WAG of fate. spoilers!

[wizard nelson]

  just when i'm tooting my own horn i discover something i'd overlooked. there is a Yeats' The Second Coming thread on here. according to the Nyarlathotep wiki i was idly browsing the second coming was put in the nyarlathotep cycle. a collection of works refering to or inspired by nyarlathotep. so nyarlathotep has already been vaguely refered to in storm front through the yeats reference. nice support of cowl/nyarlathotep. or cowl being possessed by him as this is one of his shticks. entering dark arts users under false pretenses of greater power. hell nyarlathotep could be nemesis actually.

[KrelianZG]

Two issues here.

Nyx was described as being feared (or respected, or...well, the literature isn't sure) by even the other Titans. And preceded Gaia (who is assumed to be where the Mothers came from).

Nyarlathotep was, if what I gather from the Lovecraft stories is correct, on the level of at LEAST the Mothers, if not on the level of beings like Uriel. Cowl being his avatar makes no sense. Going by the Lovecraft model at least, Nyarlathotep had no problems interacting with the mortal world. That was what made him so creepy. He wouldn't disguise himself, he'd just act.

[wizard nelson]

umm... narcowatsit is the god of a thousand faces... disguise is kinda his thing. he'd be more lvl with a queen. his purpose is to watch over the lesser of the great old ones who sleep close to the mortal world awaiting to awaken. those he watches would be mother lvl beings.
not sure your point on nyx.. i've mostly ignored nyx in my theories as i'm not sure her proper place in the DV or if she is now an aspect of another being.

[KrelianZG]

If anything, I'd see Nyarlathotep as the Outsider version of an archangel. He doesn't put a direct hand in things, but he keeps an eye on mortals, and is interested in how they develop. He never disguised himself in an intent to deceive, from the stories I've read. Anytime he was confronted, he either spoke or fled.

Maybe I'm misremembering, but I always saw him as being a guy that was involved, and either chose to reveal himself, or, when pressed, pretty much just vanished into thin air.

I always thought people like Erich Zann had a "line" on Nyarlathotep, much like the bearers of the SotC had on the WG, personally...

[wizard nelson]

Nyarlathotep, however, is active and frequently walks the Earth in the guise of a human being, usually a tall, slim, joyous man. He has "a thousand" other forms,

Nyarlathotep uses human languages and can be mistaken for a human being.

no he does stuff with his own hands it seems to me. to clarify nemesis is probably Nyarlathotep and cowl is his chosen avatar. kinda like the direct line as opposed to having all of his power in one thing. still think it would equal out at cowl being Nyarlathotep more or less. in Nyarlathotep first appearance he gathers followers who lose touch with reality while its implied the world has gone apocalyptic without anyone realising in their stupor. idk though i've only really started studying lovecraft in the last two months. when ducky pointed out to me the connection. previously i'd owned a necronomicon tarot though... i threw the creepy bastards in the trash after some weird stuff with them.

[wizard nelson]

to expand on my line of reasoning and WAG off the wall a little nemesis might also be morgana herself, the missing queen of the trifecta. possibly previous ruler of the fomor when they were still associated with the sidhe. i know this isn't precisely consistent but i could ignore morgana no longer, especially with mab being morgause.

[Ms Duck]

to expand on my line of reasoning and WAG off the wall a little nemesis might also be morgana herself, the missing queen of the trifecta. possibly previous ruler of the fomor when they were still associated with the sidhe. i know this isn't precisely consistent but i could ignore morgana no longer, especially with mab being morgause.

she's not missing, she's dead. that was her dagger Lea got in GP; WOJ is the prior winter lady.. possibly her... had a bad end last time a starborn was around.

[wizard nelson]

she's not missing, she's dead. that was her dagger Lea got in GP; WOJ is the prior winter lady.. possibly her... had a bad end last time a starborn was around.

i know its her dagger. doesn't mean she was WL, it wouldn't be congruent to have two sister queens with the 3rd just a lady. morgana isn't precisely the kind to take orders. don't you think its significant its HER particular dagger through which nemesis first appears?

