Miami; the Makeshift Mermaid and other Yarns

[zegion]

Short Barreled shot guns? really. According to the texas penal code its illegal if its at or under 16 inches in total length, no mater what year it was made in. Ive been to the Gun Store (really thats its name). They didn't really have a lot of stuff the last time i visited, and i really wasn't in the mood to buy, just create a "wish" list. The proprietor wan't really all that friendly either. Even when i explained that i wanted to get my wife her concealed hand gun permit (which she has yet to do).


As for weapon and safites, no law that im aware of (might be a federal one, but im only repeating what ive been told), but for instace if you go to GT distributars if you buy a certain weapon, they are supposed  to ask if you are in the military or law enforcement before they sell it to you. Also certain stores such as academy and walmart can sell certain types of weapon either.

[Ren]

Hey Zegion, since your about for now, can you get me some scans of a .pdf of a blank case-file form? Or whatever would be used for settign up cases of various kinds. I'd like to build up a stack of character briefing information for future info briefs and pre-mission brief where apropos. Basically I'm looking to get as much immersion stuff as we can (I Highly recommend some bit of costuming...though leave the real guns at home...with the exception if course for those who own guns where we'll be gaming at!). IN fact Tess is going to be working up some Business cards, letterhead and a Logo for Solutions Unlimited!

[BumblingBear]

My Fav line of the moment: Crazy Pirate guy...probably has a cutlass and a brace of black-powder pistols


BTW an SMG is illegal, any fully automatic weapon is. The only appropriate way to own one is to have a class 3 licences, which is mostly for companies and people working for Tactical Teams, and even then they only have the ability to carry them though the agency they work for. Also keep in mind, the general public (take away gun shows for a minute) are not allowed to own or have access to weapons, those in the police or military can buy. For instance my M&P 40, has no safety. I could only buy it because 1) at the time i worked for APD and 2) I was in the National Guard (only have to meet one of the criteria)

That is not actually necessarily true.

You can buy a Class 3 weapon (IE machine gun or SBR) but you need to get the 200 dollar tax stamp for it and it has to be in a state that allows them.

As far as I know, Florida and Texas both allow them.

Florida is also an open carry and concealed carry state for pistols.

The only caveat to the tax stamp is that for a regular civilian to own one, it has to be manufactured before the date of the class 3 cutoff... I believe it was in 1986.

As such, Class 3 weapons are limited and keep appreciating in value.  They are very, very expensive.

Even a crappy Mac-11 goes for about 3k-5k.

Just a few examples:

Civilians can own SBRs (short barreled rifles) that are semi auto with a tax stamp.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=212222603

However, full auto weapons that are transferrable (buyable) tend to be very epensive.

Exampes:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=212435289
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=211775508
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=212195432

I've considered buying a class 3 weapon before, but doing so requires notifying the ATF every time you take them out of state, and there are many other rules too about how they have to be locked up and such.

In my opinion, most of the time it's not worth the hassle.

On the flip side, AOWs (any other weapon) are cheaper to get ahold of and more states allow them.

An example is the Serbu super shorty.



I actually know people who own these.  They're about the same price as other combat shotguns and only require an AOW transfer fee, which I think is $5.

[BumblingBear]

Short Barreled shot guns? really. According to the texas penal code its illegal if its at or under 16 inches in total length, no mater what year it was made in.

Yup.

The minimum legal length (federal law here) for barrels on shotguns is 18".  It's 16" for rifles.  However, in states that allow them you can go lower than that.

There is an overall length law as well, but that doesn't usually end up being a concern except for on bullpups.

Texas does not ban short barreled shotguns, but you must have them registered with the BATFE and the tax form also requires the local sheriff's signature on the form.


The Tromix is a great example of a SBS.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=212648789


It is considered an AOW and requires a $5 transfer fee.

Edit:  As far as I know, one of the only things gun related not allowed in Texas is open carry... which is odd.

However, rifles and shotguns are allowed to be carried loaded in vehicles.

In general, Texas is much more pro-rifle than pro-pistol.  You could probably legally carry a Tromix in your backpack but God help you if you carry a loaded pistol like that with a concealed handgun license.

[zegion]

Ren,

 There really is no standard "case file". All the reports i ever filled out were on my computer in my car. I was never a detective so i don't even know where to start.  I can come up with something if you want, but its going to be on a word document.

Bear, just letting you know what the penal code says and as far as i know, there are NO exceptions. If a police officer were to stop that individual  during a traffic stop see the shotgun and measure it (he has probable cause, because hes already pulled you over for a traffic code violation) he will arrest you for it being an Illegal shotgun. No where in the Texas Penal code does it give exemptions for short barreled weapons. That individual may win in court via a lawyer arguing a finer point in law, but as they say, you can beat the wrap but you cant beat the ride.

edit: yes on rifles and shotguns. you by law are allowed to carry ANY weapon in your vehicle, as long as its out of site. A shot gun or Rifle can be displayed openly. I have no clue on the difference and why legislators made the law the way they did.

