Ghost Story Book Club - Chapters 46-FINISH **MAJOR SPOILERS**

[xakko]

Why is that "the question"?

because I thought the answer could possibly be 42?

but the math didn't work out.

I was just wondering aloud if that may have been an additional impetus for Justine to get Thomas to feed on her again.  I've been curious for a while now.  But yeah, not "THE question"

[Sgun]

because I thought the answer could possibly be 42?

but the math didn't work out.

I was just wondering aloud if that may have been an additional impetus for Justine to get Thomas to feed on her again.  I've been curious for a while now.  But yeah, not "THE question"

Yeah...have not thought about this at all...except that I have seen no past references in the books that Justine is emotionally unstable as she was previously in the series. It is entirely possible that she is reverting but I don't think so. I would recommend reading Even Hand for some alternate perspective into Justine's character.

As far as the tree being the parasite, I don't buy it. I think that whatever Demonreach encompasses (sic), the intellectus ascribed to it would seem to be indicative that it has taken the entire island to be its domain. I think that this is further backed up by Demonreach referring to itself as "here" when "providing nourishment" through root-shaped IV's and then referring to a completely different parasite maintaining blood flow.

Again...this is just my two cents...Please continue the discussion. Hope I haven't intruded too much.

[Glorificus]

Even Hand does not discuss Justine's mental illness issues at all. But it's a fun story about Marcone. Who is scum.

[john4200]

I think that whatever Demonreach encompasses (sic), the intellectus ascribed to it would seem to be indicative that it has taken the entire island to be its domain. I think that this is further backed up by Demonreach referring to itself as "here" when "providing nourishment" through root-shaped IV's and then referring to a completely different parasite maintaining blood flow.

Why do you write "sic" after your own word choice?

Anyway, I already responded to that issue. Most trees do not contain everything a human body needs for nourishment. But the island probably does. So, "here" (the island) provides nourishment and the parasite (the tree) circulates the blood. This is consistent with all the facts, and it is the simplest explanation since no other parasite is needed to keep the body alive, and nothing else that could be referred to as a parasite is mentioned in that passage. Postulating anything else is unnecessarily complicating things.

[MrsAWiggins05]

So, my gloating over getting GS for free came back to bite me this week. I've been forced to stay off the forum all week long because my copy got lost in another state. But it finally made it to me yesterday, and after fulfilling obligations, I finally read it today.

I think it took me longer to read this entire thread than it did the entire book.

There was really only one thing I wanted to chime in on:

It's about freaking time that Justine boned up enough to solve the True Love Curse problem. Some of us have been saying for years now that she just had to willingly make love to someone else and then Thomas could touch her. And notice she said, "Repeat as necessary." Sure, once she and Thomas make love, the Curse is in effect again. But then she can have sex with the girl. And she can make love to Thomas again. etc, etc, etc. I'm not really worried about any other White Court Vampire being able to feed on her again. She just needs to make sure that Thomas is the last one she makes love to before she leaves his apartment.

All the other Harry/whomever ships are side issues for me. I don't care whom he ends up with, just as long as he's happy.
(Ok, that was a lie. I'm a Team Murphy member; but I heard that coffin being nailed shut.)

[john4200]

Some of us have been saying for years now that she just had to willingly make love to someone else and then Thomas could touch her.

Not the best choice of words. Justine needs to have sex with someone else. Making love, not so much, since that might put the protection on her again.

[xakko]

(Ok, that was a lie. I'm a Team Murphy member; but I heard that coffin being nailed shut.)

there was no coffin.  they never found the body.

badum-dum.

seriously, Harry was flirting with Murphy when she was setting the charges. She's the one who can't get over the loss of Harry.  There's also the line, "Life is precious, fragile, fleeting - and Murphy's life was one of my favorites." 

I guess I can see where the Molly-Harry fans are coming from, if you accept that he's denying his feelings for her.  But I haven't seen anything in the text to say that Murphy no longer loves him.  What she does to him when she finds out he's alive - well, that may be an entirely different story for Jim to share with us.

[john4200]

What she does to him when she finds out he's alive - well, that may be an entirely different story for Jim to share with us.

It would be funny if Murphy tries to beat him up again and finds that it is not so easy now that Harry has the strength of the Winter Knight.

[laura_be]

I didn't hear the nails on that coffin either. Maybe GS opened the posibilities for Molly/Harry but it did not closed them for Karrin/Harry. I agree he was flirting with her and she knew it well, remember "patrick & demi" comment. And the way he was hurting when he saw her again, the window, the crying *sigh*

I don't see Karrin completely out of the picture.

