Animate Dead - With Evocation'sMethods and Speed

[Madmacabre]

Hello all...

Based on p.301, Zombie Animation requires a summoning portion (6 to 10 complexity levels) and then followed by an actual binding (10 to 14 complexity)

This is all fine and balanced.

But when you look at the KEMMLERIAN NECROMANCY sponsored magic, it is suggested that you could do necromancy effect "With Evocation'sMethods and Speed".

If I understand correctly, it means that the spellcaster would need to provide energy for 6-10/10-14 power (the summoning and then the binding), and he still would need to make a discipline roll for both effect to actually control them. Right?

How feasible is this? Looks like an effect that would actually use all of the character's resources at once. And even more...


I ask the question because one of my player came up with the concept of an Emissary of power who's abilities come from his asian ancestors. He would have the Sponsored Magic linked to the ability to summon ancestral asian spirits. One of the ability he was looking at was the ability to animate traditional asian statues using ancestral spirits...which would be very similar to animate a zombie. Ok, a little more powerful, but considering the rarity of suitable statues I can live with that.

So how does it work? Because if My understanding of the Zombie Animation With Evocation'sMethods and Speed is correct, there is NO WAY he could accomplish the task with starting stats.

[Drashna]

Feasible. Very much so.  Given 4-5 Conviction, +2 or more from refinement and 3-4 more from focus items... that's 9-11 shifts easily. And then you can take consequences for "over channeling" and backlash.  Easy to do if you have the right power level, and focus for it.

[mostlyawake]

Not really. Consider:

It's not hard to pull off conviction +5, a specialty of +2 (necromancy power), and perhaps two focus items for +4 control, +4 power, that when added to your 2 levels of lawbreaker (necro), nets you a +11/+11 before the kemmler bonus itself.  The rest you can do with a little stress and maybe a fate point or two.

Thaumaturgy (-3) with specialty necro power
kemmlerian necromancy (i forget the cost)
-1 refinement, +1 necro power, +1 necro control
free focus items and -1 refinemet = +4 control Focus item
-2 refinement, 4 focus items for the +4 power
-2 refinement, lawbreaker (5th)

at a refresh of -9+ kemmlerian necromancy (so 11-13ish)?

Yeah outside of the starting submerged character, but not impossible for a baddie.  A player could swing maybe a +9/+9 easy, at creation, with the proper stats.

So that's, two rounds to get a zombie out (for 2 different spells)? sweet.

[mostlyawake]

ninja'd, because i talk too much in my long posts.

[Nyarlathotep5150]

   Also. Raising Zombies isn't the only Necromancy effect. not by a long shot. I doubt that they intended for people to be raising up hordes of Zombies per combat (to my knowledge nobody does that in the books, they always take at least a few minutes to perform a ritual).
    So yes you can do it. Even with a starting character (though probably only at submerged level). Though it might cause some Backlash (as well it should).

    Other necromancy effects: Summoning/communing with ghosts (not technically dead, but close enough to count), body swapping (ala Corpsetaker), Healing (Kumori), Death Spells, Any spell used upon a corpse (seeing its last moments, causing it to speak).

[Wyrdrune]

my understanding of "with the speed and methods of evocation" from the sponsored magics was:

yes, some have extremely high demands on conviction and discipline rolls, but that was debt was for. in combination with the debt rules from sponsored magic those feats are possible, you are just working up more on your sponsor's bill.

just remember: the dark powers are always willing to help...

[Belial666]

The least refresh one can get Kemmlerian Necromancy and remain a PC is at 12 refresh; 7 for a wizard, 2 for necromancy, 2 for Lawbreaker 5th, 1 for retaining free will.


His Power could be 5 base, +2 focus, +1 necro, +2 Lawbreaker, +1 specialization = 11
His Control could be 5 base, +2 focus, +1 necro, +2 lawbreaker, +1 thaumaturgy specialization (added due to kemmlerian magic special)  = 11


He would need 2 exchanges to summon a strong zombie; one for an 11-shift summoning evocation and one for an 11-shift binding evocation.
He would also need 2 exchanges to summon a group of weak zombies; one for a 9-shift zone-wide summoning, one for a 9-shift, zone-wide binding. Both would affect all corpses in 1 zone.

[MyNinjaH8sU]

...And remember that both of those spells would be Rotes at this point, with no chance of failure. That sounds pretty solid to me.

[Nyarlathotep5150]

The least refresh one can get Kemmlerian Necromancy and remain a PC is at 12 refresh; 7 for a wizard, 2 for necromancy, 2 for Lawbreaker 5th, 1 for retaining free will.

   Actually, you don't need to have Lawbreaker to get Kemmlerian Necromancy. You certainly don't need to have broken it the 3 times required to bring the cost of it up to -2. You just need a specialty in Necromancy. And as long as you are VERY careful to keep all of those Necromancy spells from "Reaching beyond the wall of death" on a human target (remember that the Laws only apply to humans and that was the technicality that allowed Harry to raise Sue), then you could get Kemmlerian Necromancy as a starting Submerged level character (albiet, you wouldn't have anything else, and if you break the Law ONCE you lose your character).