Author Topic: Custom Power List  (Read 216309 times)

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #825 on: September 04, 2013, 04:58:39 AM »
Okay, but I don't see why that would affect the cost. Either way, you get the same benefit: ignoring physical obstacles.

Offline cowardlylion

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #826 on: September 04, 2013, 08:36:27 AM »
And how would that work, exactly?

Anyway, here's the revision. It's not really any different from what you wrote, it's just reformatted and clarified.

POWER NULLIFICATION [-varies]
Description: You have the ability to deny your enemies access to their magical powers.
Musts: You must decide what the base Refresh cost of this Power is before any upgrades.
Skills Affected: Discipline
Effects:
Power Nullification. As an action, you may attempt to nullify the Powers on any character in your zone. Make an opposed Discipline roll; if you win, your target must choose Powers of theirs with a total Refresh cost equal to the base Refresh cost of this Power. Those Powers stop working for the rest of the scene.
Diminishing Returns. If you use this Power multiple times against a single character in the same scene, they get a +1 bonus to their second defence roll and a +2 bonus to their third and so on.
At Range [-1]. You may use this Power against any character within your line of sight.
Area Effect [-2]. You may target an entire zone with this Power, draining the Powers of everyone in the zone except yourself. If you have the At Range upgrade you can target any zone in your line of sight, if not you must target your own zone.

Three more questions.

1. How does this interact with rebate Powers like The Catch? If you have Supernatural Toughness with a Catch of cold iron, does ditching Supernatural Toughness count as losing 4 Refresh or 1?
2. How does this work on someone who can't lose the specified amount of Powers? If you have Mythic Strength and no other Powers, what happens when I drain 3 Refresh of Powers from you?
3. What happens on a tied roll?

1. Probably 1 given that's how much refresh they spent on the power.
2. They end up with Inhuman Strength in this case probably with a bonus fate point (equivalent to a point of temporary power)
3. A tied roll is DFRPG counts as a win for the attacker doesn't it ? so the power would come into effect.   

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #827 on: October 28, 2013, 05:02:32 AM »
Some Powers from the Worm thread. As always, feedback wanted.

TANK [-1]
Description: You shield your allies with your body. Obviously, this makes you a good friend to have.
Skills Affected: Endurance.
Effects:
Tank. Whenever a character in your zone would take physical stress, you may take that stress on their behalf. You take the same amount of stress that they would have taken, except you use your own armour in place of theirs. Stress taken this way bypasses Toughness Powers, including Recovery and Immunity.
Toughness Surcharge [-varies]. Normally, Toughness Powers don't apply to stress that you take with this Power. But by spending some Refresh, you can get around that. Using this Power with up to 2 Refresh of Toughness costs 1 extra Refresh, using it with up to 8 Refresh of Toughness costs 2 extra Refresh, and using it with up to 14 Refresh of Toughness costs 3 extra Refresh. Using it with more Toughness than that costs 4 extra Refresh. Include the value of any relevant Catch or Limitation when determining how large this surcharge should be, unless the Limitation in question also applies to this Power.
Aura Of Protection [-1]. You may use this Power to take hits for anyone within two zones.

ALL CREATURES ARE EQUAL BEFORE ME [-8]
Description: It doesn't matter how tough they are. You can kill them.
Skills Affected: Fists, Weapons, Guns, Might.
Effects:
All Creatures Are Equal Before Me. Your physical attacks ignore all armour and all defensive Powers.
(And Objects) [-1]. When defending against your attacks, all objects have an effective quality rating of 0. Similarly, the difficulty for you to break through any given object or substance is 0.

