Finite Catches

[ways and means]

I was wondering about catches that can be destroyed for example if a player had a +0 catch of direct family and all of his direct family were ruthlessly murdered would he have to change his catch to something else? 

[sinker]

If it's a +0 catch then it's obviously not intended to be play a part of the story anyway. Of course that makes it all the more dramatic when someone finds a way to trip that catch. Perhaps a lost family member? Or for that matter maybe we take the catch literally and someone makes a dagger out of a femur. Or can anyone say zombie family?

All it takes is a creative GM and as I said earlier since it's +0 you only have to come up with a way to trip it on a very rare occasion.

[Tedronai]

A sufficiently mystically significant adoption ceremony could probably solve that little problem, in addition to the options presented by sinker.

[Sanctaphrax]

I have no problem with the idea. I never really saw why the book demands a catch for all toughness powers, anyway.

I also don't like the idea of a catch changing without a special justification in-game.

So yeah, I'd let that player be more-or-less catchless. But Tedronai and sinker have good ideas if you don't want to do that.

[Tedronai]

I'd steer clear of a Catch-less Physical Immunity, but for Recovery, Toughness, or a combination of the two, at any level, I'd allow a character to be Catch-less for a one-time cost of 1/4 of all refresh spent on affected powers, rounded up (affecting one (or both) Inhuman power(s) costs 1 additional refresh, affecting both mythic powers costs 3 additional refresh).

[SithLordJoe]

I'd steer clear of a Catch-less Physical Immunity, but for Recovery, Toughness, or a combination of the two, at any level, I'd allow a character to be Catch-less for a one-time cost of 1/4 of all refresh spent on affected powers, rounded up (affecting one (or both) Inhuman power(s) costs 1 additional refresh, affecting both mythic powers costs 3 additional refresh).

Wait what?

I'd say you are paying the refresh for +0 catch powers by not getting the rebate....

[Tedronai]

A +0 Catch, currently, though, is a Catch.  The extra refresh cost I recommended is for not having a Catch.

[ways and means]

Or if you want a +0 catch which is like no catch at all say your catch is Omnipotent Beings because if the white god shows up your could not win any way.

[Tedronai]

Or if you want a +0 catch which is like no catch at all say your catch is Omnipotent Beings because if the white god shows up your could not win any way.

I certainly wouldn't allow any such shenanigans in any game I ran...

[toturi]

I certainly wouldn't allow any such shenanigans in any game I ran...

Different people, different games.

[Tedronai]

Well, I suppose I should amend that.

I wouldn't allow such shenanigans without taking them to indicate that said player would like to, potentially, likely not more than once during the story, come face-to-face with an Omnipotent being as their opposition in a conflict situation.

I'd also make such interpretation abundantly clear to the player, and give them ample opportunity to modify their character appropriately should that not be their intent.

[toturi]

Well, I suppose I should amend that.

I wouldn't allow such shenanigans without taking them to indicate that said player would like to, potentially, likely not more than once during the story, come face-to-face with an Omnipotent being as their opposition in a conflict situation.

I'd also make such interpretation abundantly clear to the player, and give them ample opportunity to modify their character appropriately should that not be their intent.

When I see such things on my players sheets, I understand their intent. They do not want to be challenged. They want the GM to give them an obstacle that they can steamroll over. When Lion-o pulls out the Sword of Omens, we know that Mumra should start running away. When the PCs arrive on scene, it is ass kicking time. Skeletor and his flunkies run away, they don't get to "win", they don't get to "challenge" He-man and the Masters of the Universe.

[Sanctaphrax]

Or maybe they just don't want the hassle of a catch. I don't see any reason why every character must be deprived of his toughness powers at least once.

I mean, no one advocates doing that with any other kind of power.

So I'd let people take just about anything as a +0 catch. And I wouldn't use it in game.

"The third toenail of the left foot of a certain man who died 7000 years ago in the middle of the Pacific Ocean negates your toughness when attached to a mallet wielded by a seven-year-old male Buddhist True Believer who has never cut his hair? Alright, that's +0. Don't expect it to come up anytime soon."

[Tedronai]

Or maybe they just don't want the hassle of a catch. I don't see any reason why every character must be deprived of his toughness powers at least once.

And, like I said, I'd be fine with that.  I just don't believe that the listed costs are necessarily appropriate in such a case, and would experiment with adjustments to those costs to fix that.  I'm not dead-set on the specific adjustment that I listed earlier in this thread, but I think it'd be what I'd start from

[zenten]

Wow, I guess I'm a bit of a hardass.  If a catch becomes impossible I would have the recovery/toughness power go away (you'd get the refresh back of course) until which time as the catch becomes valid again.