Enchanted item block, 1 use or one round?

[Discipol]

I would like to know if a "leather duster" with say, 7 block can be used once a round or once a defense?
Block rules say the block holds until it expires or it is overwhelmed (when it shatters or something), but such a thing does not come from a spell, but from an enchanted item block.

One could argue that its a spell in an item, should remain one round.
On the other hand, one could say that for each attack there is a separate defense.

Logically I would say that it should last one round because since the enchanted item block -> permanent armor got nerfed to dust, this would balance it out a bit.

[Tsunami]

For me, there are two kinds of defensive enchanted items.

1. The reactive kind

2. the activated kind.


The First kind lasts for one defense action only. It is less a block than a magical defense roll, and defense rolls do not last a whole round.

The Second kind takes up an action to activate like any other block does. It's a block in a can, and therefore duration works like any other block out there.


As for "nerfed to dust"... I have to disagree there. Defensive enchantments have benefited hugely from the enchanted items patch.
Prior to the patch you had to cut the Power of the item in half twice to get something permanent. To make a 2 shift defensive item you had to have 8 shifts of power.
Now even a wizard with a lower lore skill can make decent defensive items, and when you run out of uses you can always get more for some mental stress. It's a really great safety net.

[computerking]

Hmmm, Nerfed? Enchanted Items Patch?

Not having deeply delved into the Enchanting rules yet, these phrases make me ask: Was there some sort of change to the Enchanted items rules made after the printing of the book? And if so, where can I check out the new rules?

[zenten]

Hmmm, Nerfed? Enchanted Items Patch?

Not having deeply delved into the Enchanting rules yet, these phrases make me ask: Was there some sort of change to the Enchanted items rules made after the printing of the book? And if so, where can I check out the new rules?

When people preordered the book they were provided with a PDF.  This PDF differs in some way to the book that was printed.

[devonapple]

It also depends on whether the Block is a standard Block, or bought as Armor: Armor will last an entire exchange, but it costs double.

[Tsunami]

It also depends on whether the Block is a standard Block, or bought as Armor: Armor will last an entire exchange, but it costs double.

For my interpretation it makes no difference. Armor has the bonus that it combines with your defense roll, a block will replace the roll.

[devonapple]

For my interpretation it makes no difference. Armor has the bonus that it combines with your defense roll, a block will replace the roll.

IIRC, Armor's advantage is that it is not overcome by an attack the way a Block is, but it still substitutes for a defense roll.

I would love to know where to find the rule saying it adds to a defense roll! My players would like it as well.

[EdgeOfDreams]

IIRC, Armor's advantage is that it is not overcome by an attack the way a Block is, but it still substitutes for a defense roll.

I would love to know where to find the rule saying it adds to a defense roll! My players would like it as well.

By "adds to the defense roll" we mean that it effectively reduces the shifts generated by the incoming attack.  Armor does not literally add to the defense roll.

[Tsunami]

By "adds to the defense roll" we mean that it effectively reduces the shifts generated by the incoming attack.  Armor does not literally add to the defense roll.

Exactly.

If you use an enchanted item as armor, you get to use your defense roll, and you get to apply the armor value against the damage you take should the attack hit.

If you use the block function, then you get to apply the higher of either your defense roll, or your enchanted item defense against the attack.

Which is why i wrote that, when used as armor, it "combines" with the defense roll, not "adds to" the defense roll.

[devonapple]

If you use an enchanted item as armor, you get to use your defense roll, and you get to apply the armor value against the damage you take should the attack hit.

I'm not certain that I have the same impression about Armor also reducing shifts from the attack: I've been under the impression this whole time that its only advantage was it couldn't be overcome like a standard Block. I'm happy (so very happy!) to be wrong - can you please provide me with a citation I can look up?

[EdgeOfDreams]

devonapple, I'm not sure there's a specific citation, but go look in the sections on combat and how armor and weapon ratings work.  Armor from spells works exactly the same as armor from mundane equipment and toughness powers - it reduces incoming physical stress by an amount equal to the armor rating.

[devonapple]

devonapple, I'm not sure there's a specific citation, but go look in the sections on combat and how armor and weapon ratings work.  Armor from spells works exactly the same as armor from mundane equipment and toughness powers - it reduces incoming physical stress by an amount equal to the armor rating.

I know how mundane armor works in the system, and it does not help (or substitute for) Defense rolls.

So which of these is true (some contradict each other)? Evocation Armor:
a) costs twice the number of shifts of an equivalent Evocation Block
b) is a Block that cannot be overcome
c) applies for the entire Exchange/Duration in which it is active
d) acts as the Defense roll if it is the highest applicable Defense
e) acts as the Defense roll is all other Defense rolls have failed
f) reduces the stress from an incoming attack after a Defense roll

[computerking]

So which of these is true (some contradict each other)? Evocation Armor:
a) costs twice the number of shifts of an equivalent Evocation Block
b) is a Block that cannot be overcome
c) applies for the entire Exchange/Duration in which it is active
d) acts as the Defense roll if it is the highest applicable Defense
e) acts as the Defense roll is all other Defense rolls have failed
f) reduces the stress from an incoming attack after a Defense roll

I believe A, C, and F are true.

[EdgeOfDreams]

I know how mundane armor works in the system, and it does not help (or substitute for) Defense rolls.

So which of these is true (some contradict each other)? Evocation Armor:
a) costs twice the number of shifts of an equivalent Evocation Block
b) is a Block that cannot be overcome
c) applies for the entire Exchange/Duration in which it is active
d) acts as the Defense roll if it is the highest applicable Defense
e) acts as the Defense roll is all other Defense rolls have failed
f) reduces the stress from an incoming attack after a Defense roll

A, C, and F are true.

The reason we say it 'helps' defense rolls is this - if my Athletics roll is 4, the enemy makes a fists roll of 7 (3 shift difference, no weapons rating), and I have 3 armor from a spell, I end up taking no damage.  Whereas if I had used that spell as a block of 6 instead, the block would have been over come by the fists roll of 7, I'd take one stress, and my Athletics score would have no impact on the exchange.

Blocks replace your defense roll, while armor helps make up the difference between a failed defense roll and the total shifts of damage you have to take.

[Tsunami]

I know how mundane armor works in the system, and it does not help (or substitute for) Defense rolls.

Neither does Magical armor. It does reduce damage after it is determined if the attack hits.
It works exactly the same way Mundane armor does.

So which of these is true (some contradict each other)? Evocation Armor:

a) costs twice the number of shifts of an equivalent Evocation Block
b) is a Block that cannot be overcome
c) applies for the entire Exchange/Duration in which it is active
d) acts as the Defense roll if it is the highest applicable Defense
e) acts as the Defense roll is all other Defense rolls have failed
f) reduces the stress from an incoming attack after a Defense roll

These three are true

a) costs twice the number of shifts of an equivalent Evocation Block
c) applies for the entire Exchange/Duration in which it is active
f) reduces the stress from an incoming attack after a Defense roll



C also applies to normal evocation blocks, as long as they are not broken.

For me, there is an exception for reactive Enchanted items, where it only lasts for one attack. But that may vary based on rules interpretation.