PROJECTION [-2]
Description: You can create a second body out of nothing and control it like a puppet.
Skills Affected: All.
Effects:
Projection. As a full action, you may create a projection in your zone. A projection is a second body that may move away from your main body. Your projection shares your skills and Stunts and Powers, but doesn't necessarily have to look like you. It does have to have a consistent appearance unless it can shapeshift, but that appearance can be just about anything. Your projection must stay within a mile of your main body or it dissolves. You can dissolve it intentionally as a supplemental action. You can only can have one projection at a time.
Multiple Actions. Each of your bodies can act once each exchange. When taking multiple actions in a single exchange, you must divide up your shifts as if making a spray attack. If the actions would use different skill totals, use the lowest one for the combined action.
Destroyable Projection. Your projection has its own physical stress track, but you share mental and social stress tracks as well as consequence slots. Stress inflicted to your projection lingers even if you dismiss the projection, though it clears at the end of the scene as normal. If your projection is taken out, you can't re-create it for the rest of the day.
Multiple Projections [-1]. You can have up to 6 projections. One action suffices to create them all. They all share a single physical stress track.
Skilled Projection [-1]. You and your projection(s) have different skills. Draw up a projection skill pyramid using the same number of points as your regular pyramid, in accordance with your skill cap. Your projection(s) must have the same rating as you in Contacts, Resources, Conviction, Discipline, Lore, and Scholarship, but apart from that you can assign its skills freely. If you want your projection(s) to have Stunts/Powers you don't or vice versa, use Limitation.

Offline vultur

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #828 on: November 08, 2013, 06:05:44 AM »
OK, I was reading the Worm thread to find these powers, but I guess I'll comment on them here.

Is  All Creatures... intended to ignore the extra stress boxes from Size powers?

How did you determine its cost? Assuming that a Sword of the Cross wielder would spend 4 fate points/session on their version?

I kind of think Tank shouldn't be able to apply Immunity even with the surcharge. (Well, actually it's fine with "against only one thing" immunities, but Nicodemus could get this power and create an invulnerable team of Denarians.)

Why can't your Projection have a lower Contacts or Resources rating than yours? I understand not higher, but if I create a projection that is a giant bear or something, it might not really be something I use to talk to people or buy things... especially if it isn't publicly known that the giant bear is 'me'.

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #829 on: November 08, 2013, 06:48:14 AM »
Is  All Creatures... intended to ignore the extra stress boxes from Size powers?

If the Sword does, then it does.

I'd probably say it doesn't, if I had to rule one way or the other.

How did you determine its cost? Assuming that a Sword of the Cross wielder would spend 4 fate points/session on their version?

I figured that it would probably be useful about half a dozen times per session on average. Which would give a final cost of 9-10 Refresh, depending on how the Sword's cost breaks down. But using it on everyone is suboptimal and Powers tend to get more efficient as they get more expensive, so I reduced the cost a bit.

I dunno, does it seem off to you? If so, in which direction?

I kind of think Tank shouldn't be able to apply Immunity even with the surcharge. (Well, actually it's fine with "against only one thing" immunities, but Nicodemus could get this power and create an invulnerable team of Denarians.)

If it can't apply Immunity, it's worthless. Applying Immunity is the entire reason for the Power's existence. So I'm not changing that.

And if "you are invincible" is a fair thing to buy with Refresh, why isn't "you and any friend of yours who stands close enough are invincible"?

Could increase the surcharge, though.

Why can't your Projection have a lower Contacts or Resources rating than yours? I understand not higher, but if I create a projection that is a giant bear or something, it might not really be something I use to talk to people or buy things... especially if it isn't publicly known that the giant bear is 'me'.

You still have the money and the connections while projecting your bear. So what exactly does it mean for the bear's Contacts/Resources to be lower than yours? That you have to perform your conversations/transactions with your main body rather than your bear? Is that meaningful?

If my Resources is sufficient to already own a speedboat, does my bear also own a speedboat? If my Contacts is sufficient to know who Six-Handed Jack is, does my bear know? If no, how does that even work? If yes, then is my bear's skill actually meaningfully lower?

Basically I added those skills to the list because it seemed like a headache for them to be different across bodies.

Offline vultur

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #830 on: November 09, 2013, 07:02:17 AM »
I dunno, does it seem off to you? If so, in which direction?

It almost seemed a bit high at first glance, but yeah, in terms of the fate-point cost of using ACAEBG on everything it makes sense.

