How many Consequences in all do you have?

[jybil178]

This is probably a very silly question, but I think I may have misunderstood something for quite a while now...

Basically, upon my first read over of the rules, I was under the assumption that you had three consequences for each of your stress tracks... So one mild, one moderate and one severe for physical, social and mental...

Please tell me that I'm not the only one who thought this at very least... Just looking at it makes me wanna shudder, as I see things being a lot more dangerous now... Its just I thought things were one way, and now that I take away a big amount of buffer that I THOUGHT was there, I just see a much more vulnerable beast... And I mean, COME ON.... Harry ALWAYS had plenty of mental and physical consequences throughout nearly all of his casefiles...  >.< 

[Drachasor]

You get an extra mild consequence when your skill that gives you stress boxes is at 5, 7, 9, etc.

[devonapple]

You probably weren't alone, but you are now correct in that you only have one mild, one moderate and one severe, period (unless you get extra ones for higher skills).

I myself was sure for awhile that a 2-stress spell took up one's first AND second stress box. Also that all veils had to all be done via Thaumaturgy, and that they were only half of their shifts in effectiveness. Any number of little misunderstandings get ironed out on contact with other players.

[jybil178]

Hehehe... lovely... sounds like a lot of fun >.< the mistakes you make when you first begin learning something are the hardest to cope with.. You have your entire mind set around what you can and can't do because of your limits, and when you realize your limits are only 1/3rd of what you thought they were for the longest time, it kinda makes your whole concept of things blow up... Now I just need to reform my ideas, and heal...

wow... that must have been at least a moderate mental consequence on myself >.< oiii.... maybe worse ;P

[sinker]

You do also have a fourth consequence slot (extreme). Whether or not you want to use it is another matter....

[BumblingBear]

Not to hijack the thread here ::hijacking the thread::

how would one take consequences with 1 stress damage?  For instance, your wizard is casting evocations and each one takes 1 mental stress since she is not going above her conviction.

How can one take a consequence for 1 stress?  Note down one of them and then on the second stress take the consequence? 

If there's no way to take 1 stress consequences or save them up or something, a wizard would have to cast 1 shift and 3 shifts above her conviction respectively in order to take a minor and moderate consequence.

[devonapple]

How can one take a consequence for 1 stress?  Note down one of them and then on the second stress take the consequence? 

You don't. There's no saving them up like that. You waste a potential stress sink if you cast a 1-stress spell and can't pay for it without a consequence.

If you cast a 1-stress spell, but the only way you can pay for it is with a 4-shift Consequence, you use the 4-shift Consequence. In that situation, a Wizard would have good motivation to game the system and add 3 shifts to make it a full 4-stress spell, thereby using all of the consequence slot.

[BumblingBear]

You don't. There's no saving them up like that. You waste a potential stress sink if you cast a 1-stress spell and can't pay for it without a consequence.

If you cast a 1-stress spell, but the only way you can pay for it is with a 4-shift Consequence, you use the 4-shift Consequence. In that situation, a Wizard would have good motivation to game the system and add 3 shifts to make it a full 4-stress spell, thereby using all of the consequence slot.

Hmmmmm.  And my group wonders why I apply tons of aspects and maneuvers before making an evocation attack... lol.

[jybil178]

You don't. There's no saving them up like that. You waste a potential stress sink if you cast a 1-stress spell and can't pay for it without a consequence.

If you cast a 1-stress spell, but the only way you can pay for it is with a 4-shift Consequence, you use the 4-shift Consequence. In that situation, a Wizard would have good motivation to game the system and add 3 shifts to make it a full 4-stress spell, thereby using all of the consequence slot.

I'm not sure your understanding the entirety of the mechanics of the costs of spell casting... Spellcasting isn't like all the other forms of taking stress. For every shift of power you go above your conviction, you have to pay an entire DOT of stress, along with the first. So if you cast a spell that is 4 shifts stronger than what you normally could cast, it will take you out completely, unless you use a consequence to help buffer it, which functions pretty much as normal for spellcasting.

If I'm wrong on this, please be sure to let me know.  I know its weird that spellcasting is the only mechanic that can inflict more then one stress at a time, but I do know it specifically stats this is how its done in certain spots, while being actually very vague and foggy on the point, making it seem like spells work along the normal stress mechanic in others.

[devonapple]

If I'm wrong on this, please be sure to let me know.  I know its weird that spellcasting is the only mechanic that can inflict more then one stress at a time, but I do know it specifically stats this is how its done in certain spots, while being actually very vague and foggy on the point, making it seem like spells work along the normal stress mechanic in others.

I would love a page number or two citing this. Like I said, I used to think that's how it worked, too, and I got that impression from somewhere, but it ended up seeming strange to me that magical stress worked differently from other stress.

As it is, I do consider it TWO separate stress hits when someone 1) casts a spell, 2) misses the Discipline check, then 3) opts to take those uncontrolled shifts as backlash to keep the spell under control.