[Ms Duck]

i know its her dagger. doesn't mean she was WL, it wouldn't be congruent to have two sister queens with the 3rd just a lady. morgana isn't precisely the kind to take orders. don't you think its significant its HER particular dagger through which nemesis first appears?

maybe. but I think it was a trap; when you trap something, you put it in something the other person wants.. aka its cheese.

Morgan Le Fey was the youngest of the three sisters in the legend. having her be lady to her older and scarier sister morgawse ..fits.

[wizard nelson]

maybe. but I think it was a trap; when you trap something, you put it in something the other person wants.. aka its cheese.

Morgan Le Fey was the youngest of the three sisters in the legend. having her be lady to her older and scarier sister morgawse ..fits.

good point on the trap. disagree on the youngest queen setting for 'lady'. besides youngest doesn't equal weakest(fyi i'm the youngestof 4, i know) especially if lea thought merely holding the anthema would be enough to take on mab. interestingly this means nemesis intended lea to challenge mab and take her place. installing a sleeper agent as the general against outsiders. very bad.

[rekshek]

So I read most of lovecraft during my senior year of highschool (5 years ago) so bear with me, but Nyarl was a badass as far as outer gods go. He was the only active one of the outer gods, could walk on earth, loved chaos and deception above death and destruction, and was the son of Azathoth. He wouldn't need an avatar to walk around with if we go by legends, and if we go by beings of his size (he would at least be Mother level) then I guess he might but Cowl doesn't seem to fit him to well, as he always worked his con alone if I remember right (Kumori puts a hit on him being cowl thus).

[wizard nelson]

not really bad ass per se just more active in getting stuff done.

(Kumori puts a hit on him being cowl thus).

i don't understand...? but kimori working with cowl doesn't negate a nyarl connection, every incarnation of him is different. ever read stephen kings dark tower? according to nyarl wiki randall flagg was nyarl. i didn't know this from reading it at all. as kimori seems to be working with him based on very skewed perceptions deception is involved probably. nyarl doesn't have to be precisely as depicted elsewhere as jims flavor of reality would definitely shift his character. possibly nyarl doesn't have the power inside the gates he should? its better said that nemesis is nyarl and cowl is his vessel, especially as harrys feel of his magic is that its human and not the greasier stuff used by black court or others. mmm notice black magic is discribed with the same (if lessened) feel as outsiders are? ahhh i wonder...

[rekshek]

not really bad ass per se just more active in getting stuff done. i don't understand...? but kimori working with cowl doesn't negate a nyarl connection, every incarnation of him is different. ever read stephen kings dark tower? according to nyarl wiki randall flagg was nyarl. i didn't know this from reading it at all. as kimori seems to be working with him based on very skewed perceptions deception is involved probably. nyarl doesn't have to be precisely as depicted elsewhere as jims flavor of reality would definitely shift his character. possibly nyarl doesn't have the power inside the gates he should? its better said that nemesis is nyarl and cowl is his vessel, especially as harrys feel of his magic is that its human and not the greasier stuff used by black court or others. mmm notice black magic is discribed with the same (if lessened) feel as outsiders are? ahhh i wonder...

Eh I seriously doubt he needs a vassal/avatar like Cowl, it just goes against the core of what Lovecraft wanted in Nyarl, as he was the outer god that walked among man, having an avatar is a pretty big shift from his identity. Him being Nemesis is possible, would go along well what what he is. Also while Cowl is seriously tough, he has been shown to be wounded from fights with Harry and HWWB didn't seem to retain anything from Harrys first encounter in WK.

[wizard nelson]

one of nyarl's things is promising dark arts users power in exchange for entrance to their body. if nemesis/nyarl is beyond the gates(as such a being should be) then a mortal wizard he can subsume and potentially take as his own body would be perfect. in the end it wouldn't matter who cowl WAS(unless its seriously twisty) as much as what he becomes. cowl's monologue to harry about insanity certainly could point to him knowing somethings in his head and wondering if its skewed his perceptions. if this is nemesis we already know he works with beings or trys to compromise them outright. i'd imagine it works similarly to the denarians, i can be your buddy or if you slip up and let me (or if it suits me) i'll be your master. this certainly is congruent with other known infections.
and technically nyarl is nothing BUT avatar btw. he's an avatar himself of the outergods iirc.