Discount for True Shapeshifting

[Taran]

My player wants to be able to shift into different animal forms. So he's taken modular abilities and Beast change but Beast change lets you change into 1 form.

I told him, for multiple forms he need True Shapeshifting and I'm giving him a +1 discount(making it -3) because he can only do beast forms (not lamps and vaccums).  He also wants some forms to be harder to change into.  So he could do a bear(which is his main form) as a suplemental, a mouse might be a full round, but a lizard or bird might take several exchanges and involve him doing some mojo (dancing around and chanting).  Should I give him a further discount?  Making his "true shapeshifting" -2?

[Tsunami]

I think even if you limit shape-changing to animal forms, you get a lot of utility out of it. I'd be wary of reducing the cost, but you could probably do it. But i would under no circumstances make it cheaper than -3.

That said: Imho "Some forms are harder to change into" is not a big enough disadvantage to justify a cost reduction in any case.

I'd handle it as a compel on his High Concept.
So if the difficulties the Character is having with changing to specific forms make his life complicated, then he gets a fate point.

If he changes into a really hard form in the safety of his own Home and then goes out he gets nothing for the difficulty.
If he wants to change mid conflict and it takes him several rounds... then he gets a fate point.
Or if he has to dance and sing to change into a form, but he doesn't want to get noticed, he gets a fate point for his trouble.

I think you get my meaning.


By the way: Whenever a shapechange requires a reallocation of form points via Modular abilities it takes a full action in any case.

[Bruce Coulson]

I have a player who took a similar limitation; only real-world animals (which does include people).  I gave that a +1 rebate.  It's an excuse for the players to spend a LOT of time at the Zoo, (which is ANG in our game, so they'd be there anyway...)

[tetrasodium]

the -3 cost sounds like a pretty good deal so far.  each new form could have entirely new skills and powers allowing him to be a do almost anything and fill almost any role in a sec character.  What did you mean by some forms being harder?  I know you give some examples, but wat about those forms makes them that way and how is it decided.
What you don't want is something like:
- bear for soaking damage and maybe some face eating.
- wolf for serious face eating  and speed/strength
- cougar(or whatever) for stealth and athletics with some face eating
- dog for tracking and whatever (maybe speed too)
- etc
all quickly and easily reachable..It's letting him easily fill a lot of roles as it is, you don't want to be giving much discount if he's going to be able to fill most o them quickly, right when it's needed every time it's needed.  I'd suggest getting full(partial) sheets with skills and powers already filled out for anything he wants t take less than say... an hour to change to and see how many roles he intents to fill.  give it to im for -3 and see how tings go for few/several games before you say ok your used to changing more and the hour is now reduced to...once it's clear he's not going to be essentially operating on an entirely different refresh level as the rest of your group.

[Sanctaphrax]

I agree with what Tsunami said.

@tetrasodium: True Shapeshifting doesn't let you change your powers. You need Modular Abilities for that. A character who tries to fill multiple roles using True Shapeshifting won't do any of them even nearly as well as a specialist.

[tetrasodium]

I agree with what Tsunami said.

@tetrasodium: True Shapeshifting doesn't let you change your powers. You need Modular Abilities for that. A character who tries to fill multiple roles using True Shapeshifting won't do any of them even nearly as well as a specialist.

Inhe first post Taran says the player already has modular abilities

[UmbraLux]

True Shapeshifting doesn't let you change your powers. You need Modular Abilities for that. A character who tries to fill multiple roles using True Shapeshifting won't do any of them even nearly as well as a specialist.

It does let you change skills...which can be almost as helpful.

That said, I tend to think 3 for normal animals only is about right...as long as the character also follows the limitations of normal animal.  Probably nothing better than Inhuman speed / recovery / toughness (perhaps one or two exceptions for elephants and such), need to switch a mod power to small / hulking for animals other than human sized, communication is limited to awkward pantomimes...and is slow, catch is always going to be obvious and easy to find (or no catch and you pay full price - not sure which fits animals best), etc.  It's still powerful but a supernatural therianthrope should be more powerful than an individual shape given a similar number of refresh spent.  Trading power for flexibility.