What she's going to do when he's back? Who knows, maybe she'll finally realise all the time she's lost already and makes up for it to Harry

[Arjan]

So, which of the Fallen whispered in Harry's ear in the flashback from Changes? The Fallen looked like a shadow, so maybe Nicodemus?

Also, it was interesting that Mab lied to Harry. Harry always thought that the Fae were incapable of lying, but Uriel confirmed Mab's lie in the first of his seven words.

Mab can not do it but Harry can. And as long as Harry believes Mab can do it Mab can influence Harry so he will do it himself. Mab obviously thought she could do it that way.

If you read what she said she probably (I did not check all her statements) give predictions how it would end and suggestions and so on. Much like the promises Aurora gave to Slate. Technically not lies and that is enough. Uriel uses a more human approach to what is lying. He is talking to Harry, not to Mab.


 

[Farwind]

I agree with the assessment that  neither Uriel nor Mab were lying. Mab stated that Harry was free to mold as she pleases, which is not a lie. The implication that she has utter control over him is made, but implying something false is not blocked by her inability to lie. We are molded by our experiences, and she will be significantly involved in Dresden's future experiences. Therefore, she will be able to mold him. Uriel's statement "lies" was probably more focused on the implication that he had lost his free will to her desires.

I have a hard time believing that "the parasite" is lash. We've got two gaint powers in the Dresdenverse keeping him alive: Mab and Demonreach. Are we really to believe that these two extremely powerful beings needed the help of some puny hallucination Dresden dreamed up so that he could imagine he was taking a hot shower instead of an ice cold one? I think the parasite will be on roughly even strength to Mab and Demonreach, otherwise it wouldn't have been worth mentioning. (note: I noticed someone posted something about there being a WoJ on the subject. would they be willing to post it? I haven't been able to find it.)

As for the cheater who wispered to Dresden. (begin crazy and probably wrong theory here) Uriel mentioned it was "A being who could know a mortal's entire life." etc. Lash certainly did know Harry's life well, and Laciel herself has spent a significant amount of time on earth manipulating mortals. Plus, she is known for being the most "rebellious" among the Denarians. Even maybe willing to cheat by wispering a few words into Harry's ear in revenge for mutilating her shadow. In one of the WoJ, he pretty much states that Harry actually changed Lash before she died. Imagine the insult that must have been. An Immortal being, overcome by a mortal. And not only that, but he was able to convert her trusty minon into a being with free will. She'd have been pissed, and willing to bend a few rules for revenge.

And As far as getting into the chuch, isn't she already there? Locked inside her coin? or was she transferred somewhere else?

EDIT: Corrected the name of the Island.

[Sexyback]

I think that the parasite is Lash. The timing is too convenient. We know that Mab did some pretty impressive healing on Harry. She left the scars, but those are just cosmetic anyway. There's no reason to believe that she didn't restore the burned out parts of his brain in the process.

That's why I also think that the shadowy whisper wasn't Lash. It showed up pre-sexual healing. As to who it was: my money is on Anduriel or ol' Lu himself. I lean toward Anduriel, because the Nickelheads have a good reason to try to influence Harry. Harry was able to do two things which nobody has ever done before: shake off the coin's influence without renouncing his magical power in the process, and come thisclose to offing Nicodemus. They would either want him on their side or dead. If they get him especially desperate, he'd either take up the coin or do something desperate against the Red Court, which would kill him.

Oh well. None of it matters. The world is going to end in 2012, and now we know why: a certain coroner decided to introduce a certain Spirit of Intellect to a little thing called the internet. BOB IS ONLINE! WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE!

[uncanny]

One word.  AWESOME.

Now, only thing is.. I needs me some more!!!  Cold Days come faster!

[Gfan0154]

I completely overlooked that! Bob is online. I feel like we could start a whole new thread just listing possible consequences of Bob's new access to knowledge. 1. More perverted jokes than ever before, 2. Harry may no longer be hamstrung in his investigations due to no computer access, 3. Bob may grow even stronger since we all know knowledge is power, 4. Bob could start creating fake online profiles and having friends other than Harry and Butters!

[svb1972]

People are talking about "what a terrible thing Harry did to Molly."  Is noone remembering that at the time he /did/ that horrible thing a Fallen Angel (possibly even THE Fallen Angel) was whispering lies in his ear?

Harry in a moment of despair, fueled by one of the Fallen Angels whispering even more despair into his ear, asked the only person in the world who could accomplish what he needed done.  There was noone else who could erase his knowledge of suicide.  Noone. 

He chose to end his life, to save his daughters.  And yes, that meant asking Molly to help.  But, well, who else could he ask.