Although I guess it's really dependent on how common outright Immunity is. For 6 Refresh, Mythic Strength adds +6 stress and does lots of other things too... so you can often overpower Toughness just by doing more damage. And the guy with Incite Emotion (Lasting, Potent, At Range) is ignoring Toughness anyway.

Don't know what's right... just offering thoughts.

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If it can't apply Immunity, it's worthless.

I wouldn't say having the tank with Toughness/Recovery/Superb Endurance take hits for the wizard or social guy with bad Endurance and no Toughness powers is worthless.

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Applying Immunity is the entire reason for the Power's existence. So I'm not changing that. And if "you are invincible" is a fair thing to buy with Refresh, why isn't "you and any friend of yours who stands close enough are invincible"?

That's fair.

Quote
Could increase the surcharge, though.

Yeah... I think that given you can defend multiple friends with Immunity and at a two-zone range for 5-6 Refresh, cheaper than it would be for any one of those friends to get the Immunity power themselves...

Quote
You still have the money and the connections while projecting your bear. So what exactly does it mean for the bear's Contacts/Resources to be lower than yours? That you have to perform your conversations/transactions with your main body rather than your bear? Is that meaningful?

It is if you're hiding your real body behind wards and using your projection to actually do stuff.

Quote
If my Contacts is sufficient to know who Six-Handed Jack is, does my bear know? If no, how does that even work? If yes, then is my bear's skill actually meaningfully lower?

I was thinking in terms of using Contacts to spread rumors and stuff, or getting in to talk to important people; if it's not publicly known that your projection is 'you', or among non-clued-in people, your projection may not have access to the same people that you do (even if it looks human).

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #831 on: November 09, 2013, 08:46:57 PM »
Although I guess it's really dependent on how common outright Immunity is. For 6 Refresh, Mythic Strength adds +6 stress and does lots of other things too... so you can often overpower Toughness just by doing more damage. And the guy with Incite Emotion (Lasting, Potent, At Range) is ignoring Toughness anyway.

Don't know what's right... just offering thoughts.

If you don't know what's right, I'll take that as a good sign. Means I'm not clearly wrong in any particular direction.

I wouldn't say having the tank with Toughness/Recovery/Superb Endurance take hits for the wizard or social guy with bad Endurance and no Toughness powers is worthless.

Sorry, I was unclear. I meant worthless to me, not worthless to the people taking it.

I wrote that Power to model the invulnerability-sharing power of the Siberian. If it can't do that, then I have no actual use for the Power.

Yeah... I think that given you can defend multiple friends with Immunity and at a two-zone range for 5-6 Refresh, cheaper than it would be for any one of those friends to get the Immunity power themselves...

Yeah, you're right.

How much do you think it should cost?

It is if you're hiding your real body behind wards and using your projection to actually do stuff.

...

I was thinking in terms of using Contacts to spread rumors and stuff, or getting in to talk to important people; if it's not publicly known that your projection is 'you', or among non-clued-in people, your projection may not have access to the same people that you do (even if it looks human).

Eh, I guess you could kind of justify a difference in skill between body and projection. But it still seems like a source of headaches, and I don't really want to make the upgrade stronger, so I think I'd rather leave it as-is. Compels can paper over problems like they always do.

Offline vultur

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #832 on: November 10, 2013, 04:14:34 PM »
Sorry, I was unclear. I meant worthless to me, not worthless to the people taking it.

I wrote that Power to model the invulnerability-sharing power of the Siberian. If it can't do that, then I have no actual use for the Power.

Ah, OK.

Quote
Yeah, you're right.

How much do you think it should cost?

Well, my initial thought was a surcharge equal to the cost of the Toughness/Immunity powers, minus 1 (for the Tank power itself)?

You still get to apply it to multiple people (especially with the within-two-zones upgrade) so it still comes out cheaper in total (than having everybody buy it).

Though, actually, that's only really true with Immunity. For Toughness, it's better for everyone to have the power than for just one guy with it to take hits for everybody, since the one guy will accumulate stress faster.

So I think your given surcharges are good for non-Immunity Toughness powers. Immunity just needs an extra surcharge.