[fantazero]

Short Barreled shot guns? really. According to the texas penal code its illegal if its at or under 16 inches in total length, no mater what year it was made in. Ive been to the Gun Store (really thats its name). They didn't really have a lot of stuff the last time i visited, and i really wasn't in the mood to buy, just create a "wish" list. The proprietor wan't really all that friendly either. Even when i explained that i wanted to get my wife her concealed hand gun permit (which she has yet to do).


As for weapon and safites, no law that im aware of (might be a federal one, but im only repeating what ive been told), but for instace if you go to GT distributars if you buy a certain weapon, they are supposed   to ask if you are in the military or law enforcement before they sell it to you. Also certain stores such as academy and walmart can sell certain types of weapon either.

GT does that because they can sell those guns for dirt cheap to LEOs and Military per their contract with those gun makers (Boss's Ex-Bf is a manager there(total scum bag btw)
 Thats kinda Glocks game, they would buy the old revolvers, Berretas from Deparments and sell them Glocks for Pennies on the dollar, 20 years later they are one of the biggest LEO and Private pistol makers in the world.
It was about spreading a "Brand Name" if people saw Officers, and Movie Stars using them, then Civilians would want one too. It worked.

as for how you go about it short barreled rifles/shotguns ect
http://www.texasgunstore.com/education.html#FAQ5
Reason you can do it
Texas Penal Code 46.05c
It is a defense to prosecution under this section that
the actor's possession was pursuant to registration pursuant to the
National Firearms Act, as amended.
The 1986 thing is only for Machine guns.


Sorry about "The Gun Store" the Hispanic guy is cool, the Asian guy is stand offish. I like them only because they taught me the 123s of guns. My wife's grandfather lost his marbles, so they took his pistol and car and gave them to me (Sweet) I went there looking for info and he told me the price, date of manufacture, and how to clean and care for it.
The prices are a bit steep, but Academys down the road, and I was able to trade a p22 for a mossberg 500 and felt like I was ahead on the deal.

[fantazero]

You can open Carry in Texas and Florida on private property or in your business (but that parts tricky)
So basically I can mow my lawn with a 6 shooter, but expect a visit from the local constabulary.

You cannot open carry in Texas or Florida on a day to day stuff (Wal Mart). You can open carry while hunting. You can keep a rifle on your back and walk around and thats legal, but expect to be brought up on charges of "creating a panic" or some such, like Z said, you might win it in court, but you'll get to visit the back of the car. "

My G26 is like my Visa, never leave home without it. I learned a bunch of state gun laws during my Trip to Miami last year.
 In Mississippi you cant bring it to a parade (which is like wtf?)
 Louisiana you can take it to the applebees but you cant take it to the bar in the applebees
 I think in one of those states you cant bring it into a church without permission.
Florida has silly concealed carry laws while in a vehicle.
Example, in Texas, I can wear it in my waistband, get in the car, get pulled over, give the officer CHL and Drivers ID, get a ticket go on my way, and he might not even ask me about the gun.

Florida, the gun has to be in case or a holster with a strap of some kind of it, in the glove box or in the trunk.
So not on your person/under the seat.
Somehow this 3-4 steps nonsense got started in the PD there/ Concealed Carry Classes that there must be 3-4 steps between you and the gun. Which is nonsense. So people would argue that you would have to lock the glove box with the gun in the case/strapped holster. AND THEY WILL CHECK and whats even scarier is some of the Local PD there think thats the law. I spoke with several guys at Miami-Dade office over the phone, because I'm not trusting internet forums to keep me out of jail. Basically I sat there with the Florida and Miami laws and went over it, and the first guy told me the 3 steps thing, when I started asking hard questions he bumped me up the line.

When I met one of my Friends Law School friends he could carry on campus (Private school) but had to go through a class with the school, and he told me this 4 step nonsense.

Which is funny because Mississippi, Alabama and Louisiana could give a _____.

Sorry too much talk about gun laws.

I found a good pdf editor  pdf995

[BumblingBear]

Florida has silly concealed carry laws while in a vehicle.
Example, in Texas, I can wear it in my waistband, get in the car, get pulled over, give the officer CHL and Drivers ID, get a ticket go on my way, and he might not even ask me about the gun.

Florida, the gun has to be in case or a holster with a strap of some kind of it, in the glove box or in the trunk.
So not on your person/under the seat.
Somehow this 3-4 steps nonsense got started in the PD there/ Concealed Carry Classes that there must be 3-4 steps between you and the gun. Which is nonsense.

In FL is that including if you have a CHL - you can't keep it on your person in the car?

I'd always heard that Florida is very pro-CC....

My two licences are in GA and WV.  Luckily I have reciprocity in TX so I don't have to get one here.

In WV, you can legally carry while drinking at the bar.  However, you cannot have any loaded weapons in your vehicle except for a CC pistol with a license.  Wild, huh?

