GM resources?

[fantazero]

Not sure if you're referring to me, but yep as well. This little project of mine is to help expand on that, and transition from the city creation to the story creation. I'm doing this because I feel what I have so far isn't quite robust enough to feel real - The laws of reality are in place, but the details are still a little too flexible yet to feel like an actual game. Instead it feels like I'm making up a story as I go along, and while my players might not notice, it bothers me and takes away from my fun.

At the same time, I don't want to go too far and put the whole game on rails either, which is a real concern for me as well. So, I'm trying to come up with a way to better define the players in my story - a system where I can firmly say 'this is what I'm in control of and this is what I'm not'. The point is to create a challenge for not only my players (which I could do just by improvising) but for myself.

Sounds like I'm inventing a ruleset to make story creation a minigame for myself I guess. Not sure if I've worded this quite right, but hopefully other GMs get what I'm saying. lol

I think managing everyones Aspects, City Aspects, The Magic System, Social Mental and Physical Combat should be enough to challenge yourself.

Also I'm still not sure, but did you and your players get together and do city creation? That should give you like what? a Dozen NPCs and Plot threads?
Could you post what you have?

[cold_breaker]

We do. I'm not going to post it all (it's a lot to type up) but the gist of it is that the area we picked (southern Ontario) is on a system of lay lines that are "Fractured" by the influence of the great lakes, resulting in the 'fractured cities' - essentially this spiderweb of small lay lines that are actually counter-productive to magic in the traditional sense. This leads to major effects on several groups: Mortal practitioners who are not acclimitized to the effect find themself seriously handicapped, but the locals have learned to deal (kinda like people in mountinous areas acclimitize themselves to thinner climates) - the effects of the fairy courts are diluted, so many wild fae choose to live here, resulting in a large population of fairy scions and some changelings (I've decided that the fracture also tends to make scions more likely then normal.) Finally, there's a large population of Were's (werewolves, wererabits, werecayotes, and anything else that  exists here geographically)

Conversely, we also have a threat of old vs. new. The basic idea of this is that we have a major tech center here along with multiple universities creating a new generation of highly technical, intelligent and informed kids that are butting heads with the extremely powerful, secretive and influential Mennonite population. Basically, the Mennonites have secretly been controlling politics in the region since it has settled and their particular brand of influence is the reason we've never had a problem with major crime... and thanks to the new generation, for better or for worse this status quo is in jeopardy. Although the mennonites are pure mortal, they have a paramilitary wing - the Jagers. They're the theoretically defunct german hunting groups that are secretly still going strong: hunting paranormal threats that get out of hand, mostly the local Were's that get out of hand...

Theme: Breeding ground for mediocrity
Threat: The Fracture
Threat: Old school vs. New school

I'll leave it at that. We do of course have Faces defined for each of these groups, although only a high aspect for each is defined at the moment, as well as basic locations. I'm also summarizing quite a bit: there's a lot of political intricacies that my players will discover over time: some of which will be freely given, others will be shown during adventure gradually.

That said, it's not the setting itself I have issues with. It's more being able to generate the adventure. I already have ideas and places to start as you can hopefully tell, it's filling in the details these forms will help with. For example, playing my first scene in our first adventure, I intended to do an intro to combat that involved my players hanging out at the local Universities when they're ambushed by a group of local Jagers trying to catch a girl who has come to them for help. I quickly learned to improvise quite a bit to get through this scene in ways I do not like (layout of the classroom for instance? Athletics rolls by the mooks to break through the windows? What the innocent bystanders do/are capable of doing to help? Possible suggestions for compels I could use if I'm out of ideas during play?) All of these things seem like things I could have better thought up before play. As well, I found myself feeling extremely disorganized - which notepad did I write out stats for Mook B on again? Where did I write out my players aspects so I can think up compels? Crap.

That said, I have a basic first draft of these PDFs set up. I'm going to crean it up a bit and post my first version here for people to look over, and possibly for other new GMs to try. I will hopefully have something to show after this weekend.

[fantazero]

" I quickly learned to improvise quite a bit to get through this scene in ways I do not like (layout of the classroom for instance?"
What does a classroom look like? Like a classroom? Is their a fire extinguisher in there? Roll me notice or give me a fate point
 Athletics rolls by the mooks to break through the windows?
Or Fists, or Weapons, Or whatever makes sense
 What the innocent bystanders do/are capable of doing to help?
Whatever you want them to do. Or if the players can convince them to help.
 Possible suggestions for compels I could use if I'm out of ideas during play?
I print out a list of my players Aspects so I can look at them
 All of these things seem like things I could have better thought up before play.
You couldn't have thought of all that before hand, and if you TRY to think of everything you tend to get tunnel vision on what you "expect" to happen *Quick story at the end* As well, I found myself feeling extremely disorganized - which notepad did I write out stats for Mook B on again? Where did I write out my players aspects so I can think up compels? Crap." It's a skill, you have to realize you are playing the game they are playing, and then playing another game above the one they are playing.


