Author Topic: Sponsored Magic Confusion  (Read 7007 times)

Offline sinker

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #15 on: January 20, 2011, 05:28:52 AM »
It's possible that Harry's/Jim's GM is letting him off easy. It's also possible that Harry just didn't incur as much debt as you think he did. Merely having/using a sponsored power does not incur debt on it's own.

Offline BumblingBear

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #16 on: January 20, 2011, 05:36:53 AM »
It's possible that Harry's/Jim's GM is letting him off easy. It's also possible that Harry just didn't incur as much debt as you think he did. Merely having/using a sponsored power does not incur debt on it's own.

Ever since Harry's gotten sponsored, in every climactic battle the narration has specifically mentioned that his attacks were laced with hellfire/soulfire.

That is at /least/ 1 debt per attack.
Myself: If I were in her(Murphy's) position, I would have studied my ass off on the supernatural and rigged up special weapons to deal with them.  Murphy on the other hand just plans to overpower bad guys with the angst of her short woman's syndrome and blame all resulting failures on Harry.

Offline Peteman

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #17 on: January 20, 2011, 05:51:22 AM »
Soulfire costs more because of it's hax against catches.

I thought it was more because it was because it could handle any form of Thaumaturgy, making it Channeling and Thaumaturgy (the Toughness Hax is also there too).

Offline BumblingBear

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2011, 05:57:57 AM »
I thought it was more because it was because it could handle any form of Thaumaturgy, making it Channeling and Thaumaturgy (the Toughness Hax is also there too).

Probably both.

The toughness hax are nasty, though.  Being able to meet any catch, any time, anywhere is nasty powerful.
Myself: If I were in her(Murphy's) position, I would have studied my ass off on the supernatural and rigged up special weapons to deal with them.  Murphy on the other hand just plans to overpower bad guys with the angst of her short woman's syndrome and blame all resulting failures on Harry.

Offline sinker

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #19 on: January 20, 2011, 06:13:52 AM »
Yeah, soulfire is a beast for many reasons.

Ever since Harry's gotten sponsored, in every climactic battle the narration has specifically mentioned that his attacks were laced with hellfire/soulfire.

That is at /least/ 1 debt per attack.

Seems to me that he doesn't use soulfire more than four-ten times per book (which is stretching the debt system a bit but maybe the GM's a nice guy and feels like it's dramatically appropriate). As for hellfire other than the times that he was really putting some hell muscle into it (which is likely the same as I said for soulfire) it's possible that Harry's player (Jim) was simply adding it as flavor to represent Harry's decent into badness.

Offline BumblingBear

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #20 on: January 20, 2011, 09:58:02 AM »
Yeah, soulfire is a beast for many reasons.

Seems to me that he doesn't use soulfire more than four-ten times per book (which is stretching the debt system a bit but maybe the GM's a nice guy and feels like it's dramatically appropriate). As for hellfire other than the times that he was really putting some hell muscle into it (which is likely the same as I said for soulfire) it's possible that Harry's player (Jim) was simply adding it as flavor to represent Harry's decent into badness.

Perhaps.

Specifically, I was thinking back to when every time Harry did much of anything, his staff blazed with hellfire.
Myself: If I were in her(Murphy's) position, I would have studied my ass off on the supernatural and rigged up special weapons to deal with them.  Murphy on the other hand just plans to overpower bad guys with the angst of her short woman's syndrome and blame all resulting failures on Harry.

Offline bibliophile20

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #21 on: January 20, 2011, 12:41:50 PM »
Only for a couple of books (Dead Beat, Proven Guilty, White Night) was Harry actively using Hellfire... and in all three, it's fair to say that he was getting enough compels to pay off his Hellfire use (like the scene in the hotel lobby, against the expy of the Alien; he used alot of hellfire, but also got a free compel off of it to ignore the wounded civilians around him in the heat of the moment)
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Offline Ren

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #22 on: January 20, 2011, 02:39:22 PM »
Ah but you miss the fact that Harry has an extra-special Power "Author is God" i.e. Jim is not limited by the rules of the game in the writing of his Book...and besides, since when has Harry ever conformed to any rules?

Looks like I do have some more reading to do...oh well.
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Offline sinker

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #23 on: January 20, 2011, 08:10:49 PM »
Yeah I'd call a lot of that flavor. Sorry for the spoilers Ren, how far are you?

Offline Drachasor

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #24 on: January 20, 2011, 08:50:13 PM »
The Faerie seem to be much more blatant about compels and their influence in the books.  Even the influence of Hellfire was more subtle (grumpiness/irritability/unfriendliness).  Soulfire is more subtle still.  In the books it is almost done like some sort of feeding dependency (where rest and relaxation are what you need to get to recover).  In the books if someone uses Soulfire, he/she is literally tossing bits of his/her soul at enemies.  If they do it a lot, then they seem to get really drained emotionally and physically.  In a lot of ways, it isn't written like sponsored magic of other types at all.

If I were running with Soulfire, I'd say what it can compel if you wrack up debt are rest, time with friends and family, and helping people out....if we were to go like the books, one would want to be very subtle about its influence.  It isn't written as the type of thing that blatantly forces you to do something.  The rest and time with friends helps your soul recover so that isn't forcing anything.  As for helping people out, it seems to help make [someone in the books] a better person (like Hellfire seems to make people more grumpy/irritable/etc).

I think there's a real trick to making this properly subtle.  Soulfire's influence is almost completely internal if you go by the books ([someone in the books gets the power somehow] but how it changes their behavior doesn't make it look like anything external is pulling their strings).  Part of doing this right, perhaps, is having the player committed to making the influence of Soulfire actually part of the character's internal motivations; using it just makes you a better person (or emphasizes your already good qualities).

I suppose one could do this with any sort of sponsored magic, but it seems particularly true of Soulfire.  I'm making a Son of Thor character for an upcoming campaign (I posted on this here a good while ago, but we ended up doing a Star Wars campaign first).  I've toyed with the idea of him having some sort of "sponsored" magic that is wholly part of him (the debt and such would still be there, but it would all be colored as internal motivations and compels), though I think I'll just start him out as a focused practitioner for now (need some points for inhuman strength).  Like someone said, sponsored magic is very flavorful and adds a lot to the game.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2011, 09:05:12 PM by Drachasor »

Offline sinker

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #25 on: January 20, 2011, 08:55:20 PM »
You want to throw some spoiler tags on some of that? If Ren's unaware of hellfire/soulfire then some of that is going to be a pretty big surprise.

Offline Drachasor

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #26 on: January 20, 2011, 09:05:45 PM »
You want to throw some spoiler tags on some of that? If Ren's unaware of hellfire/soulfire then some of that is going to be a pretty big surprise.

Missed that.  Edited it to be very vague regarding book references.

Offline sinker

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #27 on: January 20, 2011, 09:16:58 PM »
Appreciated.

Offline Ren

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #28 on: January 20, 2011, 09:31:53 PM »
Oh not spoiling anything for me. I'm all caught up including Side Jobs...8)
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Offline sinker

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Re: Sponsored Magic Confusion
« Reply #29 on: January 20, 2011, 09:44:38 PM »
Ahh, I misunderstood. Still a good plan on general principles.