Author Topic: The Black Staff (the Item not the Person)  (Read 6973 times)

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: The Black Staff (the Item not the Person)
« Reply #30 on: May 11, 2011, 10:13:32 PM »
I was under the impression that all wizards learned to see the future as they aged. And that it wasn't against the Laws.

Anyway, Law Seven prohibits seeking knowledge or power from beyond the gates. Knowledge about how to fight Outsiders may or may not qualify. And it might be okay to know things as long as you don't seek out that knowledge.

So this seems less than certain, to me.

Offline evileeyore

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Re: The Black Staff (the Item not the Person)
« Reply #31 on: May 12, 2011, 01:52:42 PM »
I was under the impression that all wizards learned to see the future as they aged. And that it wasn't against the Laws.

Anyway, Law Seven prohibits seeking knowledge or power from beyond the gates. Knowledge about how to fight Outsiders may or may not qualify. And it might be okay to know things as long as you don't seek out that knowledge.

So this seems less than certain, to me.

I think the optimal words are "from beyond the Gates".  So learning of the Gates, how to tell how open they are, and recognize things that slip through would be knowledge from this side of the Gates.


Learning the names and plans of those still on the other side, etc... that's from "beyond the gates".

Offline Tedronai

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Re: The Black Staff (the Item not the Person)
« Reply #32 on: May 13, 2011, 09:59:04 PM »
He knows quite a lot abot the Outer Gates and outsiders, even specific spells to use against them and what wards to check in order to get warning of their arrival. Since even knowledge of the Outer Gates and outsiders is against the Law, that's 7th law violations right there.

In addition, Rashid can tell the future. Not only does he get premonitions about it but he has shown the ability to predict the whole mess during Proven Guilty down to the totally unexpected arrival of several Senior Council members and Michael with enough precision to withold his vote and control the trial's outcome through said future information. He has also shown the ability to see the future of a person with precision enough to know whether Dresden could succeed or not during the whole Turn Coat debacle, including calculating the outcome of changing circumstances after warning Dresden of his impeding failure. That's both outright knowledge of the future and using knowledge of the future. 6th law violation right there.



So, Lawbreakers 6th and 7th. This does not mean the guy is a slave to his nature or totally twisted by the magic he uses; he might be tempted but just like any other wizard with positive refresh, he has free will. Just like Dresden, despite being a pretty serious 1st Lawbreaker.


Simply POSSESSING knowledge of the Outer Gates is not, and could not, be against a (reasonably) commonly known Law, as merely knowing of the Law, then, would violate that same Law.
Even possessing knowledge from BEYOND the Outer Gates is not in itself a violation of the (metaphysical incarnation of the) Law (though it'll likely be enough to get you sentenced by the Council).  The Law prohibits SEEKING knowledge (and Power) from beyond the Outer Gates.

Interpretations of what constitutes a violation of the 6th Law are even less clear, and definitive statements such as those made above should be qualified as being applicable to a particular 'table' or group.
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Offline SunlessNick

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Re: The Black Staff (the Item not the Person)
« Reply #33 on: May 15, 2011, 01:03:03 AM »
Pulling something out of my previous post, because it's not really related to statting the staff, or to wizards.  This struck me:
Quote
Namely the fact that WC didn't create it and that who/what/where they got (or stole) it from REALLY wants it back.  -  tymire
... Because does this mean that what it does isn't necessarily specific to magic or wizards?  Might it protect you from crossing other spiritual "lines?"  Such as a changeling being able to choose without choosing, or a White Court virgin or Red Court Infected making a feeding kill without turning, or inviting a supernatural creature across your threshold and having it not count.  Possible?