The Red Court Lives....sort of (Spoilers Changes, GS, and CD)

[madness]

Read #2 of the first post on this thread...concerning the black out.

Yeah.

I am sort of spinning it and speculating that something from the Red Court got into his head at the moment of the curse (rather than it being Arianna).

I wonder if whatever enchantment or curse created the Red Court Vampires had some sort of built-in device for surviving the death of its hosts (similar to the cases of Harley MacFinn and the Archive)?

[kustenjaeger]

Greetings

While something happened in the 2 minutes after the death curse on the Red Court took effect that Harry is blocking, I can't see any evidence for Arianna doing any sort of transfer.

The survival of the RC spirit at all is speculation on which we have no information; its transfer to Harry is even more speculative and, more to the point, we have no evidence for, merely an unknown two minutes.

Regards

Edward

[GrandPanjandrum]

Greetings

I can't see any evidence for Arianna doing any sort of transfer.
Edward

She stared up at me with uncomprehending eyes, black blood staining her mouth. "Cattle.  You are c-cattle."
"Moo," I said. And I lifted my right hand.
Her eyes widened further.  She gasped a word I didn't know.

[Kwazy Klown]

orbweaver, liverspots was fully human when he cast his death curse, albeit a weak pansy ass one... he was practitioner enough without the coin, so i don't think that counts as non human. a half blood like martin or even thomas might have one too if they knew magic. bianca was full vamp. pretty sure even denarian with a coin is still technically human anyway.

 One teensy nit-pick here. I believe Thomas does have some magic of his own. I don't know if it's related to his being a WC Vampire but if I recall correctly,..... was it Back Up?...where he does use his pentacle necklace to track Harry...anyone want to back me up or dispute this?

[TheCuriousFan]

One teensy nit-pick here. I believe Thomas does have some magic of his own. I don't know if it's related to his being a WC Vampire but if I recall correctly,..... was it Back Up?...where he does use his pentacle necklace to track Harry...anyone want to back me up or dispute this?

He uses a tracking spell in Backup based off the pentacle.

[GrandPanjandrum]

One teensy nit-pick here. I believe Thomas does have some magic of his own. I don't know if it's related to his being a WC Vampire but if I recall correctly,..... was it Back Up?...where he does use his pentacle necklace to track Harry...anyone want to back me up or dispute this?

Thomas holds a small amount of magic.  In White Knight he is able to find an exit from the Never Never and open it (strip club I think).   But, it doesn't really matter since Ebenezer points out that Mavra could have thrown a Death Curse at Harry...and she's definitely not human...or alive.

[Maredudd]

ARRG! thats what i'm trying to SAY she didn't have the demon just some abnormalities... ARGG! *migraine starts up*

Uh oh! Wizard Nelson has acquired a parasite! :-)

I see what you are talking about but I've not seen any textual references that convince me it's credible. I'll remain open to the possibility and will be looking for bits in the next several books when/if Maggie actually shows up again.

[kustenjaeger]

Greetings

Arianna's one word is more likely to be soething like 'don't' in Maya as Harry raises his right hand to finish her off (which is what he does). 

If we had any evidence for Arianna knowing anything about transfer spells, for the RC spirit transferring too etc I'd go for it as an interesting theory.  But at present there's nothing I'm aware of to give it weight.

Regards

Edward

[123456789blaaa]

I think Lash is growing a soul ever since she practiced Free Will in White Knight.  But, I think she, also, has company in there.

Your comment got me thinking about the dreams that went out into the world to pregnant women when the curse was released.  That's kind of interesting from a "conception" point of view relative to Arianna.

Well actually:

Well, no, but he [Bob] said that Lash got, obtained free will.
Yeah, Bob doesn’t have to tell the truth to Dresden! (Laughter) I mean, come on! Bob offered it as a possible explanation, but you know, Bob’s essentially…he’s a theoretician. That’s what he does… ‘Explain this’ , ‘Okay, maybe it was this, I don’t know.’ But yeah, he tries to stay out of the whole, anything like, anything that verges on morality, Bob tries to avoid speaking with any authority on because he doesn’t have any compass himself. It all depends on who actually happens to be in possession of the skull at the time.

[GrandPanjandrum]

Greetings

Arianna's one word is more likely to be soething like 'don't' in Maya as Harry raises his right hand to finish her off (which is what he does). 

If we had any evidence for Arianna knowing anything about transfer spells, for the RC spirit transferring too etc I'd go for it as an interesting theory.  But at present there's nothing I'm aware of to give it weight.

Regards

Edward

Yeah...maybe.  But, in Changes just before her big flattening ending as Harry is walking up to her, she is repeatedly saying "No...no...no...no..."  She switches to the unrecognized single word as she realizes Harry's intent and just before the "hammer."  That suggests a focus word for a prepared spell in my opinion (just in case).  And since we have a potential member of the "Black Circle" (Corpestaker) using that spell as her pièce de résistance in a tight spot as well as Arianna's granddaughter working hand in hand with Mavra (who could also be associated with Corpsetaker and is, most definitely trained in necromancy), and we, also, have a Red Court vampire centuries old who happens to be a sorceress, the potential is there to have learned the spell from any number of sources.

[Ben de Wal]

 the main problem i see with this that harry was having increasingly bad migrains for months before the beging of turn coat nice idea though 

[TDF_fan]

Bear in mind that when Harry was about to execute Arianna at the end of the duel, he made note that she was skewered in numerous places by the shards of ice that he directed towards her including the one in her stomach. Unless Arianna could ignore the spike that opened her blood reservoir, (which makes Ramps weaker than kittens), I find it unlikely that she could have managed to attempt any spell against Harry with a single word just before he craters her.

[GrandPanjandrum]

Bear in mind that when Harry was about to execute Arianna at the end of the duel, he made note that she was skewered in numerous places by the shards of ice that he directed towards her including the one in her stomach. Unless Arianna could ignore the spike that opened her blood reservoir, (which makes Ramps weaker than kittens), I find it unlikely that she could have managed to attempt any spell against Harry with a single word just before he craters her.

Good point...but think about this...it didn't work.  If it was the Corpsetaker's spell, Arianna would own Harry's body, and Harry would be non-existent.

[TDF_fan]

Good point...but think about this...it didn't work.  If it was the Corpsetaker's spell, Arianna would own Harry's body, and Harry would be non-existent.

Exactly, it wouldn't have worked for her with the pain she was in and the loss of her blood reservoir, and Corpsetaker herself had difficulty assaulting Harry's mind when she was still alive (she would have eventually taken him but he was making her work for it) so I doubt that Arianna would have been able to do better, especially when she was not a frequent user of that technique. (Body Swapping, Ramps were known to be able to exert some mental influence, but never swapping since that ultimately would have been in their eyes a losing proposition.)

[catnip13]

I'm rereading Dead Beat right now, and another parasite possibility just occurred to me: Bob.

When he's doing his megalomaniac villain act, he forces something into Harry's mouth and then cackles that it's too late. And now he's asking for a back up vessel. I've previously been of the parasite=Lash camp, but now I wonder, especially because Bob has been known to strike bargains with people. And it did sort of burst out of his skull ... his enchanted one.