Cold Days Book Club - Chapters 45-53 **MAJOR SPOILERS**

[xakko]

Can anyone think of a lie that Aurora told?  I really can't - I just remember Harry thinking how she'd used typical Sidhe wordplay and her magic healing touch to distract him.

Granted, the Adversary may not have been willing to let it be known it was in action, but I was just wondering if someone /else/ might have been infected, someone who Aurora trusted and who talked her down the path that lead to her actions.  Elaine is a possibility, but I can't remember if Talos had an on screen death... and I wonder if he might be less trustworthy.

[DragonEyes]

Aurora didn't have to get the same change from Nemesis as Maeve. I can't think of a lie Aurora told, but I also think that Aurora wasn't fully aware of Nemesis. I think it drove her mad. Two theories why:

1) Nemesis grows stronger the more hosts he/she/it has.

B) Nemesis uses the least effort necessary to accomplish goals, possibly because the cost of action is somehow high.

[Arjan]

Aurora didn't have to get the same change from Nemesis as Maeve. I can't think of a lie Aurora told, but I also think that Aurora wasn't fully aware of Nemesis. I think it drove her mad. Two theories why:

1) Nemesis grows stronger the more hosts he/she/it has.

Unlikely. It would spread like a nuclear reaction. Earth would have been gone already. I think there is some limit in the number of hosts a single outsider mind can control. There might be even only one mind behind every infection.

B) Nemesis uses the least effort necessary to accomplish goals, possibly because the cost of action is somehow high.

The risk of detection also grows with more influence on the victim. Using as little influence as needed is the key. Harry saw easily that Sith was infected because of his unusual behaviour. The infected Sith was also not as good a fighter as the original.

[dimumurray]

I wander how Harry and Molly will handle their mutual winter hormone problem?

We know Harry will do his damnedest not to act on those impulses. But as Winter Lady, Molly is now in a position to compel Harry to do the "deed" (at least when he's under the influence of Winter). Given how she feels it will be interesting to see how she grapples with having that option.

[Mars447]

We know Harry will do his damnedest not to act on those impulses. But as Winter Lady, Molly is now in a position to compel Harry to do the "deed" (at least when he's under the influence of Winter). Given how she feels it will be interesting to see how she grapples with having that option.

Or in other words, "Does Molly value Harry's friendship over being able to have sex with him"?

I just hope that she sees what's wrong in raping her family's friend.

[huangjimmy108]

We know Harry will do his damnedest not to act on those impulses. But as Winter Lady, Molly is now in a position to compel Harry to do the "deed" (at least when he's under the influence of Winter). Given how she feels it will be interesting to see how she grapples with having that option.

It is worst than that. Other than the fact she can now compel Harry, I bet the winter lady mantle will jack up her sexual drive to eleven and with Harry also under the influence of winter knight powers....

If anything happens between those two, Murphy will not be happy.

Not to mention Molly becoming the winter lady effectively eliminates any hope Harry ever escape the winter knight job. Even if he can find a way to remove the knight mantle without dying, he could not just leave Molly alone. It would be Lily all over again.

It's a mess.

[Arjan]

It is worst than that. Other than the fact she can now compel Harry, I bet the winter lady mantle will jack up her sexual drive to eleven and with Harry also under the influence of winter knight powers....

Maeve was in control of her sexual drive. She used it as a weapon and as a distraction. That might have been because she fed it enough like Lara though. See Larissa's comments to Maeve at the end when they confronted each other.

If anything happens between those two, Murphy will not be happy.

I think she might be more understanding than Harry himself.

Not to mention Molly becoming the winter lady effectively eliminates any hope Harry ever escape the winter knight job. Even if he can find a way to remove the knight mantle without dying, he could not just leave Molly alone. It would be Lily all over again.

Molly is smarter, more informed and more supported than Lilly. She has a lot of experience in resisting temptations of all sorts like black magic and white court. She has more life experience than Lilly had and she has survived difficult circumstances and great trauma.

She is able to act on her own. She has learned a lot of things we do not know about. She is prepared. Lilly's only experience has been being a victim.

And that points to the biggest danger. It is not becoming Lilly, it is becoming Mab, or what Mab thinks a winter lady should be.

It's a mess.

