False Face Forward - Why am I wasting a Fate Point on that Lying Cheat?

[devonapple]

Empathy [Reading People] allows you to make an Assessment to discover one of a target's unknown Aspects (YS 129).

Deceit [False Face Forward] allows you to provide a false Aspect to the reader attempting to use Reading People on you (YS 126).

On YS 114, the rules explain that if you get duped by a target who used Deceit to fool you into believing he had a particular Aspect, then you may have wasted your Fate Point, depending on whether the deceiver wishes to "place a temporary aspect on you... representing how he managed to snooker you."

My confusion:
If you Assess a target's Aspect normally, don't you get to free tag it (YS 115 "you don't have to worry about the usual time limit... for tagging until the first scene where you encounter the target of your assessment")?

So... why is a duped person being obligated to pony up a Fate Point if they ostensibly have a free tag coming to them?

Or is this only in cases when the duped person is spending a Fate Point to Compel the target/deceiver using that bogus Aspect?

[Amelia Crane]

I'm guessing it's only for cases when the duped person is spending a Fate Point to Compel the target/deceiver using that bogus Aspect.  Which can certainly happen despite the ability to tag an aspect.  Like if you assess his aspect in one scene (in the info gathering stage of the story), and then try to compel it in another (when you realize he's a baddie you need to beat down).  Or if you tag the aspect, then spend an aspect to compel it too (in a prolonged interrogation).

[Drashna]

If anything, I'd say that the description may be an artifact of a previous revision.

That or... you'd only get to tag it for free "right away", and if you wait till later, you *would* have to spend a fate point on it.

[sinker]

The rules seem pretty clear that we're talking about the fate point that you spent to invoke or compel the aspect. If you didn't spend a fate point (I.E. you tagged the aspect) then there is no "spent fate point" wasted, you just wasted your tag. Although I would think that it would totally be in the GM's best interest to return the "tag" to you and place a temporary aspect on you... Maybe that's a little weird.

[Nyarlathotep5150]

The rules seem pretty clear that we're talking about the fate point that you spent to invoke or compel the aspect. If you didn't spend a fate point (I.E. you tagged the aspect) then there is no "spent fate point" wasted, you just wasted your tag. Although I would think that it would totally be in the GM's best interest to return the "tag" to you and place a temporary aspect on you... Maybe that's a little weird.

   I'd agree with that. Or alternatively, you as GM could say that you can't garner tags on false aspects.
   When the deceiver uses "false face forward" is effectively setting a trap for the Empathy user. When the Empathy user walks into the trap (tags the aspect), tell him he has to pay anyway. If he doesn't have the points he accrues Fate Debt (similar to gaining temporary powers he can't afford right away).
    Again, not necessarily what the rules implied, but an interesting option.