So Some ideas
I basically have 3 Mooks drawn up for ANYTHING

Bad
Big Bad
Big Bad Boss

Big
+ (Fill in the blank)  on all Skills, which skills? Yes. Basically i don't have time to counter every single player ect. So, for a "throw-away" mortal character.
Stress Box ( ) ( )
Mild_____
Maybe 1 Fate point?

And then Big Bad, and Big bad Boss depend on your game.
In a Dresden game, just grab a villain from the book Our World and go wild. Your NPC doesn't have to "make sense" game wise. So he can have +7 on some things and nothing at +1.
I do have an issue with Black Court Vampires having Fate Points  (same thing with Werewolves and such)

If you need a Map for a Classroom, draw it.
What I did for a game  was just have each player draw a map on graph paper of a location.
Player 1, draw your characters house, Player 2, Draw the fair ground you hang out at, Player 3 draw that school where you killed that vampire.
I might not use any or all of those maps, but I keep them, and sometimes they show up later.


I also use a Dry Erase Board (like the kind you see on your fridge, you can get them at Target for like 5 bucks) and I keep track of Scene Aspects on that, and then i make another one which is for Mooks and such.

*Quick story
So in a Dresden game I was in, our GM had this Black Court Vampire that had been pushing our buttons for Half a year (In REAL TIME) so when it was time to meet the BCV my Character shot her. The GM was blown away, why would we shoot her? He didn't think that we would 1. Want to Fight with a character so powerful, and 2. He hadn't prepared for a Fight. Which was foolish of him, this BCV had been a Pain in our butt for a loooooong time, she was evil, and my character had a rep for being a loose cannon. 
The GM started to throw a fit that we were derailing his game, but I guess realized how stupid that sounded, and we beat the Black Court Vampire (She turned into mist, and our wizard turned it into Ice, and she fell like 60 Stories)
The point, you can't plan for what Players will do, because what seems logical to you, could be illogical to the player in game and out of game

[cold_breaker]

I don't think we're disagreeing on this, although perhaps you're worried about my proposed method. But let me answer point by point:

What does a classroom look like? Like a classroom? Is their a fire extinguisher in there? Roll me notice or give me a fate point

I don't like the idea of giving too much control of the scene to the players. After all, what's the fun in running the game if you can't describe the scenery? Giving players a declaration for something that'd have a good chance of being there is one thing, but letting them describe what the room looks like is another. Also, it leads to some metagaming abuses as well - the GM didn't describe anything, so there's obviously nothing important here. There are more extreme abuses that could be pulled off, but I'm not particularly worried about that.

Or Fists, or Weapons, Or whatever makes sense

Agreed. Even so, I should have expected/planned my NPCs method of attack better. I think this was just inexperience either way though.

Whatever you want them to do. Or if the players can convince them to help.

It'd have been nice if I had actually written up some default NPC stats is what I was getting at, and having them on hand at a moments notice.

I print out a list of my players Aspects so I can look at them

Every game I've played, I've had a list handy. However, to a newb GM, it'd be better to spend a little time brainstorming some compels to use as part of your story. It makes it easier to predict the characters actions and plan around how the players might actually react. For instance, in the going off the rails example you gave, your GM could have used the loose cannon aspect of your charactor and compelled you to do exactly what you did, and then planned out a result.

You couldn't have thought of all that before hand, and if you TRY to think of everything you tend to get tunnel vision on what you "expect" to happen *Quick story at the end*

I'm not trying to think of everything. I am trying to provide myself with a guideline of the minimum amount of preperation for each scene. I can't predict how players will overcome a challange, but I can brainstorm up what tools they have available to them, as well as what those challenging them have as tools as well.

It's a skill, you have to realize you are playing the game they are playing, and then playing another game above the one they are playing.

Yup. And to play both games, a little organization will go a long way. ;p

I get what you're trying to say, but I think you're being a little over zelous assuming that planning = overplanning. I think it's more an exercise of what you plan vs. How much you plan. What I mean is if you plan out what a place will look like and some default clues, you're fine. It only becomes an issue when you're planning how the players will find those clues and what they have to do with them that it becomes an issue. It a thin line to walk... with is why I'm coming up with guidelines to help walk it :p

Again though, I think we're on the same page, you're just misinterpreting my intentions. I'm basicly just trying to set up guidelines to do exactly what you suggest - have default stats I can fall back on, sometimes to improvise, sometimes because I was hoping the story would turn out this way. I'm just saying I want to do it on a story by story basis, but otherwise I'm planning exactly what you're saying.

This'll be soo much easier once I've completed my first story with the group and can describe the plot - how much I've planned out and how I deal with curveballs my players throw. lol

[polkaneverdies]

Planning is nice, but there are easy options here when something unexpected crops up.
Check out the generic npc's thread on the resource board here if you need npc stats on the fly.
Sanctaphrax and many others have made a very helpful list.

[Sanctaphrax]

I find that I improvise better when I have something planned. Even if my plan gets completely derailed, the time spent thinking about it helps me respond to what my players do.

