When can a rote spell change?

[Papa Gruff]

The above question.

There are no rules for it, only the one that the wizard has to use his spell regularly to make it qualify for a rote spell. But what if the wizard is at his maximum of rotes, effectively the level of his lore skill? More specific: what if the player of a wizard would like to change his rote? Does he has to up his lore skill to gain an other rote slot? Does it suffice for him to not use one rote spell for a given amount of time? If yes how long? Should the possibility of changing rotes simply be part of a major milestone?

I'm looking for opinions here and would be glad of some input.

[CMEast]

I would simply allow a player to change their rotes at a milestone as long as they have cast their new rote at least a couple of times in the previous sessions. I wouldn't put too many limits on rote changing as it's just not fun, as long as it doesn't spoil the rules for spellcasting by allowing them to never have to roll for control.

[Morgan]

I'd say that a Minor Milestone is enough of a change to let you either tweak or change a Rote Spell.

[ironchicken]

I would suggest it counts as an option at the end of an adventure instead of an aspect change.

[Papa Gruff]

I don't know. I see rotes as something pretty static. Something that is kind of a trademark feature of a wizard. This is of cause primarily directed by the canon and is not necessarily good for the game or the fun playing it.

That said, I'm not totally against changing rote spells, especially if the player is not happy with them and doesn't use them very often. I just feel that it should be a pretty big thing to change a rote, as it rarely ever happens in the books. Apparently wizards are even more creatures of habit then all other people are.

I'm not a big fan of house rules in this system as I feel that they can easily upset what I view as an exceptionally well balanced game. The rules don't speak of rote changing ...  

[Morgan]

Well one thing to consider is that as a Wizard grows in power by hitting Milestones his old rote spells can start to look a little wimpy, maybe let them tweak the rote spell's numbers when their powers and abilities have increased due to a Milestone. I'm sure Harry's Fuego spell has undergone quite a bit of refinement over the years.

Also with starting characters maybe folks don't know the system well enough to create the rote spell they want or find the one they did create isn't what they wanted or it isn't getting used. Allowing them to change their rote spells at a Milestone or just let them change it if it's not working for them makes the most sense to me.

[Papa Gruff]

Also with starting characters maybe folks don't know the system well enough to create the rote spell they want or find the one they did create isn't what they wanted or it isn't getting used. Allowing them to change their rote spells at a Milestone or just let them change it if it's not working for them makes the most sense to me.

That is the primary reason for me why rotes should be allowed to change. It's probably best to just allow it within reason like most of you guys said so far.

Curious for more opinions though...

[Dumbledresden]

I would like to compare it with the possibility of a spellcaster to reconfigure his focus and enchanted items.
Both takes some time to adjust, train or create, so i would say the spellcaster gets the possibility to either change his rotes during a significant milestone OR reconfigure his focus and enchanted items.

[Papa Gruff]

I would like to compare it with the possibility of a spellcaster to reconfigure his focus and enchanted items.
Both takes some time to adjust, train or create, so i would say the spellcaster gets the possibility to either change his rotes during a significant milestone OR reconfigure his focus and enchanted items.

That's quite reasonable. Thanks buddy. I'll guess we'll do it that way in our game.

[Nomad]

I think it depends on the change. If the spell stays the same (same props, same effect, same trigger) but just becomes bigger due to power or control increase, then I would let the rote upgraded to v2.0, 1 session immidiately after the milestone or if some significant game time like a month or two passes between last trouble and the newest, then I can accept that with the milestone.

If the spell's props are changing (no not for my wand got burned so I crafted a new one, for "I used to cast this with my staff, now Ill cast it with my new wand") then it should take longer. Depending on the amount of use, 2 sessions or 3 of playtime (or about 6 months to a year of downtime between troubles) probably.

Lastly, as others noted, despite all the experience the player has (or the lack of it) new characters are always need adjustments so I think the end of Trouble 1 (Or even during it if the player is new to system or rpgs in general) is a good time to let players re-configure their characters if they feel like it without too much strings attached. Afterall they had their first life changing experience and etc .


Fun Games to you all.

[TheMouse]

I'm going to agree with the notion that it sort of depends on the change.

If a character's abilities should change so as to increase his spell casting power, and if the upgrade is nothing more than increasing the stats of the rote to keep up with the increased spell casting ability, the rote should upgrade pretty much instantly. I mean, you're not changing the tools used, the nature of the spell, or even much about the narrative impact (other than power). I see this sort of thing as a natural change the reflects an increase in power.

On the other end of the spectrum, there's totally changing one's rotes. This type of thing should be pretty infrequent. It should generally only happen when something big happens, something like an Aspect change, especially a High Concept Aspect change.

[Papa Gruff]

That rotes gain in power together with the wizard is not the question here. That's pretty obvious, as rotes always generate base shifts equal to the wizards conviction level.

The question was: when can a rote spell change completely? Say you have lore at good and have an attack rote, a shielding rote and a maneuver rote and then at some point you decide that you don't use the maneuver all that often and that you'd like a nice devastating zone attack rote instead. The question was how to merit this (although the example is really extreme).

The answer is ... as usual: Do what seems reasonable and what fits in your play. If you can live with it as a GM then give it to the player. It probably won't come up all that often anyways.