 complexity, but I don't think I'd charge a fate point since the full Beast Change power is only 1 refresh and it lets you switch back and forth.

Whether that's the best way to do it, I don't know, but it's what I would extrapolate from the rules...

[Taran]

There's an argument that you don't need a fp for temporary powers because you use the free tag on the aspect. 

Has there ever been any consensus on this?

Deadmanwalking was a big supporter of this, if i'm remembering correctly. 

It hasn't come up much in my games, so i don't really know which side I'm on.

[UmbraLux]

There's an argument that you don't need a fp for temporary powers because you use the free tag on the aspect. 

Has there ever been any consensus on this?

Fred's comments are relevant:
"A tag is a free invoke.

A tag therefore can do anything an invoke can.

An invoke can invoke for effect."

[Sanctaphrax]

Possibly not -- I can't speak to what other people think about it -- but I don't see any rules reason you would be required to take consequences to avoid a result you don't want to avoid...

Even if you don't have to take them, they might count towards complexity.

At least, that seems to be the idea. I don't use that method myself.

EDIT: Going by book examples of thaumaturgy it would be max possible defense roll + stress track + 1. So probably more like 9-13 rather than 5.

Mm. The book often uses an extra 4 shifts to cover good rolls, but there's no indication that that's necessary.

And requiring someone to use skills to defend is no more sensible than requiring them to use consequences.

There's an argument that you don't need a fp for temporary powers because you use the free tag on the aspect. 

Has there ever been any consensus on this?

Not really.

I'm on team no, for the record. Buying temporary powers isn't an Aspect invocation.

[Hick Jr]

I'd allow power-granting rituals using Aspect tags if you had some kind of base complexity on top of it. Probably 7 or more shifts.

[Silverblaze]

Sponsored Magic:

The sponsor takes care of the medical knowledge for such things.

I think sponsored Biomancy is the best route for healing.  The closest to point and click as you can get.  Summer Magic and Soulfire would be my go to for magic healing.  Especially considering they can do Thaumaturgy at the speed of Evocation.

Need help with difficulty?  No idea.  Gotta balance it to your game in particular in my opinion.