[CD spoilers] Cowl = Simon reference thread

[Second Aristh]

Do most of you who think Cowl=Simon also think Elaine=Kumori?   

I'm of the mind that Cowl=Simon, but Kumori isn't really anyone else (possibly the apprentice that Simon has been mentioned having; she's more unknown than Kumori as far as we're concerned).  I don't think that Kumori=Elaine.

[KurtinStGeorge]

Not since the recent mention that Simon had a female apprentice.

Because she was never enthralled, but a free-willed associate of Justin and went to Simon for support and protection when Justin died ?

Not bad, particularly the second point.

[madness]

I have always thought it possible that Simon was possibly behind the involvement of Justin and Maggie in all of these plots in the first place.

It isn't my favorite theory but I think that the theory could be made to fit.

Simon could have swooped in and rescued Elaine in the aftermath of Justin's death.  Whether she was enthralled or not.  If Justin was training the children at the command or suggestion of Simon from the beginning then Simon would know how to track her down.

[the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh]

I have always thought it possible that Simon was possibly behind the involvement of Justin and Maggie in all of these plots in the first place.

I am fond of that notion, because I get the strong impression that knowledge about Outsiders is very rare in the DV (there's a Law against looking for it, and we see in Bob's report of the Council going all Fahrenheit 451 on Kemmler's writings in DB what the Council's policy is like with regard to information specifically about Lawbreaking), and if Simon == Cowl, we then have direct connections between everyone we've seen display knowledge of Outsiders in the series prior to CD (Justin as Simon's apprentice, and Justin and Maggie and Lord Raith linked by Eb in BR) which would be neat and orderly and Occamian.

[madness]

I am fond of that notion, because I get the strong impression that knowledge about Outsiders is very rare in the DV (there's a Law against looking for it, and we see in Bob's report of the Council going all Fahrenheit 451 on Kemmler's writings in DB what the Council's policy is like with regard to information specifically about Lawbreaking), and if Simon == Cowl, we then have direct connections between everyone we've seen display knowledge of Outsiders in the series prior to CD (Justin as Simon's apprentice, and Justin and Maggie and Lord Raith linked by Eb in BR) which would be neat and orderly and Occamian.

It also provides an easy explanation for how Maggie could have gotten involved - the heroic and powerful friend of her father that she might have sought out once she ran away from home.

[Arjan]

I am fond of that notion, because I get the strong impression that knowledge about Outsiders is very rare in the DV (there's a Law against looking for it, and we see in Bob's report of the Council going all Fahrenheit 451 on Kemmler's writings in DB what the Council's policy is like with regard to information specifically about Lawbreaking), and if Simon == Cowl, we then have direct connections between everyone we've seen display knowledge of Outsiders in the series prior to CD (Justin as Simon's apprentice, and Justin and Maggie and Lord Raith linked by Eb in BR) which would be neat and orderly and Occamian.

But there is one place that most likely has books about outsiders. Lord Raith's library.

[the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh]

But there is one place that most likely has books about outsiders. Lord Raith's library.

There has to be some source for information about Outsiders getting into the Lord Raith/Maggie/Justin/Cowl-if-he-is-Simon cabal, and maybe Lord Raith has some of that now, but I am not seeing any reason to assume that he's the one who first had it, rather than having learned it from Maggie or one of the others.

Given that Lord Raith appears to be sufficiently low-grade a magical talent to need to work with others to pull off a ritual, though, I suspect that anything he has will at best be specific magical recipes (like Victor Sell's set of spells) rather than that he can be a researcher and designer of sophisticated Outsider-based magic; Maggie seems a much more likely candidate for that to me.

[Arjan]

There has to be some source for information about Outsiders getting into the Lord Raith/Maggie/Justin/Cowl-if-he-is-Simon cabal, and maybe Lord Raith has some of that now, but I am not seeing any reason to assume that he's the one who first had it, rather than having learned it from Maggie or one of the others.

Given that Lord Raith appears to be sufficiently low-grade a magical talent to need to work with others to pull off a ritual, though, I suspect that anything he has will at best be specific magical recipes (like Victor Sell's set of spells) rather than that he can be a researcher and designer of sophisticated Outsider-based magic; Maggie seems a much more likely candidate for that to me.

There was talk about a library, not just a few books.

I do not think Lord Raith had these books for himself. He has a history of enthralling sorceresses and they were for their use as well. As additional lure and as a source of indirect (via the enthralled witch) power.

