Supernatural Stunts

[finnmckool]

All in all aren't you really just talking about calling one thing a stunt and one thing a power? Minor magic "stunts" cost the same as a minor power. I get there is a rather serious mechanics difficulty at stake and therefore I'm inclined toward the "no" camp, but my general rule pretty much boils down to "when in doubt: charge'em a fate point or some stress boxes."

"My, that IS an interesting use of that power. Sounds taxing. Two more mental stress."

Of course that may not apply to odd ancillary benefits of magic using like "The Sight" or "Hexing," they are exceptional, and such powers I would of course consider on a case by case.

[Dumbledresden]

I voted nay.

It's very clear to me, that those "stunts" that are effecting powers, should be add-ons or power options, but no "mortal stunt".

The  stunts  in  this  chapter  are  called mortal stunts because  they’re available  to everyone—supernatural  and mundane  characters  alike— and have both  feet irmly planted  in  the realm of what’s possible for a normal (mortal) human to do.

While a mere mortal could use every mortal stunt in YS, he couldn't use a stunt, that would effect the speed of his shapeshifting f.e. because it would affect a power he had to have, which would revoke his status as a mere mortal. Thus it couldn't be a "mortal" stunt anymore.

[ralexs1991]

I voted nay.

It's very clear to me, that those "stunts" that are effecting powers, should be add-ons or power options, but no "mortal stunt".

While a mere mortal could use every mortal stunt in YS, he couldn't use a stunt, that would effect the speed of his shapeshifting f.e. because it would affect a power he had to have, which would revoke his status as a mere mortal. Thus it couldn't be a "mortal" stunt anymore.

to answer your example of a person taking a speed up shapeshifting stunt IMHO this isn't a valid problem because no player with half a brain would waste a valuable refresh on a stunt that would give them no bonus what so ever so I really don't see how it could be a realistic problem but that's just what I think

[Drashna]

Again, I'm just make this point, you should be talking with your GM about character creation, and if either or both of you agree it should be a power or a powerup, then just note it as such. No reason to actually vote here......

[Dumbledresden]

to answer your example of a person taking a speed up shapeshifting stunt IMHO this isn't a valid problem because no player with half a brain would waste a valuable refresh on a stunt that would give them no bonus what so ever so I really don't see how it could be a realistic problem but that's just what I think

Did I say it would be a problem?

The Rules say, that mortal stunts should be something that should be possible for a normal mortal human to do.
Powers aren't normal, thereby stunts, affecting those powers aren't neither.

[Livemike]

Yes.  Stunts are things that mortals can learn to do, not that can only help with things mortals can learn to do.  For instance you can use "Step into the blow" to use your Claws if you fail to defend.  Why wouldn't you?  Just because you're using a razor-sharp body part as opposed to a blunt fist doesn't mean you don't know how to use it.  You can also use "Killer Blow" with Claws, and I recommend it. 

[Livemike]

I voted nay.

It's very clear to me, that those "stunts" that are effecting powers, should be add-ons or power options, but no "mortal stunt".

While a mere mortal could use every mortal stunt in YS, he couldn't use a stunt, that would effect the speed of his shapeshifting f.e. because it would affect a power he had to have, which would revoke his status as a mere mortal. Thus it couldn't be a "mortal" stunt anymore.

  You don't have to be a mortal to use a mortal stunt.  They're called "mortal stunts" because anyone, including mortals, can use them.  Why would you need a separate stunt affecting powers (e.g. Claws) when the character has already bought a stunt that affects his use of the skill they're based on (e.g. Killer Blow affects the use of Fists)?

[Becq]

You don't have to be a mortal to use a mortal stunt.  They're called "mortal stunts" because anyone, including mortals, can use them.  Why would you need a separate stunt affecting powers (e.g. Claws) when the character has already bought a stunt that affects his use of the skill they're based on (e.g. Killer Blow affects the use of Fists)?

You're confusing "neccessary" and "sufficient".  That is, being a mere mortal is sufficient excuse to buy a stunt, but it is not neccessary to be a Pure Mortal to buy them.

Claws is a power that affects attacks using Fists.  Any stunt that affects Fists can apply to Claws attacks, including Killer Blow.  Any 'stunt' that modifies the way Claws work would be a power, not a stunt.  This is why Venomous for Claws is not a stunt.  Or, if you prefer -1 refresh power enhances, this is why Additional Emotion, At Range, and Lasting Emotion are listed as powers dependent on Incite Emotion, rather than as stunts.

I guess I'm at a loss to understand why there is so much controversy here, given that the dividing line between stunts and powers is really one of the most clearly worded things in the rulebook.