Quote
Eh, I guess you could kind of justify a difference in skill between body and projection. But it still seems like a source of headaches, and I don't really want to make the upgrade stronger, so I think I'd rather leave it as-is. Compels can paper over problems like they always do.

OK.

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #833 on: November 10, 2013, 11:06:35 PM »
Well, my initial thought was a surcharge equal to the cost of the Toughness/Immunity powers, minus 1 (for the Tank power itself)?

You still get to apply it to multiple people (especially with the within-two-zones upgrade) so it still comes out cheaper in total (than having everybody buy it).

Though, actually, that's only really true with Immunity. For Toughness, it's better for everyone to have the power than for just one guy with it to take hits for everybody, since the one guy will accumulate stress faster.

So I think your given surcharges are good for non-Immunity Toughness powers. Immunity just needs an extra surcharge.

I agree, but...I'm not sure how big the surcharge should be.

The Siberian has the full 30 Refresh screw-you Immunity Power. How much should it cost them to share it with everyone in their zone?

Another hypothetical example...there's an angel which instantly heals wounds unless those wounds were inflicted with "unholy" or "cursed" weapons. How much should it cost for it to share that with everyone within two zones?

Offline Taran

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #834 on: November 11, 2013, 04:31:59 AM »
I don't think sharing the power should be automatic.  She had to touch them.  I think that should be written into the power.  In certain circumstances there should be some kind of test to see if someone with this power can get to an ally fast enough to protect them.  It might balance the power slightly.  Maybe she has to assign a target in advance to protect and failing that can roll a second defense for the ally who took damage.  If she defends, she absorbs the damage.

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #835 on: November 11, 2013, 06:14:48 AM »
Eh. I don't want to make the Power more complicated, and I'd like to keep the number of dice rolls to a minimum.

Have we ever seen the Siberian fail to protect someone who's near them? I can't remember that happening.

Offline narphoenix

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #836 on: November 11, 2013, 07:05:31 AM »
Eh. I don't want to make the Power more complicated, and I'd like to keep the number of dice rolls to a minimum.

Have we ever seen the Siberian fail to protect someone who's near them? I can't remember that happening.

Cherish when she jumped.
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Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #837 on: November 11, 2013, 10:20:06 PM »
I don't think Cherish actually gets hurt. I just re-read that part of Interlude 12...she just falls down and shrieks a little bit.

Unless I was looking at the wrong chapter, that is.

Offline Stirge

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #838 on: November 13, 2013, 07:24:05 PM »
Aura of Protection is probably too cheap for what it does when involved with Immunity.  At least with the Siberian, someone can perform a maneuver on them (jarring their contact with her) to be able to affect the target she's touching.

It's probably less thought out than Tank, but I think Siberian could use the Grant Powers ability I was working on.  I think it's a bit more thematically close to what she does in the story:

(click to show/hide)

In this case, she'd have Grant Powers ([-2] Base, Share Powers II (to 5 People, story-wise this is spot on) [-2], Refinement XIII [-13, for 30 points worth of powers], Limitation: Must be in constant contact [+8 depending for how debilitating this is]) for a total of -9 for the power.  She might also need an upgrade to make the power automatic (as a free action) as that seems to be how it is in the story.

That said, Grant Powers probably needs to be looked at and balanced still, but I feel like this might be the best way to go towards emulating Siberian's powers.

(click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: November 13, 2013, 08:00:05 PM by Stirge »

Offline ways and means

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Re: Custom Power List
« Reply #839 on: November 13, 2013, 09:22:04 PM »
Which reminds me had an Idea for a Power that would need some real balancing to work.

Amp (-X): You have the power to amplify the powers of one your touching as an action, add X amount of refresh worth of powers that can only be spend on power upgrades, these powers last for a scene and can only be granted to one person at a time.

Upgrades
Device Amplify: [-2] You can amplify the power of objects, for example you could amplify the power of a gun (giving it strength powers based extra damage and force to shooting) or the Speed of a Vehicle (speed powers boost to driving as athletics).

This certainly isn't a currently balanced set of power but is there any way this could work?       
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