Warden Sword for a Mortal?

[Dastion]

As far as the rules go, it's doable.  But the player would need some sort of Refresh allocation to account for their access to an item who's Enchanted Item Slots are associated with an NPC (unless they can talk a player into it).  Two item slots cost 0.5 Refresh, so the remaining 0.5 to externalize it to an NPC wouldn't be bad.

So while it works for game mechanics, I'm still not sure about the story reason why a Pure Mortal would be entrusted with a Warden's Sword, since it's the symbol of magical police and the intent behind it is to allow them to kill rogue spellcasters without using their own magic.

[JDK002]

Because you aren't in control of the NPC. Which lets the GM play with the powers as he wants(Have start to fade because the wizard has poured any energy into it recently, Have it turn back on him because he used it in a way that it wasn't intended, Have the wizard come looking for it cause it was stolen from the one he gave it too 100 years ago or whatever), and allows for some pretty awesome situations. The other reason is IoP's are more powerful. A lot more in some cases.

All that said, I can understand why a GM would say no in most if not all cases, but I'm wondering if there is any rule preventing it.

The situation you just described would fall under the sponsored magic mechanic, which still counts as a supernatural power.

It's your game and any and all rules are more or less at the GM's discretion.  As a GM I'm personally very hard nosed about it.  The book on several occasions says to take a concept and match it to a game mechanic that works.  The problem with the half dozen or so threads I've seen where someone is trying to justify getting powers and keeping the +2 refresh is that they do the opposite.  They are trying to justify breaking, twisting, or exploiting how a rule is written to hamfist the narrative concept.

My method is very simple.  Does the character have regular access to ANY powers regardless of narrative flavoring?  If the answer is "yes" then they are not Pure Mortal.

[fantazero]

The situation you just described would fall under the sponsored magic mechanic, which still counts as a supernatural power.

It's your game and any and all rules are more or less at the GM's discretion.  As a GM I'm personally very hard nosed about it.  The book on several occasions says to take a concept and match it to a game mechanic that works.  The problem with the half dozen or so threads I've seen where someone is trying to justify getting powers and keeping the +2 refresh is that they do the opposite.  They are trying to justify breaking, twisting, or exploiting how a rule is written to hamfist the narrative concept.

My method is very simple.  Does the character have regular access to ANY powers regardless of narrative flavoring?  If the answer is "yes" then they are not Pure Mortal.

DING DING DING

[FishStampede]

DING DING DING

Well, that settles it. No Warden Sword for him.

Now, getting a normal sword and maybe the Warden cloak (I don't think its stainproofing is worth a refresh hit) would not be entirely out of the question, depending on how the current arc goes. How would you feel about a "Deputy Warden" pure mortal being in charge of a small but highly magical city?

[Lavecki121]

Well, that settles it. No Warden Sword for him.

I still dont understand your reasoning. Give him the sword but dont give him the power to use it unless he wants to lose the refresh at some point. Until then it would just act as a normal sword. You might even consider that when he "activates" the sword maybe it shifts into something more his style. For instance if he is a sneaky person maybe it becomes a warden dagger, if he is a brute it becomes a warden great sword. Flavor it up as much as you want because you can. The creator of the swords made each one for specific people, maybe because it does it itself.

I dont know, I just feel you are wasting a lot of story by simply denying him the sword and the ability to activate it in the future.

[FishStampede]

Not denying it completely, let me clarify. I'm just saying that if he wants to remain a pure mortal, he can't have a sword that acts like a Warden sword. It could be such a sword, but it won't act like one.

[Llayne]

It sounds like the player just wants the pure mortal bonus, since flavor wise he'd still be a vanilla mortal with a warden sword, even if he spent a point of refresh to get it.

[Lavecki121]

It sounds like the player just wants the pure mortal bonus, since flavor wise he'd still be a vanilla mortal with a warden sword, even if he spent a point of refresh to get it.

Yea but he would technically be spending 3 fate points to get it since he would lose his pure mortal bonus.

It could be such a sword, but it won't act like one.

Perfect. Thats what it should be.

[Taran]

Not denying it completely, let me clarify. I'm just saying that if he wants to remain a pure mortal, he can't have a sword that acts like a Warden sword. It could be such a sword, but it won't act like one.

Yes.  This is what I've been saying all along.  Give him a sword that gives no abilities that would normally require refresh.  Let him keep his Mortal Bonus.  If he ever chooses to want "unlock" the powers of the sword, he'll have to pay the refresh for it AND lose his Pure Mortal bonus.

I might let the sword do an extra point of damage.  I'd do the same if someone told me they wanted to be a Pure Mortal Samurai with a really High Quality Katana who built his whole concept around Sword Fighting.

[Lavecki121]

I might let the sword do an extra point of damage.  I'd do the same if someone told me they wanted to be a Pure Mortal Samurai with a really High Quality Katana who built his whole concept around Sword Fighting.

Yea but that wouldnt really affect the swords capabilities. It would just mean he is good with a sword. It states that a sword is a weapon 2 as RAW, even when applying it to an IoP such as the SotC.

[Mrmdubois]

If you wanted to flavor it as having really subtle power without actually crossing that boundary of having power and losing the Mortal refresh then you could make the sword the key to some unusual stunts, something like while he's wearing the sword it lets him use the Lore ability to sense the supernatural with his Alertness skill instead is just the first example that comes to mind.  Basically have the sword serve as the justification for some stunts that he could acquire.  Obviously having the sword on his person would be a prerequisite for activating any of those stunts, so not having the sword would indeed affect his effectiveness.

[Taran]

Yea but that wouldnt really affect the swords capabilities. It would just mean he is good with a sword. It states that a sword is a weapon 2 as RAW, even when applying it to an IoP such as the SotC.

Meh.  If you want to roll a higher resource roll and have a "higher quality" weapon, that's all the justification I need to say it's weapon 3 instead of weapon 2.  But that's as far as I'd go for a mundane weapon.  I see a Warden's sword as a "higher quality" weapon, hence the justification for having it do 3 instead of 2.  I mean, he could just say it's a 2 handed sword and it'd be weapon 3 anyways so I don't see it as a game-breaking thing.

[Lavecki121]

Nor do I but its a good thing to note that the SotC which is probably a high quality sword, is only a weapon 2

[Taran]

Nor do I but its a good thing to note that the SotC which is probably a high quality sword, is only a weapon 2

Right on.  I didn't know that.  In that case I'd keep it at 2.

[Mr. Death]

Esperacchius is Weapon:2. The other two are Weapon:3.

And as I recall, the weapons chart says that some swords are Weapon:2, some are Weapon:3, and the Warden Sword is listed as Weapon:3.