God I suck at Dialogue

[kingaling]

The title says it all, doesn't it?

I need some help, quite honestly. My people skills are not that great, in fact I'm relatively anti-social. And as an aspiring writer, that seems to have been a bad choice on my part. I can hardly hold conversations with people, unless it's about movies or something, and because of that I have hardly any idea on how to construct a basic line of dialogue. If it's a conversation about personal/philosophical beliefs, I'm all over it. But I can't write a conversation of significance between two people that is just a typical conversation, or slightly more than that. I've heard all the advice. "Listen to people and how they talk. write down key ideas." that doesn't work for me. Anyone have a better way of making conversations work?

help would indeed be appreciated.

[Spectacular Sameth]

Worry about the dialog later. GO through and write the story, adding all the necessary bits through the dialog (stuff that moves the story through) and then when you're done, go back through and read the dialog out loud. If you find yourself laughing at something that's not a joke, then you need to change it. Also, keep in mind what period you're writing for. If I were to write a story about the 1950s, then I shouldn't use works like "krunk" and so forth. (That's obvious stuff, but you would be surprised what you'd find...)

Yes, so the best advice I can give you is to write now and revise. I read this thing by Stephen King on writing and he suggest you do this with everything, especially facts. Can't remember something, make a place holder and then fill it in once the story is there.

Sorry if that's not what you're looking for, but I've never really had a problem with dialog. I've had a creative writing teacher tell me I'm a natural at writing dialog.

[kingaling]

Thanks for the great advice, that's actually what I was waiting to hear. Lucky for you being a natural at dialog writing.

any more tips would be great, too.

[Spectacular Sameth]

Awesome. Glad I could help.

[LizW65]

When I write scripts, I've found that reading the dialogue aloud helps more than anything.  If you find that it flows naturally and is easy to read, chances are it's working.  If, however, it feels awkward and you find yourself stumbling over the words, then some revision will probably help.

[King of De Nile]

A good trick, if you're just stumped on a particular line of dialog, is exploit ask your family for help. Describe the situation and the character, and then ask them what they would say. You can get some real gems this way.

Another thing is, if you don't want to be in a conversation yourself, ride a local bus on a weekday, around 6. Just listen to the conversations around you; you'll hear the cadence of their conversation. Then try to replicate that cadence in your head as you write.

[skaoi]

i agree with king-nile.  get out and listen to people.  hang at a coffee shop, ride the bus, visit a hospital, go to a bar or hang at the student center of a local college. be a voyeur.  become a student of body language.

i'm sort of at the opposite end of the spectrum.  i love dialogue and i'm pompous enough to think i'm pretty fair at it.  i enjoy describing a character's posture, their facial expression, or the exasperated sighs when they become frustrated that they aren't getting their point across.

thankfully, i have a co-writer who keeps me in line with generally directing the big picture.  i love details and frequently get bogged down in the little stuff - like conversations.

i'm not good with people, either, but i've found that as i write dialogue, somehow, i've gotten better with real people.

[Mickey Finn]

Hey, George RR Martin's A Game of Thrones has some of the worst dialogue ever, in the first half page. They use the word "death" 9 times in a third of a page. It's comical.

If this had been his first novel, it would have been passed over in the slush pile. Even the greats can screw up dialogue.

[LizW65]

Hey, George RR Martin's A Game of Thrones has some of the worst dialogue ever, in the first half page. They use the word "death" 9 times in a third of a page. It's comical.

If this had been his first novel, it would have been passed over in the slush pile. Even the greats can screw up dialogue.

No wonder I couldn't get more than a couple pages into that book.   I finally gave up and sold it to the used bookstore.

[the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh]

Hey, George RR Martin's A Game of Thrones has some of the worst dialogue ever, in the first half page. They use the word "death" 9 times in a third of a page. It's comical.

Why is repetition to generate a desired effect a problem ?  I'm pretty sure that specific example is deliberate and has a point in mind, and, well, it worked for me.

[Mickey Finn]

What would be the point in question? Repetition is primarily a comical device, and something to avoid in straight script.

Correcting myself, it's "dead," not "death." And it's only used in the dialogue...repeatedly, by every character who says something. I'd link it if I could find a copy, but Amazon.com wisely left the prologue out of the sample chapters (despite including all the errata pages).

The rest of the scene doesn't play like that, and Martin's elegance comes to the fore.

[Beamer]

Why is repetition to generate a desired effect a problem ?  I'm pretty sure that specific example is deliberate and has a point in mind, and, well, it worked for me.

I can't think what desired effect he was trying to generate but all I got out of it was boredom

"We should start back," Gared urged as the woods began to grow dark around them. "The wildlings are dead."
"Do the dead frighten you?" Ser Waymar Royce asked with just the hint of a smile.
Gared did not rise to the bait. He was an old man, past fifty, and he had seen the lordlings come and go. "Dead is dead," he said. "We have no business with the dead."
"Are they dead?" Royce asked softly. "What proof have we?"
"Will saw them," Gared said. "If he says they are dead, that's proof enough for me."
Will had known they would drag him into the quarrel sooner or later. He wished it had been later rather than sooner. "My mother told me that dead men sing no songs," he put in.
"My wet nurse said the same thing, Will," Royce replied. "Never believe anything you hear at a woman's tit. There are things to be learned even from the dead." His voice echoed, too loud in the twilit forest.
"We have a long ride before us," Gared pointed out. "Eight days, maybe nine. And night is falling."

[the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh]

What would be the point in question? Repetition is primarily a comical device, and something to avoid in straight script.

It strikes me, rereading it as quoted in the next post, as a peace of plausibly realistic dialogue among characters on whose minds a specific thing is weighing rather heavily; repetition for emphasis.

The rest of the scene doesn't play like that, and Martin's elegance comes to the fore.

I generally like Martin's prose a lot, but I'm not saying he never commits any clunkers - Ned's thoughts with Robert Baratheon in the Stark family crypt/basement a couple of chapters later strike me as making an absolute pig's innards of dancing around and hinting at the specific thing Ned knows there and Martin does not wish to tell the reader, for example. Just that I really don't think this is one. 

[Cyclone Jack]

Just a few points:

Remember that dialouge is revelatory rather than descriptive, and the main story aspect it should reveal is character.

While it is a good idea to listen to real world conversations to get a feel for the different ways that various couples or groups (boyfriend/girlfriend, four co-workers, mother/son etc.) interact in conversation, your aim should not be 'realistic' dialouge. Real dialouge contains lots of pauses, coughs, sniffs, 'uhhhhhs', 'ummmmms', sidetracks in point, lulls, etc. Your goal should be believable dialouge that flows; pleasant to the ear but not artificial. Remember, your dialouge is not a free form conversation, but a tool you are using to advance your story.

Last and, IMO, most important: give seperate characters their own voice. It does not have to be radically different, but it should be different.

Hope that helps a bit.