If I had spells take up all the stress shifts indicated, our game would get quite unpleasant - our spellcasters already take consequences every few conflicts, and this would chew them up even more thoroughly than I already do.

[Drachasor]

As it is, I do consider it TWO separate stress hits when someone 1) casts a spell, 2) misses the Discipline check, then 3) opts to take those uncontrolled shifts as backlash to keep the spell under control.

I don't think it is two separate ones, since how they decide to handle the uncontrolled shifts affects the outcome of the action.  Seems to me it is the same thing, though I guess the rules aren't 100% clear.

[devonapple]

I don't think it is two separate ones, since how they decide to handle the uncontrolled shifts affects the outcome of the action.  Seems to me it is the same thing, though I guess the rules aren't 100% clear.

I'm happy to be overruled with a rule (or sufficient community feedback), but my current line of thought is that they are two separate energy investments:
1) one to create the "spell construct" and then, after it is released,
2) "holy cats, it's gone pear-shaped!"
3) then another separate effort of will to exert control to keep the spell intact

How have other GMs ruled the stress cost of Spell Backlash?
A) Did you tack it into the original stress to cast the spell?
B) Or make it a new Mental Stress hit?

[jybil178]

I will give you that the general text of the book is VERY unspecific with this.  I was never sure for the longest time, and maybe this isn't even a really for sure... Maybe the idea of what they wanted got scrambled somewhere..  But anywhere, off to citing...

pg 411,
Decide how many shifts of power you want
to put into the spell. Take 1 mental stress,
plus 1 for each point of power greater than
your Conviction modified by any power
bonuses from a focus item.


pg 250,
Decide how many shifts of power you want
to put into the spell. You take mental stress
for calling up power—the minimum is one
point of mental stress. The cost increases
if you reach for power greater than your
Conviction, inflicting additional mental
stress equal to the difference (so a spell with
power three higher than your Conviction
would inflict 4 points of mental stress).


pg, 256
Every shift of power you summon past your
Conviction costs one additional point of mental
stress during casting; so a spell with a power
rating three higher than your Conviction would
inflict four points of mental stress when cast
(one for summoning up to Conviction, plus one
for each additional step on the ladder). Just like
any other type of stress, this could force your
wizard to take consequences in order to keep
himself upright.


Basically, in all these examples, and I could look for maybe a few more, they refer to the mental stress in Points, rather than a 1, 2, 3, or 4 ect,  stress hit, which is how they refer to taking stress through out the rest of the book.  It also never goes into bigger number examples using a higher mental stress hit.  All examples of going higher, are referred to using a consequence to help take off some of the stress.  Sorry >.<


And here is a citation of backlash, with a different wording, using stress hits like everywhere else in the book, rather than points of mental stress...


pg, 256
There are basically two kinds of trouble:
backlash and fallout. Backlash affects the
wizard; fallout affects the environment or other
nearby targets. Like everything else, backlash
and fallout are measured in shifts—in this case,
the difference between your failed Discipline roll
and the gathered power. The worse the failure,
the more the spell’s energy goes haywire, and the
worse the effects get.
You get to choose how much backlash you
absorb, with the rest going to the GM as fallout.
Particularly self-sacrificing wizards may choose
to take some or all the excess as backlash—especially
if there are allies nearby who might bear
the brunt of the fallout of the failed spell.
Any uncontrolled power taken as backlash
remains a part of the spell and does not reduce
its effect. Fallout is different: every shift of
fallout reduces the effect of the spell.
Backlash means that the spell energies run
through the wizard, causing injury or other
problems. This manifests as shifts of stress,
which could require the taking of consequences
in the usual way. Fortunately, you can choose to
take the backlash as either physical or mental
stress (but not split between both), which means
your wizard can keep his mental stress track
open for more spellcasting if he needs to.

Example: Harry must cast a spell with a
Superb (+5) control target without using
incantations or focus items. Without these
benefits, he fails the Discipline roll by 5. He
doesn’t want to hurt anyone around him or
cause any unintended environmental effects,
and he needs the spell to succeed in full, so he
chooses to take a 5-stress physical backlash. He’s
already taken some physical stress during this
scene, so he ends up having to take a moderate
consequence of Utterly Exhausted in
addition to a 1-stress physical hit. Ouch. But at
least the spell is still cast at full power.

Its a bigger example, but I didn't want to leave anything possibly important out, hehe >.<  I know this won't "help" persay, but it should hopefully clear a few things up..

[Richard_Chilton]

Just to bring this back to Consequences for a second, certain Stunts give you additional, one track only, Consequences.

The two I was able to find quickly are:
Resilient Self-Image: You may take two additional mild mental consequences
No Pain, No Gain: You may take two additional mild physical consequences

So a wizard with a Resilient Self-Image could take three mild consequences to power his magic.  Four if he had a Superb Conviction.

Richard

[bitterpill]

The made it so they give only one outside the raw, does armour count against backlash if you have toughness powers