He might even have inherited from former heads of house Raith.  There is probably a lot in there he can not use because he collects them. And he will especially collect books that are against white council law and teachings. Just to make it more interesting and because he can.

Those are my suspicions anyway.

[the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh]

I do not think Lord Raith had these books for himself. He has a history of enthralling sorceresses and they were for their use as well.

Sorry, where do you get that about the history from ? The sorceresses in BR don't seem enthralled; I doubt they'd have aimed a curse at Inari if they had been.

[Arjan]

Sorry, where do you get that about the history from ? The sorceresses in BR don't seem enthralled; I doubt they'd have aimed a curse at Inari if they had been.

I presume the normal whampire lust whammie but we do not know for sure. Margaret might have been but after her death curse Lord Raith had to preserve energy.

But enthrallment or not the important thing is that he attracts female practitioners to do the magic he can not do himself and a big library is an asset for that.

[123456789blaaa]

This doesn't exactly make sense to me. To me, this argument assumes that we've seen every human SC-level wizard in the Dresdenverse, and that because we've seen them all, Cowl must therefore be one of them. That's a pretty big assumption, with no support to back it up, especially given Harry's notoriety for unreliable narration. A wizard of SC-level skill could easily hide their existence from others if he or she so chose.

I think this bears repeating. I love Simon=Cowl but the OP makes a somewhat baffling assumption. Elegast, could you present your rational? 

[madness]

I think this bears repeating. I love Simon=Cowl but the OP makes a somewhat baffling assumption. Elegast, could you present your rational?

I don't see how it would be easy for a White Council trained wizard to live 250-300 years while amassing such skill and power without his peers (similarly old and powerful wizards) knowing about him.

It is sort of like having some super duper movie assassin pop-up that no one knows about.  The odds are really, really good that they had serious military training at some point. 

They can probably physically hide but they can't hide their identity (if they walk around with no disguise) because the community is just too small and the skillset is just too unique.  Someone in the community will recognize them.

Harry and Elaine are really the only examples of White Council educated wizards that we who were not known to the White Council during their apprenticeships.  Even Kemmler's disciples were known to the White Council (and if I had to guess I would say that they were actual members who defected or were corrupted).

[madness]

If Cowl isn't Simon then it seems likely that he is either some long retired wizard that has disappeared or that he was some young wizard that the Fomor abducted/recruited and who has been presumed dead for a very long time.

[phoenixjustice]

I don't see how it would be easy for a White Council trained wizard to live 250-300 years while amassing such skill and power without his peers (similarly old and powerful wizards) knowing about him.

Oh no, it's definitely possible; Aizen in Bleach held back how powerful he truly was for hundreds of years without being detected. I would think it most definitely be possible, especially if they are noted to be powerful, like Simon. Aizen was so powerful, he was able to trick some of the most powerful characters with illusions that they couldn't even detect them until he pointed them out. I think Simon just chose to leave when it was time/the opportunity presented itself and/or something came up, like a plan beginning/starting to come to fruition.

[psuliin]

One more piece of evidence that Cowl = SP: Cowl seems to be closely and recently acquainted with the wardens and how they feel about Dresden. That implies someone either on the Senior Council, very close to the SC, a leader of the wardens, or some combination of the three. Simon Petrovich fits all of those parameters.

There are two points that I think may make this theory less certain, however.

First, while the wizards listed in the OP are the only SC-level wizards named in the novels so far, LTW clearly indicated that there were several others who might have been tapped to the Senior Council. Whether any of those have the contacts with the Wardens necessary to say some of the things Cowl has said is unknown.

Second, I think several things suggest that Simon Petrovich's body was found at Archangel. WoJ talked about the vampires found "around Simon," seemingly destroyed by his death curse. And also if his body had NOT been found then I think that would have been noteworthy. I certainly wouldn't presume that a member of the Senior Council was dead until I saw the body (and maybe not even then), and I don't think other members of the SC would do so either. Even more important though, if Simon's body had NOT been found then one obvious possibility would be that the Reds had taken him alive. And that would be a top-priority emergency for the Senior Council, due to the possibility of Simon being turned and converted into a member of the Red Court. That would be a disaster. The fact that this never came up leads me to think that Simon's body was found at Archangel.

Now, another poster suggested that Simon/Cowl could have died and then used Corpsetaker-style body-jumping to escape. But if he did that then how did his new body sustain the serious injuries that we believe he suffered?

On balance, I think the weight of evidence is slightly in favor of the theory, but some questions do remain.