There were also no laws against CC in colleges.  I carried every day while I went to school there.  It was against school regs, but if they caught me (IE if someone went on a rampage and I shot them) they could expell me, but I highly doubt they would have.

Each state is wildly different with weapons regs.  It's kind of a headach.

I have two best friends who are beat cops.  Their federal concealed carry laws kind of suck too, because any state they go to they have to carry abiding by the laws from their home state AND the laws in the state they are in.  They also cannot carry anything but a weapon they have been certified with and qualified with at work.  The advantage is that they don't have to pay money or time to get a CCL.

[Ren]

Something that looks official-ish is just fine.

I'm going to re-send out my phone number for everyone via email in a bit as we have yet to establish where we are going to be gaming and I know you have that test tomorrow Z so if you haven't heard from anyone by Sunday give me a call and I'll let you know what's up.

[fantazero]

In FL is that including if you have a CHL - you can't keep it on your person in the car?

I'd always heard that Florida is very pro-CC....

My two licences are in GA and WV.  Luckily I have reciprocity in TX so I don't have to get one here.

In WV, you can legally carry while drinking at the bar.  However, you cannot have any loaded weapons in your vehicle except for a CC pistol with a license.  Wild, huh?

There were also no laws against CC in colleges.  I carried every day while I went to school there.  It was against school regs, but if they caught me (IE if someone went on a rampage and I shot them) they could expell me, but I highly doubt they would have.

Each state is wildly different with weapons regs.  It's kind of a headach.

I have two best friends who are beat cops.  Their federal concealed carry laws kind of suck too, because any state they go to they have to carry abiding by the laws from their home state AND the laws in the state they are in.  They also cannot carry anything but a weapon they have been certified with and qualified with at work.  The advantage is that they don't have to pay money or time to get a CCL.

Yeah Florida, with or without the license, you cant have the gun on you while in car (I dont know the "logic" to this)
You can drink in a bar in Texas (As long as the bar doesnt have a LEGAL 30.06 sign (heh) or a 51% sign) but it's illegal to be DRUNK while carrying (Though there is no legal limit like while driving in Texas.) so basically dont drink more than 1 beer, or even look at a Trudys Mexican Martini (mmmm)

k-12 there are Federal Laws against carrying (under the guise that it somehow effects interstate commerce) but Public Colleges in Texas it's illegal under state law. Since Perry won the election lets hope Governor Good Hair does what he promised the NRA (i'm a member) that he would do away with that law (I know, I know, he doesnt write the laws, but you know what I mean)  

Florida is pro-gun, the City of Miami and Orlando have a slanting population that votes a certain way, and many of them are former residents of New York, New Jersey, and Massachusetts. Unfortally Miami and Orlando have more people and money than the rest of the state and tend to get their way.
But there's a saying I heard in my CHL class "concealed means concealed". Did I have a gun on me today? Did you see one? You'll never know (or I hope you never have to find out)

[Ren]

Now we haz a maps, so Game On!

[BumblingBear]

Now we haz a maps, so Game On!

Indeed!

We got off on kind of a rabbit trail in discussion the last few days, but I suggest we try to bring it back on topic in this thread.

I already mentioned it via email, but does anyone have any questions/comments/concerns about adding aspects to the other people's stories that we assigned?

I know that I have had a few problems, but luckily both of the characters I have connections with were pretty well defined.  I bet folks who got PCs who were just an idea last Sunday may be having problems... or not.  I don't know.

Anyway, that is the part tomorrow that I see may take a while and that people may not have done yet.  Just a thought.

[fantazero]

Indeed!

We got off on kind of a rabbit trail in discussion the last few days, but I suggest we try to bring it back on topic in this thread.

I already mentioned it via email, but does anyone have any questions/comments/concerns about adding aspects to the other people's stories that we assigned?

I know that I have had a few problems, but luckily both of the characters I have connections with were pretty well defined.  I bet folks who got PCs who were just an idea last Sunday may be having problems... or not.  I don't know.

Anyway, that is the part tomorrow that I see may take a while and that people may not have done yet.  Just a thought.

Basically yes to everything you said

[BumblingBear]

Basically yes to everything you said

What two characters did your character have ties to?  Perhaps I could throw a few suggestions out there.

I'm just doing school right now for the next hour or so.  After that I will be finalizing my Miami stuff... so I will be available.

[fantazero]

What two characters did your character have ties to?  Perhaps I could throw a few suggestions out there.

I'm just doing school right now for the next hour or so.  After that I will be finalizing my Miami stuff... so I will be available.

Um...
I believe Steve the Non-Wizard
The Lady with the Limo
and Z's FBI guy

Can you get PDFs? I have a kinda completed character sheet typed out (Or atleast the stuff I understand is completed...kinda) I could email it to you

I just dont want to be "That guy" who drags everyone else down with them or stalls the game too much.