[cold_breaker]

I find that I improvise better when I have something planned. Even if my plan gets completely derailed, the time spent thinking about it helps me respond to what my players do.

This is what I'm trying to get at.

Plus, if you flesh out the plans for stuff you don't expect to happen, like the details of X NPC that technically exists but isn't involved with the story, you have more to work with when they're surprisingly pulled into the story.

[fantazero]

as long as you don't try to shoe horn that into the scene, I think it's fine.
I work better without planning. I've just seen a lot of railroading and it seems to be a common "theme" in RPGs

[fantazero]

Oh and about Player Maps.
If you ask someone to draw a school room, and the throw in a weapons locker and a nuclear reactor, thats where you as the GM step in and go "come on". But a school room is a school room, a banks a bank. If you have something really awesome, draw a map of that, but I think it helps players invest in the game. Also if they have a hang out like a bar or something, let them draw that, put scene aspects ect because it cuts down on the "burn it down' factor. Hey OTHER PC dont burn down the bar we spent 45 minutes on!

My suggestion, next game, do it the way I said, then the next game do it the way you are saying, compare/contrast. Whats the worst that can happen?

My way
Zero prep before game time
Show up for the game, maybe ask the players some questions about their childhood, background, inter party relationships, how they feel about events going on in game "how does you character react to McCoy stealing the Mantle of Power from the Jade Court?" and just roll with it.

This is how I see it.
When I was a kid my friend and me played Duke Nukem 3d alllll the time, I loved that game, it was 3d, it was cursing, it was amazing.
So when he got this "Duke Nukem 3d level editor" book from Half Price books, my mind was blown.
Sadly, It was like finding out Santa wasn't real. Why? Because I realized stuff like enemys were spawned when you enter certain rooms, it didn't matter where you hit them, just as long as you hit them ect.
So when I hear people talking about drawing up maps of the dungeon/school/whatever they are going to fight in, I just think of Duke Nukem, and how it didn't matter if I snuck into that room/or how monsters were going to Spawn into it, regardless.
With a video game, no matter how good, only so many things can happen, in an RPG ANYTHING can happen. I just see planning like this as limiting your ability to do anything.

[Taran]

Try the scene thing I mentionned.  See how it goes for you.  It's really just a point-form layout and you'd have the NPC's either completely pre-statted or summarized - whatever you prefer.  As long as you have a relative idea as to where the PC's might be going before-hand.

If the session doesn't take you there, you can still use that prep for any time they do go there, although the NPC's might change.  Then that prep doesn't go to waste.

Because it's point form it gives you a good guild-line yet allows you as much flexibility as you need.  Like I mentionned, I always jot down a list of potential compels for the PC's ahead of time.  You might not use them, but if you're stuck and want to compel, you can use them, or if you don't they might give you ideas on the spot.

Anyways, it works for me because I get all befuddled when put on the spot, so I need a cheat-sheet to keep things smooth.

[cold_breaker]

Oh and about Player Maps.
If you ask someone to draw a school room, and the throw in a weapons locker and a nuclear reactor, thats where you as the GM step in and go "come on". But a school room is a school room, a banks a bank. If you have something really awesome, draw a map of that, but I think it helps players invest in the game. Also if they have a hang out like a bar or something, let them draw that, put scene aspects ect because it cuts down on the "burn it down' factor. Hey OTHER PC dont burn down the bar we spent 45 minutes on!

My suggestion, next game, do it the way I said, then the next game do it the way you are saying, compare/contrast. Whats the worst that can happen?

My way
Zero prep before game time
Show up for the game, maybe ask the players some questions about their childhood, background, inter party relationships, how they feel about events going on in game "how does you character react to McCoy stealing the Mantle of Power from the Jade Court?" and just roll with it.

This is how I see it.
When I was a kid my friend and me played Duke Nukem 3d alllll the time, I loved that game, it was 3d, it was cursing, it was amazing.
So when he got this "Duke Nukem 3d level editor" book from Half Price books, my mind was blown.
Sadly, It was like finding out Santa wasn't real. Why? Because I realized stuff like enemys were spawned when you enter certain rooms, it didn't matter where you hit them, just as long as you hit them ect.
So when I hear people talking about drawing up maps of the dungeon/school/whatever they are going to fight in, I just think of Duke Nukem, and how it didn't matter if I snuck into that room/or how monsters were going to Spawn into it, regardless.
With a video game, no matter how good, only so many things can happen, in an RPG ANYTHING can happen. I just see planning like this as limiting your ability to do anything.

Well, that much is just style preferences I think. Everyone enjoys a different aspect of gaming a little more than the rest, whether that aspect is the storytelling, the strategy, playing a niche role, or simply smashing things. I prefer the storytelling, so for enjoyment purposes coming up with the scene is an investment for me, even if it might be more work. Basicly, I'm a writer at heart and while I like having players who have free will, I also like controlling the story and watching players have 'ah ha!' moments.