Author Topic: Compelling Consequences  (Read 8774 times)

Offline zerogain

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Compelling Consequences
« on: May 18, 2011, 08:43:03 PM »
If you take a consequence and your opponent uses the free tag to compel it, do you still get a fate point?

Offline WillH

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #1 on: May 18, 2011, 08:47:38 PM »
Short answer, yes.

Long answer, what really happens here is you use the tag to invoke the aspect for effect. This effect generates a situation worthy of a compel. The GM takes over and handles the compel like any other, including awarding fate points.

Offline ways and means

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #2 on: May 18, 2011, 09:29:39 PM »
If you take a consequence and your opponent uses the free tag to compel it, do you still get a fate point?

No you don't not for the -2 effect, if they enemy compels for effect (compel for effect are stuff like losing you go or your defense roll) then you may get a fate point if you accept the compel or lose on if you don't. 
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Offline WillH

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2011, 09:37:34 PM »
No you don't not for the -2 effect, if they enemy compels for effect (compel for effect are stuff like losing you go or your defense roll) then you may get a fate point if you accept the compel or lose on if you don't. 

You're confusing compel with invoke.

Offline ways and means

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2011, 09:41:30 PM »
You're confusing compel with invoke.

My bad
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Offline kertain

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2011, 09:53:08 PM »
I thought the book said since their was no FP given there is none earned.
You don't spend a FP to tag an aspect that you caused someone to have huh?

Or am I confusing things...*digs through the book*

Offline ways and means

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2011, 10:01:21 PM »
Were in invoking for effect teritory, an enemy invoking a concequence does not give a fate point but one invoking for effect does because this is dealt with by the gm as compel on the aspect.
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Offline WillH

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #7 on: May 18, 2011, 10:05:38 PM »
Invoking for effect doesn't always result in a compel. I know it's splitting hares but it's the compel that generates the fate, not the invoke. So, if the invoke doesn't result in a compel, then no fate is handed out.

Offline wyvern

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #8 on: May 18, 2011, 10:14:11 PM »
This is, indeed, confusing.  WillH is, at least so far, correct on all counts - but the ruling he's working off of is one that was posted to the forums by the game designers, rather than something that can be directly supported by the text in the book.  Alas, my search-fu is weak, and I cannot provide a link.

Offline devonapple

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2011, 10:14:45 PM »
I thought the book said since their was no FP given there is none earned.
You don't spend a FP to tag an aspect that you caused someone to have huh?

Or am I confusing things...*digs through the book*

This is hard to deduce in the book, as it is not explicitly said in any one place, but this rule clarification was established (with great pain) in a thread, with Fred Hicks eventually weighing in and explaining why it works this way.

In short: the person who lands/discovers/establishes an Aspect *always* gets to get a free "tag" to Invoke that Aspect.
That Invoke can be for a re-roll, a +2, or an Invoke for Effect.

Here's where it gets tricky:
If that Invoke for Effect benefits the player, it happens as the GM adjudicates.
If that Invoke for Effect constrains/complicates/restricts an opponent, then it becomes a Compel, at which point the GM takes over Compelling it; the original player didn't have to pay a Fate Point for it.

Then, the GM negotiates the Compel with the target (usually an NPC) per usual. The target may buy off the Compel with a Fate Point, if available, and if so, the player does *not* receive it.

This is, indeed, confusing.  WillH is, at least so far, correct on all counts - but the ruling he's working off of is one that was posted to the forums by the game designers, rather than something that can be directly supported by the text in the book.  Alas, my search-fu is weak, and I cannot provide a link.

I was the originator of the thread, but I can't find the link, either.
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Offline devonapple

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2011, 10:22:08 PM »
I was the originator of the thread, but I can't find the link, either.

Found it: http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,24061.0.html

I would caution *AGAINST* resurrecting the thread - things got a little snippy there, and people said dumb things.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2011, 10:24:17 PM by devonapple »
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Offline zerogain

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2011, 10:24:28 PM »
So, when my wizard applies a "Nasty Scorch" moderate consequence to his foe, and for simplicity sake rags it for a +2 on his Dodge when the foe counterattacks, the foe does not gain a fate point?

I need to read up on Invoke for Effect...

Offline devonapple

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2011, 10:30:30 PM »
So, when my wizard applies a "Nasty Scorch" moderate consequence to his foe, and for simplicity sake rags it for a +2 on his Dodge when the foe counterattacks, the foe does not gain a fate point?

I need to read up on Invoke for Effect...

No, the opponent does not.

He *could* get a Fate Point (from the GM) if you Invoke for Effect that the foe:
- Rolls a defense skill at +0 for an exchange, because of the pain
- Surrenders, because of the pain
- Doesn't attack for an exchange, because of the pain
- Otherwise does or fails to do anything because of the pain
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Offline zerogain

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #13 on: May 18, 2011, 10:40:24 PM »
That makes consequenses more severe than I had thought. So the +2/-2 is irresistible?

Offline devonapple

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Re: Compelling Consequences
« Reply #14 on: May 18, 2011, 11:21:13 PM »
That makes consequenses more severe than I had thought. So the +2/-2 is irresistible?

Yep. But that's a fiddling thing compared to an Invoke for Effect or Compel.
"Like a voice, like a crack, like a whispering shriek
That echoes on like it’s carpet-bombing feverish white jungles of thought
That I’m positive are not even mine"

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