Exactly as it should be in the dresdenverse

[rickbman]

Jim Butcher really has a way of making you feel like he is about to answer a whole lot of questions, only to have you asking more questions by the end of the book.

While reading the last chapter on my kindle I accidentally skipped ahead a few pages and all I saw was the "No... Molly... No" or whatever it was and I was starting to worry about what was going to happen to her and as soon as they started talking about passing mantles I started to panic. That twist really punched me in the gut. Jim Butcher can just never makes things easy for poor Molly.

[Mr. Death]

Yeah, that whole last sequence just about put me into a state of shock. Reading Lily's death scene was one of those things where I read it, stopped, then read it over again, hoping and praying that I had read it wrong, or missed something. And then Molly...And right after the whole book shows her as getting her life back together into something approaching normal, too.

[rickbman]

Seeing how Michael and Charity deal with this is going to be interesting.

[jlayne]

Seeing how Michael and Charity deal with this is going to be interesting.

I'm buying popcorn when the next book comes out, just so I can have it on hand when I get to that part.

[jlayne]

The art is by Lee Moyer.  I was the model for Lee's reference photos of the various Mollys.  You can see a handful here!

Just stumbled upon this. That calendar is awesome, that picture is awesome. You, therefore must also be awesome.

[JustKidding]

What I find pretty stunning is that Harry summoned(or encountered, in the case of the mother summer) all of the senior powers of faerie in a very short period of time. Bro goes hard. Also, mother winter is a stone cold boss. She is most definitely the scariest queen. Butcher has a talent for developing characters like her very richly. I had to chuckle with the whole window soot thing and cleaver business. I wonder what would have happened to the poor boy if the cleaver had hit him...(also what the heck is it made out of? I've always wondered what the fae use instead of steel. I don't think I would put it past the mothers to actually use real steel/iron, though.)
The only thing that is really ticking me off about this book is Harry's freaking messed up daughter issues. It totally jars my image of his character to see him scared to introduce himself to his daughter's life. Yeah, yeah, he has reasons, but I think a big warm fuzzy soul like Harry's is not going to scare away anyone. The girl won't be afraid of big scarred dudes, Michael and Sanya are around all the time. I wish he could have gone to see her before the whole Molly/Maeve thingy went and added a whole layer of distraction. Makes me sad, folks.

[DragonEyes]

What I find pretty stunning is that Harry summoned(or encountered, in the case of the mother summer) all of the senior powers of faerie in a very short period of time. Bro goes hard. Also, mother winter is a stone cold boss. She is most definitely the scariest queen. Butcher has a talent for developing characters like her very richly. I had to chuckle with the whole window soot thing and cleaver business. I wonder what would have happened to the poor boy if the cleaver had hit him...(also what the heck is it made out of? I've always wondered what the fae use instead of steel. I don't think I would put it past the mothers to actually use real steel/iron, though.)
The only thing that is really ticking me off about this book is Harry's freaking messed up daughter issues. It totally jars my image of his character to see him scared to introduce himself to his daughter's life. Yeah, yeah, he has reasons, but I think a big warm fuzzy soul like Harry's is not going to scare away anyone. The girl won't be afraid of big scarred dudes, Michael and Sanya are around all the time. I wish he could have gone to see her before the whole Molly/Maeve thingy went and added a whole layer of distraction. Makes me sad, folks.

That is absolutely believable on many levels. First, Dresden doesn't know her likes or dislikes, her wants or fears. He doesn't have a place in her life and doesn't have a purchase to close in with her other than "I had sex with and killed your mom... wanna play Barbies?" Second, Dresden isn't the most emotionally stable person EVEN WITHOUT the mantle. Add in the mantle, he's pretty much a monster in the making. He has to learn to control that before he can even consider getting involved in her life. Third, Harry feels like he screwed up with Molly, something fierce. He probably doesn't want to "try try again" with a nine-year-old girl. And fourth, she's at Michael's house. Michael got out and Harry feels guilty as hell for what happened to him to get him out. Michael wants out and Harry doesn't want to bring him back in, conscious or unconscious. He screws up the lives of everyone he touches, something fierce (in his eyes, not mine.) Why would bring that on his daughter and back onto Michael?

[jlayne]

And now confronting Maggie means talking to Michael and Charity about Molly. God help Harry. He's a dead man.